Buy a New one or Fix the old one

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BillAlex

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Bought my 2005 off show room floor. My wife drove it first ten years until I started hauling some heavy duty stuff with it back and forth to California etc. Started towing a 32 foot cabin cruiser and various Travel Trailers. Last September, I took her over to have the oil changed and noticed we had 215,000 miles on the clock. Told my wife I think it was time to sell her. Silence. I saw a little tear in her eyes and she said basically "over my dead body". We were coming up on our 49th wedding anniversary and I couldn't decide which I would miss more; Her or the Expedition. So I brought home a 2018 for her to test drive and it sat in the drive way the entire week end. Now what? I knew the old one was going to give up the ghost (the expedition, not her). So I had a decision to make.

So I started a frantic search to look far and wide and come up with a low mileage 2005 and rebuild her from the ground up. Found this one at a charity auction and to my surprise, it was an exact duplicate of my wife's car. So I bought it for $2,500. Put a re-man Ford engine using OEM parts only. While it was out, I put in new radiator, new water pump, new power steering unit (includes pump), new OEM compressor and tensioners, New hoses, radiator and heater, new alternator, Power brake reservoir, of course all new OEM plugs plus I installed the coil packs and injectors. Put a new fuel rail in her. Put new brakes on her and calipers and thought what the hell, let's put the hubs with new bearing end. Engine was about $3,200 and I dropped another $2,000 just on additional replacement parts since everything was right there, out of the way and it would never be easier to install. Top of the line high amp battery. Radiator was out with a new one so we installed a new Condenser and compressor as well. All new pressure lines and by the time I finished the entire engine compartment, I had almost as much as the engine alone. If it had a bearing in it, it got replaced. Sort of pissed me off spending $50 for a OEM Ford radiator hose when I could have got one at Autozone for $20 bucks. Here's the deal. I am an old fart and didn't want to worry about a hole in a radiator hose on a trip to the Grand Canyon. I know what is under the hood and after market just didn't ring my bell.

Some wise and very talented (quite possibly moderators) were preaching "never spend more that what you could buy another one for". By this time, I getting real close to knocking on the door of $8,500. I was thinking about dropping a re-man transmission in her but that would put me over ten thousand and certainly over the so called "Kelly Blue Book". Here's the difference. Every time I get into this beast, I know what is under the hood. I know I could start her and drive it from Alaska to cape of South America and not bat an eye. I was getting ready to write a check for $70,000 for a 2018. So what's so bad about spending a little North of Ten grand and saving a marriage. Did anyone ever figure out what it would cost for a Divorce after almost Fifty years? Cheap by any stretch of the imagination. The engine has a 36,000 mile three year warranty, the transmission has a 50,000 five year warranty. Everything under the hood is new and Ford OEM. If it didn't have the blue Ford logo on it, it didn't come out of the box.

In 1969, the year we got married, I bought a Ford Mustang 428 Cobra Jet. Fire Engine red with a white interior. I paid Five grand for the car off the show room floor and it was special order. After a year, the family started coming and I sold it for $2,500. That was the dumbest thing I ever did in my life. There were only about 1,536 of these made and this one was built by a guy named Carol Shelby and he stuck a decal on it that said; GT500. Later of course, the car went up in value to over a hundred grand. That taught me a lot about antique cars. If it was a piece of crap the day it was built, fifty years later it will still be a piece of crap. If the minute you got behind the wheel, you knew you were driving something special, that was the beginning of a classic. I felt the same way when I got behind the wheel of a Expedition. Some cars are worth rebuilding and some cars are throw away. If you get a chance to rebuild your Expy and turn it back into show room condition, don't hesitate. There is no way you can spend what it would cost for a new one and properly done, you will have a new one. aConnieFord1.jpg aConnieFord4.jpg aConnieFord7.jpg aConnieFord13.jpg aConnieFord15.jpg aConnieFord1.jpg aConnieFord1.jpg aConnieFord4.jpg aConnieFord13.jpg aConnieFord15.jpg aConnieFord1.jpg aConnieFord4.jpg aConnieFord7.jpg aConnieFord13.jpg aConnieFord15.jpg
 

JExpedition07

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A vehicle is worth whatever it’s worth to you, doesn’t matter what bluebook says. Bluebook is a collective dealer tool to increase margins....funded and run by dealers. Kindly most consumers are relatively undeducated on maintenance and automotive upkeep. If you know what your doing a modern truck can go 300k.....people get bored and want a newer one. If you aren’t that guy/gal it makes more sense to buy a newer one so repairs don’t set you back. I maintain my 07’ with good oem parts and take care of it, but that requires learning and tools. Most people don’t believe it’s a 2007 when they hop inside and insist it’s only a few years old. It’s cheaper to keep them in good shape than take on a new truck payment.

