Replaced Tires.. Game changer..

ExplorerTom said:

I’ve found the exact opposite true with my old Michelin LTX MS2. Fantastic in the snow. Was like having snow tires that could also be run in July.

You probably DON’T want to look at Tire Rack’s user survey to back up that opinion of yours:
https://www.tirerack.com/tires/surveyresults/surveydisplay.jsp?type=HAS

Click to expand...

I don't need to back up my opinion; it's an opinion. That aside, while Tire Rack's survey is a great general guide and I use it all the time, I wouldn't use it as my primary basis for tire selection. The same tire will perform differently based on a number of factors such as the vehicle it's mounted on, the weather, tire pressure, proper balancing, the driver, etc. The list goes on and on. The same driver testing 5 different tires on the same vehicle under all the same conditions would provide a better comparison among those 5 tires.

Also, the aforementioned Defender and MS2 are not the same tire. There are quite a few people that have had both that swear the MS2 is considerably better. I don't know whether I would agree or not. I can only speak to my own experience between the Michelin Defenders and Pirellis I mentioned above. The Pirellis were far better in the snow than the Michelins. I often travel a gravel road on federal park lands in the winter that is not maintained. The Pirellis got me up/down that road dozens of times in deep snow with ease. The Michelins made it, but every time they had me wishing I had chains.

You are correct that the LTX MS2 and the Defender LTX MS are not the same tire. However, the Defender is virtually the same tire and in fact is the replacement for the LTX MS2.

The Tire Tack survey is an interesting tool. The Pirellis rank 23rd out of 43 with 13 million miles and the Defender ranks 4th with 12 million miles. That’s a lot of users chiming in with their experiences. And it appears that time after time the Pirellis appear to be mid-pack at best while the Michelins are at the top.

I was going to compare prices between the 2 but Tire Rack only lists 4 different sizes for the Pirelli. Four. It’s almost as if Tire Rack doesn’t want to be bothered by stocking such a mediocre tire. Either that or Pirelli knows that the tire is lackluster and are phasing it out.

ExplorerTom said:

You are correct that the LTX MS2 and the Defender LTX MS are not the same tire. However, the Defender is virtually the same tire and in fact is the replacement for the LTX MS2.

The Tire Tack survey is an interesting tool. The Pirellis rank 23rd out of 43 with 13 million miles and the Defender ranks 4th with 12 million miles. That’s a lot of users chiming in with their experiences. And it appears that time after time the Pirellis appear to be mid-pack at best while the Michelins are at the top.

I was going to compare prices between the 2 but Tire Rack only lists 4 different sizes for the Pirelli. Four. It’s almost as if Tire Rack doesn’t want to be bothered by stocking such a mediocre tire. Either that or Pirelli knows that the tire is lackluster and are phasing it out.

Click to expand...

Again, I don't know how the MS2 and Defender compare to each other. If you do a little research beyond the survey, however, you will find that many people claim the MS2 is a superior tire. True? Don't know. If it is true, why? Also, don't know. The fact that the older MS2 costs more than the Defender should tell you that it is at least perceived as a better tire by the market.

I agree 100% that the Defender is a better tire than than the Scorpion STR in almost every regard and as I very clearly stated above, my intention is to go with the Michelins again. In my experience (on my truck, on the roads I drive, etc), however, I found the Pirellis to outperform them in the snow. I'm done with this now as I have stated everything very clearly and it is quite clear that you are doing what you often do - arguing simply because it was me that posted it.

MICHELIN LTX M/S2 REVIEW
Not to be confused with the Defender LTX M/S, the Michelin LTX M/S2 builds upon the LTX MS and improves upon an already great tire.

PROS

• Long life
• Great warranty
• Wet performance

CONS

• A touch pricey (but worth i

The LTX M/S2 is a great all-season tire for light trucks, SUVs and crossovers.

An improvement over the original LTX M/S, one of the big areas of improvement is in all weather capability. The new tread design actually allows for 8 percent more “biting” edges, helping improve overall traction. The tires do perform better in the snow, although we’d stop short of saying they’re an ideal winter tire.

Similarly, they’re above decent off-road, but please remember that these are highway all-seasons, not all-terrain tires are aren’t meant for off-road duty. That said, they’ll do in light off-roading in a pinch.

On road, they are perhaps most impressive in the wet, with zig-zag sipes that allow for more surface area of the treat to touch the ground, while the MaxTouch design of the tread makes for more overall contact area.

We’re really impressed by just how long these tires hold up. A 70,000 mile treadwear warranty means you won’t be replacing tires for a very long time. In fact, that warranty is as much as 20,000 miles more than some competitive offerings.

Value tires don’t have to be dirt cheap brands from China. These are value tires. And we mean that in the sense that while they aren’t cheap (nor are they expensive, to be fair) they are fantastic for the money.

The LTX is a true example of Michelin’s dominance in the tire industry. It’s quiet, with solid handling in almost all weather and the tires just last and last. We love this tire and consumers do too. Pretty much every consumer review is glowing and this rates as one of Michelin’s most praised tires… and that’s saying a lot!


MICHELIN LTX M/S2 WARRANTY
The Michelin LTX M/S2 is backed by a 6-year or 70,000 mile limited treadwear warranty on T, H and S rated tires. Tires with an R speed rating come with a 50,000 mile warranty. Plus, all Michelin tires come backed by a Standard Manufacturer’s Limited Warranty, covering defects in materials and workmanship for the life of the tread or from six years from purchase (whichever comes first).

