OK Guys .. Help !!!

[ejstith]

Here's the deal. My battery kept running down on my 2000 Navigator. I checked the battery and it was bad. I took it to Sam's and got a new Exide battery about 2 weeks ago. I thought that had fixed my problem but lo and behold the new battery ran down too. OK, I took a test light and unhooked the negative battery cable and touched the battery post with one end and the cable with the other end and, sure enough, I have a light indicating power is going through the system. I began to pull fuses. I pulled every fuse under the dash and nearly of them in the fuse box under the hood. I still had a light every time with the fuse out.

I had this same problem on my Ford F-250 and it turned out to be a shorted alternator. So today, I took the alternator off (not as bad as I thought it was going to be). I unhooked the wires to the alternator and I STILL HAVE A LIGHT!! I'd have bet a hundred bucks that was it. Sooooo, now I'm at a dead end. I have no idea what is pulling power all of the time now. Anyone ever had this situation or have any idea what it is? Any help is appreciated. Thanks ..

 

[tonydiv]

How long does it take to run the battery down?

Back in '01 when I was selling them, it seemed that if we didn't start and run the Nav's every 10 days or so, they would have dead batteries.

 

[ejstith]

Will be weak over night, will be dead in about 3 days I imagine. I haven't let it go completely dead. I have kept the battery charged with a 1 amp battery charger or unhook the battery. I am concerned about leaving the battery unhooked for a long period of time. I don't know if I'd loose the total mileage indication or not. Will loose the trip mileage as soon as one unhooks the battery

 

[JUST4FUN]

did you pull the fuses under the hood??

 

[ejstith]

Yeah, I pulled all of them except about 4 really big ones.

 

[JUST4FUN]

Yeah, I pulled all of them except about 4 really big ones.

if its draining that fast id look in to the back glass defrost or any heated surface being on

 

[ejstith]

It is a high draw for sure but I pulled every fuse under the dash and all but the big square ones in the fuse box under the hood. Had it been a window defroster when I pulled the fuse it the test light should have went out. I can't imagine anything in the starter causing this but that's about all that's left. I guess I'll put the alternator back on today because it's apparent the problem isn't there. Somebody will stumble across this site and know or at least tell me where to look. This is one of those deals where if you took it to the dealer the diagnostic charges would be astronomical. Thanks guys ...

 

[ejstith]

OK, here's the latest. I got the alternator back on only to find out I could have taken one wire off of a relay looking thing on the firewall and accomplished the same thing. Oh well, live and learn. Anyway, on that relay or solenoid, what ever it is on the passenger side of the firewall, there are two posts. On the lower post is the wires that come from the alternator and then there's a big red wire and then a wire harness that comes in from the fender. That one big wire by it's self goes into a wire bundle up top. What I need to know, if anybody knows, where does that wire that goes toward the fender go to? Sort of looks like it goes toward the starter. When I take that wire off the test light goes out so my problem has something to do with where that wire goes. Any ideas? I'm still waiting on my manual. Should be here today or tomorrow. Thanks again ..

 

[ejstith]

Well after getting back from vacation I tackled the problem again. I re-checked all of the fuses under the hood. I have three that draw power. One is the 4X4 switch, the air compressor controller and the anti-lock brake system. All total they are drawing 17 milliamps which don't seem like much to me. I think the allowable draw is something like 28 milliamps. At the battery, if I take the ground wire off and put an amp gauge there it is drawing .26 amps. Too much. Any ideas?

 

[ejstith]

This forum is about as useless as that Haynes manual I got ...

 

[ELVATO]

Chill

Couple things that may seem obvious, but might have been overlooked. Make sure everything is turned off. Make sure the hood light isn't on, nor the interior lights that may turn on if you open the door to pull fuses.

Second, make sure that when you are measuring the current, that you are not breaking the connection of the battery cable and the battery post. As in, don't just take off the battery cable from the post and measure it. There has to be a jumper cable as you are taking off the cable, so as to keep a connection there. Then hook up the ammeter, then take off the jumper cable. Or, you could just keep the ammeter hooked up to both as you are taking it off, but that's a little trickier.

The reason the manual gives is so that non of them systems "reset" from the the loss of power.

