Poor Heat in Both Front & Rear Units

[splintrcel]

I had some guy at a quick lube at a ford dealer dump green coolant in my stock colored coolant and turn it brown and screwed up my whole coolant system. The EATC module temp indicator is only the desired temp setting, not what the car actually is putting out. If you have clean coolant its prob the thermostat. If that doesnt work you can try the water pump but its a two man job to get the fan off. Its just a pain in the ass. You will need to 1/2" drive breaker bars. Loctite the pulley bolts back on as well, mine fell off even though i had it tighter then they were when i pulled them off. If the water pump is good and coolant is clean and thermostat is changed, it could be the heater core which is a pain but doable but if the heater hose isnt hot going to the heater core you can probably avoid changing the heater cores. I live in wisconsin and lately it has been around 0 degrees or lower so having working heat is pretty important. Even when its -14 out my heat still cranks out so there has to be something up with your system. If and when you have to dump coolant to save your self swearing and a mess only open of the coolant release valve to the point where its just a solid stream and no farther. It will be slow to dump but it will keep the stream landing in the drip pan instead of spilling everywhere.

 

[RDEXPO02]

I hooked up my little test computer, it is an OBDII and does do real time temp readings and not just read codes. Paid 249.99 at Autozone last time my GF had a problem with her car. I watched it warm up and it went as high as 195 (199 for a few seconds) and dropped to 184-190 range (revving and holding RPMs at 2K but never got hotter and now I can't get it above 187 even holding the RPMs up. It has been at 187 for the past 40 min. Have not been to auto parts store yet but will soon.

Also I plan to drain and change antifreeze and do a flush myself. I bought two small bottles of FLUSH at Napa and I'm defrosting the hose in the tub now.... LOL... I think the antifreeze that is in it now is orange but I bought 2 gal of PEAK Global antifreeze that is suppose to mix with any color. I was just going to use that exclusively after everything is flushed out so it won't be mixing with anything but clean water when I'm done. Being that I am not mixing colors so as long as I have the same color its alright from what I heard from everyone I talked to thus far. Right now it looks more BROWN than orange from whatever the oil change places have added over the years but at every oil change they test it and they say its good with those beads that float in the test tube thingy!

I saw a video on you-tube where a guy had an expedition and broke the heater line off the top of the manifold, installed a TEE with a few inches of hose and never had to cut the line. He hooked up a 1 1/2 PVC and stuck it in the degas tank and slowly put water in it till he got it flushed out with NO LEAKS or spills. I already have my TEE and a few feet of heater hose O bought, have to run to storage for the larger PVC at the degas tank and see if what I got fits tight. I'm gunna try what he did with a few modifications. I am going to actually use FLUSH solution and when I'm done I'm going to release the bottom hose of the radiator (when I know its just water in the system) and let it run onto the ground outside because any debris will kind of stay toward the bottom. if there is anything that comes out or dislodges from the hoses running plain water for a few min in the driveway where I don't care if it ices up won't go into the well or harm any pets or animals and get it all out.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUWJU5hvlYs

It's 29 degrees outside btw

Does that help at any guesses?

 

[bedrck46]

From the sounds of it your t/stat may be sticking open I just had the same thing happen on my 01. I had mine hooked up when I took a recent trip to Texas and that's about the best temp I could get and it was warmer outside then. But when the temps here in PA took a drop into the single digits the best I could get on the OBD2 was about 170. Since I changed the T/Stat I can now get up to 212 deg See the attached pic posted earlier That was with an outside temp in the low 30's

Also most on here recommend using a Motorcraft T/Stat

 

[bedrck46]

btw if you can hold you hand on a heater hose for longer than a minute I would say the tem is 120 or less I know what I am able to hold Think of it as if you were holding you hand under the water at the kitchen sink and when you find the temp that you can't keep your hand under the water flow put some in a glass and take the temp you will get a good idea of what you can hold Its not the best method to use but it will give you a ball park idea

 

[splintrcel]

Its a bad sign if you have brown coolant. I would say someone dumped in green. The green interacts with the orange creating this rust colored shit that fills up the entire system. Once you drain the coolant pop off the main radiator hose and look to see if there is crap in there. If there is good luck have fun because that crap is probably all over the cooling system. I had this issue and in order to fix it i flushed the coolant twice, swapped thermostat, water pump, and front heater core. I also ran an additive to my new coolant (Prestone green). My rear heater core is also getting replaced but i will get around to it. There is a clear difference between the two heat out puts so my heater core was def clogged with crap. My front core actually sprung a leak from the flushing so keep that in mind as a possiblity. When doing the flush, DO NOT USE THE PRESTONE T FLUSH KIT!!!! It leaks with in 3 months and a new coolant line is like $40.