Nothing wrong with buying new ones or vice versus. I’ll likely keep the Expedition even when I purchase another truck.
 

Adieu

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Well, it's not a GT500... but whatever gets you to your 50th anniversary with peace of mind and domestic tranquility, right?
 

cmiles97

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You made a great decision. Heck even you put another $10K into it over the next 4 years you are still $50,000 to the good.

You don't live in a snow belt area to have to worry about it rusting out. Fix or replace the worn parts as they go and you can put a million miles on one of those in southern climates.

Personally I get rid mine usually out of boredom, wanting something newer and use an expensive repalr or replacement as an excuse. In reality you would be financially further ahead keeping an older vehicle that you owe nothing on for a long time. The caveats are that you don't get into an accident and it's totaled as insurance will only pay market value or that the repairs become so expensive and never ending.

Good mechanical skills or a trusted mechanic and not living in the rust belt are a must for that to work.
 

TobyU

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You made a great decision. Heck even you put another $10K into it over the next 4 years you are still $50,000 to the good.

You don't live in a snow belt area to have to worry about it rusting out. Fix or replace the worn parts as they go and you can put a million miles on one of those in southern climates.

Personally I get rid mine usually out of boredom, wanting something newer and use an expensive repalr or replacement as an excuse. In reality you would be financially further ahead keeping an older vehicle that you owe nothing on for a long time. The caveats are that you don't get into an accident and it's totaled as insurance will only pay market value or that the repairs become so expensive and never ending.

Good mechanical skills or a trusted mechanic and not living in the rust belt are a must for that to work.


The insurance is a real concern if you put a lot into them.
When they are old enough you can get classic but rarely if you drive them everyday.
Many insurers will let you put a stated amount on an older nice car. That way even if a 2000 Exp is only worth 2500 top dollar by the book, you can put 12000 on it and they have to fis it or give you 12K.
Problem gets tricky if someone else hits you ad their company doesn't care.
I would assume you would all three argue about it and take what the at fault will give and let your company collision do rest.

I like to get good deals on older very nice shape ones and not put anything into them so even if they do get wrecked, the amount the will give me is most of what I need to go get another one.
 
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BillAlex

BillAlex

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Hi Toby and thank you for something to consider. In fifty years of driving, never had a fender bender. Like an earlier poster said, the Kelley Blue Book is nothing more that a guide line. Of course, I have a receipt for $3,200 for the engine, another receipt for $2,000 re-man Transmission and a shoe box totaling about $3,000 of miscellaneous parts. It would be very difficult for an Insurance company to deny the value of a car when you have receipts. Fair market value has been established by the Supreme Court as a Willing Seller and a Willing buyer, and money changes hands you have established the worth of an asset.

It takes two people to have an accident and I try my best to drive reasonably, carefully and give the other guy a break. I have driven over a million miles and it has served me well. To be honest with you, I do not even bother to have full coverage. The odds are in my favor if an accident occurs, it will be the other guy who caused it. If not, the money I have saved over the years by simply banking the difference between Liability Policy only (I carry 3 million) and the amount I would have paid for full coverage, with glass, theft and collision would have paid for many a new car. If you throw in that I do not finance cars and money saved in interest alone would have bought another couple of new cars.

This is an important point. I hope there are a couple of guys just coming out of College who drive an old beater for a year or two and take the money that would be spent toward new car payments and save it for a really decent car. I guarantee you that you can put together a really clean nice Expedition like I did for under Ten Grand. When payments are running $500, 600 or $700 a month, and of course the banks will require you have full coverage instead of a couple of hundred dollar per year liability policy you can see the math. For my entire life, I have paid myself "car payments" I put the money I would have paid the banks into a bank account and paid myself. Every three years, off I would go to my dealership and write a check. My credit rating sucks because I have never used it in my entire life. I do have credit cards but I pay the balance when the bill comes in.

Let me see, driving an old beater for two years, applying the same payments in a Bank Account and paying cash for your cars every two to three years. This computes to brand new cars over a lifetime. Fifty years of driving Corvettes, Jag XK-E, Shelby Cobra, Impala, Silverado, numerous Tahoe until I discovered the joy of a Expedition, numerous Cadillac DHS and some cars I can't even remember. Invest a few dollars in a good set of tools and the satisfaction of doing something thought to be really difficult is hard to put a price tag on. Read this Forum. The amount of money you can save just from the experience of these guys here is also priceless. They have nothing to gain by helping you out and yet, they do it anyway. You may have a different way of doing it. Share it anyway, the smart guys will take what they need and disregard the rest.
 

jeff kushner

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Bud, I had two other Expys and my '99 looked nearly Brand New when I sold it, it also had well over 200,000 miles, my '03EB also looked perfect inside/out with zero blemishes in the leather seats etc.

