First drive 2018 Navigator Reserve and Black Label

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JCP2018

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I drove a Platinum Max a few weeks ago, and an L Reserve yesterday; night and day difference between the Ford and Lincoln. In my opinion this is the first Navigator that is actually worth the (admittedly not drastically higher) premium; Ford is actually on the right track with this one. The interior is gorgeous, especially in the Black Label trims (can't find the themes online now, but saw 3 of them at a local dealer. My favorite was the blue, which reminded me of the Nautica Villager from the 90's), though I'm not sure the Black label is worth the extra $13k over the Reserve, which gives you pretty much the same experience. It was much quieter than the Expy, rode better with the air suspension, and just looked worth the premium (to me the Expy looks too much like the 150 inside; the Navi is incredible). I also loved the outside details. The Navi is a better value overall.

I believe Ford needs to drastically reduce the price of the Expy; it's not as nice as the Navi and costs nearly as much. I know it's apples to oranges, but you can get any Platinum F series for what the Expy costs (much less with the 150) and have just as nice of a vehicle, at least in the front row.

I thought the price was crazy until I started cross shopping other premium brands. To get anything reasonably close to the Navi in, say, a Mercedes would be the GLS; a zero option base model starts at the same price as a Reserve, which is way more comfortable and feature laden. BMW is worse. To option that GLS even remotely close and you're way past the Black Label, so Ford has hit upon something here. The QX and LX may be close in size and price, but no where near as nice IMO.

This is now my lottery dream car.
 
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JCP2018

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Until that lottery train rolls into the station we are still going to look at leasing a Lincoln; again, they are impressive these days, and getting better. Since we have the Expy for her I may look at leasing either an MKC or an MKZ, both Reserve models.
 

Trainmaster

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WTF is a "Reserve Model"?

When comparing price, remember that the money is in the metal. The leather and plastic costs very little to Ford; it's a huge mark-up and profit item. That's why even the lower trim models fetch so much cash.

Read an interesting statistic yesterday about lottery ticket buyers:

Lottery spending for those living below poverty level: $ 802/year
Lottery spending by those leasing new automobiles: $ 680/year
Lottery spending by those purchasing new automobiles: $ 29/year

Just imagine what "reserve model" lesees spend?
 
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dlcorbett

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Thenav actually doesnt have air suspension. I drove a select and there is a more airy feel than the expy. I did like the seats more in my expy but i didnt take the time to set the seats either. My next truck is going to be a navi reserve.
 

JExpedition07

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Trainmaster your half forgetting something. The manufacturers don’t want to sell more vehicles, yes you read that right. Look at the expy, they sell Way less now than what they used to with the new generation. Sure they make more per unit but when you aren’t selling any volume your losing. This trend isn’t just ford. They want you to lease, because that way you pay for 2-3 years and then they get to sell it again! I would personally never lease a vehicle- ever. I buy them then run them into the ground to the point they can’t drive anymore..... I like owning my stuff. But Ford and others want you to pay $500-$700 monthly to lease your Navigator for three years, then they’ll sell it for $65,000 on the backside to the next sucker..... notice how attractive they make the lease deals, then tell a conventional out right buyer like us $900-$1,200 monthly to do that.....it’s all a game to push leasing so they make money twice.
 
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Trainmaster

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Oh yes, J. The folks around me who lease this stuff make lots of money and have little to show for it. They are making the banks rich.

Obviously I think like you do. I keep these things for 20 years and consider them like any other tool. But then I had decided early in life that I wanted to retire early, so I had to save my money.

The high end stuff is nice, alright, but I'll take it for a quarter of the price after ten years. A few grand cleaning it up and it's good for us for another decade. Doing this, I've kept my car costs to about $1500/year and always drove good, dependable high end and low mileage trucks. The rest of the money got invested.
 
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John Christopher

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Trainmaster your half forgetting something. The manufacturers don’t want to sell more vehicles, yes you read that right. Look at the expy, they sell Way less now than what they used to with the new generation. Sure they make more per unit but when you aren’t selling any volume your losing. This trend isn’t just ford. They want you to lease, because that way you pay for 2-3 years and then they get to sell it again! I would personally never lease a vehicle- ever. I buy them then run them into the ground to the point they can’t drive anymore..... I like owning my stuff. But Ford and others want you to pay $500-$600 monthly to lease your Navigator for three years, then they’ll sell it for $65,000 on the backside to the next sucker..... notice how attractive they make the lease deals, then tell a conventional out right buyer like us $800-$1,100 monthly to do that.....it’s all a game to push leasing so they make money twice.

I never thought about that but you make a lot of sense. The prices of these vehicles are out of sight. Weather it's the Nav, Yukon, Escalade or Tahoe, their all nuts.
 

Adieu

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I drove a Platinum Max a few weeks ago, and an L Reserve yesterday; night and day difference between the Ford and Lincoln. In my opinion this is the first Navigator that is actually worth the (admittedly not drastically higher) premium; Ford is actually on the right track with this one. The interior is gorgeous, especially in the Black Label trims (can't find the themes online now, but saw 3 of them at a local dealer. My favorite was the blue, which reminded me of the Nautica Villager from the 90's), though I'm not sure the Black label is worth the extra $13k over the Reserve, which gives you pretty much the same experience. It was much quieter than the Expy, rode better with the air suspension, and just looked worth the premium (to me the Expy looks too much like the 150 inside; the Navi is incredible). I also loved the outside details. The Navi is a better value overall.

I believe Ford needs to drastically reduce the price of the Expy; it's not as nice as the Navi and costs nearly as much. I know it's apples to oranges, but you can get any Platinum F series for what the Expy costs (much less with the 150) and have just as nice of a vehicle, at least in the front row.

I thought the price was crazy until I started cross shopping other premium brands. To get anything reasonably close to the Navi in, say, a Mercedes would be the GLS; a zero option base model starts at the same price as a Reserve, which is way more comfortable and feature laden. BMW is worse. To option that GLS even remotely close and you're way past the Black Label, so Ford has hit upon something here. The QX and LX may be close in size and price, but no where near as nice IMO.

This is now my lottery dream car.

Merc GLS is noticeably smaller than a Gator... BMW X5 is more like an Explorer in size, actually smaller probably.

QX60 is a smaller van with some trucklike styling

The Nissan/Infinitis based on the overseas market Nissan Patrol are fullsize but only offer a product to compete with the SWB Ford/Lincolns...and are really dated designs

The only rivals in the same class are the big GM trucks
 

dlcorbett

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I always thought the 2nd gen navs were nice, and the refreshed 05 n 06 models were gorgeous to me. I think the sec and 4th gen navs are amazing mainly and only let down by their trucky platform. Theres only so much to improve on with a truck frame. The other luxury trucks get aroubd this by sacrificing some capability but try and smooth out ride handling abd performance.
 

jeff kushner

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I'm sure that the new Nav's are very, very nice but financially, a private owner leasing is just paying for someone else's ride. I know the reason is so people can drive what they cannot afford to but but that in itself, should be a clue.

In 18 more months, my '17 will be mine. 42 months total @ 1.9%..seemed pretty clean to me.

Each to his or her own though so good luck!!

jeff
 
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