MICHELIN LTX M/S2 PRICE
LTX M/S2 tires start at roughly $155 and top out around $250.


MICHELIN LTX M/S2 SIZES
15-inch sizes

P235/75R15 108T XL W

16-inch sizes

LT215/85R16E1 115R B
P225/70R16 101T ORWL
P235/70R16 104T ORWL
P235/75R16 109T XL W
LT235/85R16E1 120R B
LT235/85R16E1 120R W
P245/70R16 106T ORWL
P245/75R16 109T ORWL
LT245/75R16E1 120R W
P255/65R16 106T BSW
P255/70R16 109T ORWL
P265/70R16 111T ORWL
P265/75R16 114T ORWL
LT265/75R16E1 123R W
LT265/75R16E1 123R B
LT285/75R16E1 126R W

17-inch sizes

P235/70R17 108T XL B
P235/75R17 108T BSW
LT235/80R17E1 120R W
LT235/80R17E1CHV120R
P245/70R17 108T ORWL
LT245/70R17E1 119R B
LT245/75R17E1 121R B
P255/65R17 108T ORWL
P255/70R17 110T ORWL
P265/65R17 110T ORWL
LT265/70R17E1 121R W
P265/70R17 113T ORWL
LT265/70R17E1 121R B
LT285/70R17D1 121R W

18-inch sizes

P265/60R18 109T ORWL
P265/65R18 112T BSW
P265/70R18 114T ORWL
LT275/65R18E1 123R W
P275/65R18 114T ORWL
LT275/70R18E1 125R W

20-inch sizes

P275/55R20 111T BSW
P275/60R20 114T BSW

07navi said:

Differences

Michelin LTX A/T2 vs. Defender LTX M/S – November 2020 Comparison (autonerdsreview.com)

Click to expand...

Almost a relevant article. This compares the all terrain tire with the highway all season tire. Not the LTX MS2 with the Defender LTX MS.

ExplorerTom said:

Almost a relevant article. This compares the all terrain tire with the highway all season tire. Not the LTX MS2 with the Defender LTX MS.

Click to expand...

Well I own both. And they're both awesome. So there everybody

If you have 18” wheels you need the LTX MS/2, if you have 20” wheels you need LTX MS Defender at least when I replaced my tires last year. They are different tires for the different wheels.

Michelin Defender LTX M/S Tire Review & Rating
Last modified Jun. 16, 2020 by Tire Reviews And More
5
Replacing a top performing tire like the LTX M/S2 is not an easy task for anyone, but that is exactly what the new 2015 Michelin Defender LTX M/S has been designed to do. Built for full-size pickups and SUV’s, the Defender LTX combines the best traits of the original passenger car Defender with the same tread design and tread depth of the truck/SUV LTX M/S2.An all-season tread compound utilizes Michelin’s Evertread technology that is created to resist wear and tear under tough road conditions, as well as perform well under heavier payloads. The company states that this new tread will last up to 10% longer than the original LTX M/S2, which is pretty impressive on its own. Looking at the test results you can clearly see the new Defender LTX does in fact handle heavier loads and last longer than several of the better tires in this class.




The biggest plus with this new model is where the rubber meets the road. Traction on dry, wet or snow covered road surfaces is among the best tires available today, and we do not say that lightly. In fact Michelin had third party testing done to prove the point. The Defender LTX stops shorter on wet pavement and tracts through the snow better than similar tires like the Goodyear Wrangler SR-A, Yokohama YK-HTX, Firestone LE2 among others.

The tread features four wide circumferential grooves and full-depth sipes that add to the grip in rain and snow. While traction and toughness are impressive, this model also delivers a smoother and quieter ride than you might expect. There isn’t the tread pattern noise you often find on uneven or grooved pavement. We would say that ride comfort exceeds that of the older M/S2.

Inside the tire you will find Michelin’s MaxTouch Construction that is designed to more evenly distribute the forces of acceleration, braking, and cornering for increased rolling resistance and an overall longer tread life. The Defender LTX M/S is available with either a BSW or OWL depending on the size. The tread is warranted for up to 70K miles depending on the speed rating.

Michelin is releasing 45 sizes through 2015 and another 26 sizes by the middle of 2016. Tires are available in a range of 15-22 inch sizes with T or H-speed ratings, and LT models feature an E load range rating.

Pros

• All-season traction including snow
• Tough tread compound
• Treadlife
• Value for the money

Cons

• Not a low cost tire

Overall Thoughts

There’s not a lot we can add to say how impressive this new Defender LTX M/S performs on the street. The engineers at Michelin have managed to take the best of two unique tires and combine them into a model that provides excellent year-round traction, braking and handling, as well as a comfortable ride and longer treadwear.

Overall, the Defender LTX M/S simply does not disappoint in its performance. We rank it as one of the top tires in the truck/SUV all-season category and highly recommend it.

I'm on my second set (at 90k miles) of the Hankook Dynapro AT-M. I should have about 20k more miles on them. When I bought the truck (in Canada) the dealer put the first set on, the factory stock tires were worn after about 6 k miles - the truck was used as a demo / dealer exec. I spent a year or so in Canada with them, they were great in snow and rain, then moved to Los Angeles / Texas, they still work very well on and off road.

My tire guy priced me out the Hankook Dynpro's and they were about $200.00 cheaper.