 

[RDEXPO02]

OK, I swapped out the T-Stat and it wasn't that bad. When I took the hose off it appeared to be closed because when I popped out the O-ring it started to come up from the block. Upper hose appeared to be full as almost half or a full gallon spilled out from it. No debris or sludge or any particles did I see. Pressing on it it feels fine almost like the new one that went in.

Here is the old one I took out



Fluid that spilled out was a slightly darker orange than the orange stuff I had, it had a little brown tint to it but was definitely orange and could tell not so brown as I thought. Guess looking into the degas tank made it appear darker than it really was.

Didn't do the flush, can't find my piping and stuff to do it like the video, and have it all buttoned up now. Got the car running for almost an hour again and it seems a little warmer now out of the vents but it also went up to 33 degrees here (from 26 this morning when I tested last). A good quality temp gauge says its 84 degrees in the car with the heat blasting for over an hour and the doors and windows closed up. That is better than 60 or so which was about the best I could get it before, but that was on a day it was only 10 degrees outside when I tested that. Heater was barely defrosting the window, had to drive with windows open.

OBD said that BEFORE the T-Stat was changed coolant was 185 and stayed there for an hour and only went up or down a degree or two 184-187



After the T-Stat went in, it only went up a few degrees. I got it up to 199 for a second or two revving and holding it at 2500 or so. But now it stays at 192-194 or so (more so rock steady at 192) for past hour. Not a huge difference really I think but it did rise up a few degrees from 185 and stays at 192 for the past hour rock steady.



But it does seem a bit warmer now... (but it isn't 10 degrees outside yet) have to see what it does when its zero or -10 again. Maybe the lines need to be flushed, but why a water pump? How do metal propellers go bad?

FYI - factory temp gauge is right at where it was before, almost dead center in the middle from slightly above center (but again it is a factory idiot gauge). I can hold the heater hose for almost a half min, its not hot hot hot but I can almost take it for a half min or so. No pressure in the lines at all, I can squeeze them just fine including the upper main radiator hose. Main hose I can hold all day long, just warm... Heater hose gets a little uncomfortable but not like I'm touching something almost 200 degrees. Maybe the thick heater hose and ambient air is providing a sort of cooling effect insulated it from what it really is. Don't have an IR temp gun.... maybe the next toy I buy.

Does any of this help at all?

I'm gunna have to fill up again, gas station is going to love me!

 

[bedrck46]

looks a little better leave you OBD2 hooked up and the take the expy out for a ride of about 15 miles and keep an eye on the coolant temp I was having about the same problem as you are and after I changed the stat my temps were up to 212 deg

 

[Cobra Jet]

Your fix may lie within this thread:

1999 Expy 4.6 Heat FIXED! - You won't believe how! - Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums

Look for the heater flow restrictor fitting within the supply heater hose that is found at or near rear of block on passenger side. You can feel it inside of the the hose when squeezing the hose or running your hand down the length of it.

Remove it.

No, it won't harm anything. No it won't "blow out your heater cores".

Ford placed these same restrictor fittings in many of their vehicles - and it was common in early Mustangs too (79-93 era). The fitting is small and the center of the fitting has a smaller opening in it. Over time, the fitting can get clogged, thus reducing coolant flow through the hose with the restrictor. This can lead to lower than normal cabin temps when heat is being used.

This part came already installed in the factory supply hose. When a shop (non-Ford) R&R's the original hose for a coolant job, 99.9% of the time the original hose with restrictor is tossed and a new hose (w/o restrictor) is installed... Most people don't even know the hoses had one of those restrictors inside anyway.



Try it and report back...

 

[RDEXPO02]

I saw and felt it. You can almost see it in the hose bulging a tiny bit. I thought it was something in the hose to keep the "bend in it". I knew it was a metal insert and not a clog and obviously from the factory and didn't think to mention it. I read the thread and it said that it was needed for the front heater core more so than the rear and especially for the DEFROST vents or something. I don't think I'm gunna mess with it. I'll see how the temps do while driving.... I'm going out again at 4:30 and I'll hook up the OBD and watch it.

I still don't think it was the thermostat, I mean.... an hour and its only 84 degrees in the car? I should be sweating with front and rear heaters going!

Here is the flow restrictor...

 

[Mangina]

I still don't think it was the thermostat, I mean.... an hour and its only 84 degrees in the car? I should be sweating with front and rear heaters going!



View attachment 8042

My truck never fully warms up when I just idle it. It needs to be moving before it gets fully warmed up. Does it get hotter once you drive it?