Rear end problems!!!!

[Bob K]

Hi everyone. I'm new to the forum, thanks for having me. I'll try to keep this as short as I can.
We have an '06 Expedition, 4X4 EB package, 5.4 with 55K miles. Last Tuesday, my wife had the oil changed while she was at the gym. When she goes to pick up the car, there is an additional charge of $110 to replace the rear pinion seal (let's call this "Shop #1"). The next day, she calls me and says the car is making a horrible grinding noise. I run down there and sure enough....it's bad. I slowly drive the car about 1 block to a repair shop (different shop from the one that changed the seal, let's call this one "Shop #2"). The mechanic put the car on the lift and the rear pinion/yoke are sloppy loose. There were no theads showing past the pinion nut. We got a couple of turns on the nut, but it didn't help the looseness.
I went back to Shop #1 to explain the problem. He swore the pinion nut was torqued to spec. and we must have a bearing going bad. At this point I pretty ticked off. He said to have the car towed back to his shop and "he'd take care of it". My trust in this shop is quickly dwindling.
To avoid paying for the cost of towing, I had Shop #2 tear apart the differential so we could see what's going on. After the dis-assembling, we found the pinion bearings we good. However, the pinion got into the carrier cage and chewed it up pretty bad. The most cost effective solution is to replace the differential with a good used one (at a cost of $600 plus labor).

Here's my question: Is there any way the pinion could slide into the carrier if the bearings are good, the crush collar was in place and the pinion nut was properly tightened? Is there a spacer that was missing? I suspect the nut was not tightened down enough to keep the pinion from sliding into the carrier. Any help is greatly appreciated.

 

[tmajikman]

Hi everyone. I'm new to the forum, thanks for having me. I'll try to keep this as short as I can.
We have an '06 Expedition, 4X4 EB package, 5.4 with 55K miles. Last Tuesday, my wife had the oil changed while she was at the gym. When she goes to pick up the car, there is an additional charge of $110 to replace the rear pinion seal (let's call this "Shop #1"). The next day, she calls me and says the car is making a horrible grinding noise. I run down there and sure enough....it's bad. I slowly drive the car about 1 block to a repair shop (different shop from the one that changed the seal, let's call this one "Shop #2"). The mechanic put the car on the lift and the rear pinion/yoke are sloppy loose. There were no theads showing past the pinion nut. We got a couple of turns on the nut, but it didn't help the looseness.
I went back to Shop #1 to explain the problem. He swore the pinion nut was torqued to spec. and we must have a bearing going bad. At this point I pretty ticked off. He said to have the car towed back to his shop and "he'd take care of it". My trust in this shop is quickly dwindling.
To avoid paying for the cost of towing, I had Shop #2 tear apart the differential so we could see what's going on. After the dis-assembling, we found the pinion bearings we good. However, the pinion got into the carrier cage and chewed it up pretty bad. The most cost effective solution is to replace the differential with a good used one (at a cost of $600 plus labor).

Here's my question: Is there any way the pinion could slide into the carrier if the bearings are good, the crush collar was in place and the pinion nut was properly tightened? Is there a spacer that was missing? I suspect the nut was not tightened down enough to keep the pinion from sliding into the carrier. Any help is greatly appreciated.

If the truck had no issues before it went to shop 1 then it would be on them completely, did shop 1 even call you or your wife to verify that the work on the diff seal was cool to do? I think shop 1 should accept the complete bill for the new/used rear end, including labor. If you need a lawyer then you have to do what you have to do. Maybe the tech at shop 1 suffers from CRS.

 

[ecqm8000]

If as you say, all bearings/crush sleeve/shims are in place and the pinion nut it tightened to the yoke. It is NOT possible for the pinion to "reach back" to the carrier. While changing the Input/yoke/pinion seal nut was not properly installed (including secured) and it backed off. I would think the second shop would support you in the diagnosis and the first shop should pick up the entire bill. With only 55K and a line like "we intended to drive this to 300K miles..."

I wish you best on this problem. It is one of the reasons shops strive for reputation. Good luck, and keep us informed.

 

[tonydiv]

I hate to be Captain Hindsight here, but you should have immediately taken it back to shop #1. Now you've created a ******* match between these two shops.

I mean, how can shop #1 verify and fix the problem now that it's all torn apart at a shop across town? Are they supposed to shell out a few hundred bucks for a new ring and pinion set (and labor) based on what their competition says?

A few other things that I noticed in your post. Why did you pay for work that was not authorized? Did they just take it upon themselves to change out that seal?

 

[Bob K]

Tmajikman-Thanks for your reply. Shop 1 did not check with us before changing the seal. If they had called me first, I would've gone to the shop to look at the leaking seal before authorizing the work. My wife paid for the work before I knew about it.

ecqm8000-Thanks for your reply. When I looked at all the parts and how they fit together, I came to the same conclusion. The only way the pinion could get into the carrier is: 1) a bearing failed, 2) a spacer was missing, 3) the nut was not tightened enough to seat the pinion against the bearings.

tonydiv-Thanks for your reply. My wife paid for the seal replacement before I knew about it (she was scolded and spanked!!!, just kidding). In hindsight maybe I should have taken back to shop 1. However, I did get the owner of shop 1 to go to shop 2 and look at the messed up differential. Once repairs are complete, the owner of shop 1 and I will seek a financial resolution. While I don't care much to mix business and personal issues, I do have an "ace in the hole". I am a manager for a mining company that does in excess of $150,000 per year with shop 1. I'm pretty sure he'll be willing to make restitution....

 

[tmajikman]

Glad to hear you got the ball rolling and shop 1 owner seemed to own up to screwing up. I am amazed the guy did not call to get permission first, I don't take my vehicle to a shop too often, but I have never had any place not call me.

I think the shop 1 owner will eat the cost of his screw up, if not he really is not too intelligent to begin with.