Bad Cam Phasers - Causing CEL and Surging?

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Jettix2

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(Spinoff of my other repair thread here on this specific issue, since it's becoming a major repair.)

2018 Expedition Max Platinum, CPO purchased at 60k, now has 74k. Has Ford Ext Warranty until 140k. Was flashed for the ECU update to help prevent cam phaser rattle at 62/63k.

It's at the dealer for a bunch of other repairs right now, but I complained about a rattle at idle (which is actually the wastegate linkages, I believe), coolant consumption (they can't find anything yet), and a bad driveability/surge/uneven acceleration.

They called back and said it needs cam phasers replaced under warranty, need to reschedule to repair.

Also, "1 turbo leaking oil, will replace under warranty along with a leaking valve-cover gasket"

Also, CEL came on yesterday while they were driving it and codes came back "related to the cam timing issue". (we've never had a CEL on this car)

So, what do y'all make of that? I'm honestly nervous to have major engine work done on a new car that we just spent $60k on, even with 4 more years on my Extended Ford Warranty, what are the chances that this cam phaser repair will be a permanent fix (it sounds like they finally are using updated parts on this repair)? IS the CEL "for related cam timing" a plausible thing? Would these issues above actually cause the surging/uneven acceleration or is it just wishful thinking? I still need to nail down the coolant consumption issue... and I guess, more than anything, I need to regain my confidence that I can take this vehicle on a 20-hour non-stop drive to Florida next winter without having issues

Thanks.......
 

TheDoug

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If there is a surging issue after the ecu flash they are supposed to flash it back to the original programming. There is a TSB for both, I forget the numbers but they are mentioned on this site.
 

3rd Expyowner123

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My 2018 developed a slow coolant leak, I could not find any leaks, checked engine oil, it was fine. Dealer diagnosed water pump needed replaced. It was dripping only when running.
 

Gumby

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My 2018 developed a slow coolant leak, I could not find any leaks, checked engine oil, it was fine. Dealer diagnosed water pump needed replaced. It was dripping only when running.
Same for mine due to being pressurized. When they had the engine cracked open for the waterpump, I coughed for the parts on the cam phasers (that would have been job #2 of 3 times it was changed). Thankfully I did, because they failed again last month and it was replaced under the parts warranty. But soon after (like the next day) the repair was completed I got a CEL and it was attributed to a failed catalytic converter on bank 2. Another $1200...either crap luck or they did something to it...IDK.
 
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Jettix2

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Picked up tonight from dealer to drive for 2 weeks while they get parts And can work into schedule.

Horrendously loud clatter when my wife started it (it probably hasn’t been started since Friday afternoon?) that actually startled my wife. The kids sitting in my deleted Cummins Ram (ie, not a quiet vehicle) could hear it loud and clear. Man, that sounds SOOOoo bad for the engine. Yay.
 

Bmanxx13

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(Spinoff of my other repair thread here on this specific issue, since it's becoming a major repair.)

2018 Expedition Max Platinum, CPO purchased at 60k, now has 74k. Has Ford Ext Warranty until 140k. Was flashed for the ECU update to help prevent cam phaser rattle at 62/63k.

It's at the dealer for a bunch of other repairs right now, but I complained about a rattle at idle (which is actually the wastegate linkages, I believe), coolant consumption (they can't find anything yet), and a bad driveability/surge/uneven acceleration.

They called back and said it needs cam phasers replaced under warranty, need to reschedule to repair.

Also, "1 turbo leaking oil, will replace under warranty along with a leaking valve-cover gasket"

Also, CEL came on yesterday while they were driving it and codes came back "related to the cam timing issue". (we've never had a CEL on this car)

So, what do y'all make of that? I'm honestly nervous to have major engine work done on a new car that we just spent $60k on, even with 4 more years on my Extended Ford Warranty, what are the chances that this cam phaser repair will be a permanent fix (it sounds like they finally are using updated parts on this repair)? IS the CEL "for related cam timing" a plausible thing? Would these issues above actually cause the surging/uneven acceleration or is it just wishful thinking? I still need to nail down the coolant consumption issue... and I guess, more than anything, I need to regain my confidence that I can take this vehicle on a 20-hour non-stop drive to Florida next winter without having issues

Thanks.......

I had a coolant leak fixed recently. Ford replaced my thermostat housing, water pump, and heater hose.
 

3rd Expyowner123

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Same for mine due to being pressurized. When they had the engine cracked open for the waterpump, I coughed for the parts on the cam phasers (that would have been job #2 of 3 times it was changed). Thankfully I did, because they failed again last month and it was replaced under the parts warranty. But soon after (like the next day) the repair was completed I got a CEL and it was attributed to a failed catalytic converter on bank 2. Another $1200...either crap luck or they did something to it...IDK.
Talk about bad luck, not fun…
 

3rd Expyowner123

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I had a coolant leak fixed recently. Ford replaced my thermostat housing, water pump, and heater hose.
I think others have had CEL due to cam phasers, while not common. Just read a thread of someone who got CEL right after doing cam phasers, that resulted in replacing cat converter.
I would like to think your truck will be reliable after getting all these repairs completed. Obviously hopefully it will be reliable for the next several months, adding confidence.
 

Gumby

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I think others have had CEL due to cam phasers, while not common. Just read a thread of someone who got CEL right after doing cam phasers, that resulted in replacing cat converter.
I would like to think your truck will be reliable after getting all these repairs completed. Obviously hopefully it will be reliable for the next several months, adding confidence.
That would be me! Was it related? Who knows, but one thing for sure, the timing was almost too impeccable for it not to be related.
 

19FX4Max

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That would be me! Was it related? Who knows, but one thing for sure, the timing was almost too impeccable for it not to be related.
We started having poor acceleration that was diagnosed as transmission issues soon after the phasers were replaced. The first attempt at a fix was to replace the valve body and within a week the alternator died. 2 days after picking it up a CEL came on for an issue with the evap system, so it went back to the dealer and they said it was a loose connection. A week later we began having hard shifting and stalling so it went back to the dealer and the transmission was mostly rebuilt. A CEL came on the day after picking it up which was for the catalytic converter and now our Expedition has been at the dealer for 4 weeks waiting on a back ordered cat.

That’s a lot of coincidences, I think if I’d have just dealt with the rattle at start up we would not have had these other issues. We currently have about 31k miles and we’ve only had the vehicle 2 weeks out of the past 2-3 months. If there are factory programming issues causing all of this then I don’t have high hopes of getting a reliable vehicle back unless a new flash takes care of it.

I’m curious if aftermarket tuning would help resolve anything but I’m not going to take that chance until the warranty is up, if we keep it that long.
 

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