You have done well for your sweetheart & we know there was never a choice btwn her and the truck cause you know you'd fall flat on your face if she wasn't there! We have sweethearts too!!! <LOL>

Guess what, the axles, fuel & brake lines, fuel pump, bearings, old cracking wires, failing electrics don't care that it "looks" new. THEY are all 14 yrs old so don't fool yourself. You've already worked out that 95% of the time, it's ALWAYS better to repair than to replace but you still have a 14 y/o truck.....you are not even close to being done spending money!

Truck looks great and you got a more-than-fair mech.......I hope it stays together for you guys for many years.

jeff

BTW- that tear in your wife's eye wasn't for the loss of the truck, it was for what she was going to have to go through while you "fixed" things! LMAO
 

Trainmaster

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BillAlex, not many people in this consumer-oriented world share our view on finances. I've tried to instill this on my kids, and they have all done well by not throwing money away on depreciating assets. If you put your money into things that appreciate you can become quite independent financially in only a few years.

Insurance laws vary greatly between the states. In socialist places, like New York, stated value policies are extremely costly except for classic cars. As you say, if you can represent the value you put into the vehicle, they will pay at least a good part of it. The rest of the loss is easily made up with your savings. When you're not living on 150% of your income, you can afford some risk.

It's nice to read of someone else bucking the borrow-and-spend mentality.
 
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BillAlex

BillAlex

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Hi Jeff. You are absolutely correct. A strange and funny thing happens when Dealership Inventories reach Ten years old. They dump it. If you are an astute buyer and watch ebay closely, you get the shock of your life. On my shelf in my garage is a complete wiring harness for a 2005 Ford Expedition from front bumper to the back. I have two OEM ford compressors. Not that I need them, I just couldn't turn down the $50 price tag with free shipping. When I replaced my wife's A/C two years ago (I was too busy trying to catch Moby Dick off the coast of Alaska) , it cost me $1,200. Radiators are around $100, Condensers around $70 and dryers around 20. The pressure lines if you wait are less than ten each. I bought a rear tail light (left side) for $25 bucks, not that I needed it, but the $400 price tag at a Dealership convinced me it was not a bad idea to have one. I will probably never use it, but I sleep well at night knowing that some new parts that I will never need.

I have very few vices at my age. I don't drink, don't smoke, do not drop a hundred bucks on green fee's playing golf. I try to stay away from hookers if I can, avoid trips to Las Vegas or casinos and I like changing the oil and tune ups for neighborhood kids and teach them the importance of proper maintenance. Just drained the power steering fluid and brake fluid from a master on a kids car. He had no idea of what they were for much less you had to change them when they got rancid. We did a lower water hose on a Mustang a week ago and the Star Football player of his High School said "I had no idea of just how easy that was". We could have charge admission to see an old fart on a creeper with a spot light showing him exactly where everything was and "lefty loosey".

Even at my age, I love working on cars. The first thing I did for my son when he turned sixteen was buy him a Tahoe. It had a blown engine. So I told him if he wanted this car, he was going to have to earn it. The important thing was not to show him how to drop an engine in ( or bust your knuckles getting the top transmission bolt disconnected from a 5.7 L) the main thing was to show him just how easy it was to replace a coil pack or a radiator. It's a joke. My son Graduated from Vanderbilt Medical School and to this day, he still changes his own oil. Not that he can't afford to have the dealership do it, he simply wants to make sure that the little rubber ring from the last filter was removed. About a year ago, a pulley ceased and he threw a serpentine belt right in front of an Autozone. Guess what he did? He changed it. The car was under warrantee, but he wasn't going to wait a couple of hours for a tow truck, wait for the dealership to repair it and then go get it when it was done. Time is money.

Jeff, if you are paying a $100 per hour shop time plus a 30 % mark up on parts, you would be right. Buy a two year old Expedition with an extended warrantee. If you are old school and have ever pulled an engine using a come along and a limb of a tree on your old man's front yard, then nothing can compare with the satisfaction of turning a key and hearing her "purr". If you have ever had a 56 Chevy, then you know what a 265 is, a 283, a 305, 327 with a 4bl Holley, 348 out of a 58, 396, 409 and my favorite of all time was driving a 66 vet off the showroom floor with a 427 with spring loaded four speed that shifted with your little finger while eating a GTO for lunch. Keeping your Expedition in top running shape is nothing more that a frame off restoration, one piece at a time.
 
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