These are the steps given in the manual. Not sure how they differ from those in the Haynes manual....

1. Make sure the junction box/fuse panels are accessible without turning on interior and underhood lights.

2. Drive the vehicle at least five minutes and over 48 km/h (30 mph) to turn on and exercise vehicle systems.

3. Allow the vehicle to sit with the key off for at least 40 minutes to allow modules to time out/power down.

4. Connect a fused jumper wire between the negative battery cable and the negative battery post to prevent modules from resetting and to catch capacitive drains.

5. Disconnect the negative battery cable from the post without breaking the connection of the jumper wire.

6. NOTE: It is very important that continuity is not broken between the battery and the negative battery cable when connecting the meter. If this happens, the entire procedure must be repeated.

Connect the tester between negative battery cable and the post. The meter must be capable of reading milliamps and should have a 10 amp capability.

7. NOTE: If the meter settings need to be switched or the test leads need to be moved to another jack, the jumper wire must be reinstalled to avoid breaking continuity.

Remove the jumper wire.

NOTE: Amperage draw will vary from vehicle to vehicle depending on the equipment package. Compare to a comparable vehicle for reference.

NOTE: No production vehicle should have more than a 50 mA (0.050 amp) draw.

8. If the draw is found to be excessive, pull fuses from the battery/central junction box one at a time and note the current drop. Do not reinstall the fuses until you are finished testing.

9. Check the wiring schematic in the wiring diagram for any circuits that run from the battery without passing through the battery/central junction box. Disconnect these circuits if the draw is still excessive.

 

[tonydiv]

Gee, I'm sorry that I wasn't able to diagnose your complex electrical problem over the internet.

 

[ejstith]

Thanks a ton Elvato ... I have already done most of that, several times. The only thing I didn't do was hook the meter while a jumper wire was attached. I'll try that. The last reading I took was .26 milliamps, which is within limits. I'm charging the battery to 100% right now and will take it off of the charger and see if it goes down not being hooked to the car. I've about came to the conclusion I have a bad brand new battery ... Anyway, Thanks a lot .. I really appreciate it a lot ....

 

[ejstith]

Well guys, we have went through all of this, I have checked and rechecked everything and I have found I have a bad brand new Excide battery! I charged it up to 14 volts, unhooked it from the car and overnight it went down to 10.4 volts. Hooked it to the car and it stayed at 10.4 volts. Put my hydrometer on it and the second cell is dead as hell. All of that and it's a damned bad brand new battery! I even took the alternator off .. damn, damn, damn!! I have never bought a bad brand new battery in my life. First for everything I guess. Thanks a ton for all of your help.

 

[ELVATO]

Ah, yes. Shorted/bad cell. It happens. Glad you figured it out.

 

[ejstith]

Yep finally got it. Geeeze, after all of that. I even took the alternator off (only to later find out all I'd have had to have done was unhook it from the post on the firewall). Took the fuses out twice and did all of that. I would just have never thought it would have been a bad brand new battery. Hell, I'm 68 years old and have bought a million batteries and have never bought a bad brand new battery. Again, thanks to all of ya ..

 

[z168]

Here's the deal. My battery kept running down on my 2000 Navigator. I checked the battery and it was bad. I took it to Sam's and got a new Exide battery about 2 weeks ago. I thought that had fixed my problem but lo and behold the new battery ran down too. OK, I took a test light and unhooked the negative battery cable and touched the battery post with one end and the cable with the other end and, sure enough, I have a light indicating power is going through the system. I began to pull fuses. I pulled every fuse under the dash and nearly of them in the fuse box under the hood. I still had a light every time with the fuse out.

Youre expected to have something running (usually memory settings) but if you pulled out every conceivable fuse there is it should stop.

try powering things up with the key off and doors closed.

did you have alternator checked? With the engine running your voltmeter should read AT LEAST 13V (14V would be better)

in the meantime, just so you dont have any fear of the car dying on you while youre out. Get one of those priority start modules so it doesnt drain your car completely while its parked

 

[ejstith]

Yeah Z168, I found it as posted before. Was a dead cell in a brand new battery. Thanks for the input though .. I needed all the help I could get and you guys were great ...... Thanks again to all of ya ...