JExpedition07
That One Member
Do they still make a Tahoe hybrid? I'd think that's where things are going next for SUVs. By the way nice profile photo.... bahahaha
2000 EB to 2017 eco boost - hesitant
- Thread starter Machete
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Do they still make a Tahoe hybrid? I'd think that's where things are going next for SUVs. By the way nice profile photo.... bahahaha
Big Brian
Full Access Members
funny you mention those...
when I worked for TRW in the hydraulic brake lab we developed something called "slip control boost" it was a way of charging the hybrid batteries through the energy of the vehicle braking.
This system went on the Tahoe hybrid. GM expected to sell 20,000 of those the first year of production.
They sold 2000. Luckily the technology we developed was used on other hybrids in other iterations so the effort was not totally wasted
the pic in my avatar was after a meeting with a deer on the way to my cabin in July. $7500 later its back to looking like new
when I worked for TRW in the hydraulic brake lab we developed something called "slip control boost" it was a way of charging the hybrid batteries through the energy of the vehicle braking.
This system went on the Tahoe hybrid. GM expected to sell 20,000 of those the first year of production.
They sold 2000. Luckily the technology we developed was used on other hybrids in other iterations so the effort was not totally wasted
the pic in my avatar was after a meeting with a deer on the way to my cabin in July. $7500 later its back to looking like new
The 1st Gen Expedition were known, for being long lasting, high mileage vehicles. They were most sold/popular of all years. Ford now only sells a small fraction, by comparison. The only real change, that might make a difference is the engine. It is a 5000lb vehicle and my opinion, a V6 is not going to hold up. If you tow, you will be pushing it at 110%. Timing chain stretch, turbo failure and carbon build up on valves and sludge getting sucked into turbos, are all big dollar repairs. You sound like, you drive yours beyond the warranty. I would wait until next year, when they offer more engines as a option.
ExpeditionAndy
Full Access Members
http://carsalesbase.com/us-car-sales-data/ford/ford-expedition/
Ford Expedition Sales Figures
2016 - 59.835
2015 - 41.443
2014 - 44.632
2013 - 38.350
2012 - 38.062
2011 - 40.499
2010 - 37.336
2009 - 31.655
2008 - 55.123
2007 - 90.287
2006 - 87.203
2005 - 114.137
2004 - 159.846
2003 - 181.547
2002 - 163.454
2001 - 178.045
2000 - 213.483
1999 - 233.125
1998 - 225.703
1997 - 214.524
1996 - 45.974
Ford Expedition Sales Figures
2016 - 59.835
2015 - 41.443
2014 - 44.632
2013 - 38.350
2012 - 38.062
2011 - 40.499
2010 - 37.336
2009 - 31.655
2008 - 55.123
2007 - 90.287
2006 - 87.203
2005 - 114.137
2004 - 159.846
2003 - 181.547
2002 - 163.454
2001 - 178.045
2000 - 213.483
1999 - 233.125
1998 - 225.703
1997 - 214.524
1996 - 45.974
So one ford mechanic goes on Youtube, and says, so it is gospel?
jeff kushner
Full Access Members
Given what I know about engines in general and turbochargers in particular, I change my oil pretty regularly at 5-6000 miles, regardless of what the oil life indicator reads. The guy who does the labor for me (I take my oil & filter to them to change) tells me each time I visit: "You don't need to come in until your oil life remaining reads 10-15%", "You're wasting money by coming early".
And I tell him each time I visit..."Yes, I know, I just enjoy putting money into your pocket" in other words, just do the work brother. LOL The fact is, right now, I'm 150 miles overdue for a 6,000 mile oil change yet my oil life indicator still reads 48%! Do you know what that means? It means my engine is clean, very clean which means that my TURBO's are going to last and THAT has been my plan all along! Since the turbo's use the same oil as the engine, I believe that it's going to be imperative to keep that shared oil clean since the shafts on the turbos are spinning upwards of 200,000RPM...and yeah, you read that correctly. Just my opinion though...we'll see how it turns out for me in a few more years........as far as the other myths....that's exactly what they are so nothing more need be said because to address fantasies is to lend them credence.
jeff
And I tell him each time I visit..."Yes, I know, I just enjoy putting money into your pocket" in other words, just do the work brother. LOL The fact is, right now, I'm 150 miles overdue for a 6,000 mile oil change yet my oil life indicator still reads 48%! Do you know what that means? It means my engine is clean, very clean which means that my TURBO's are going to last and THAT has been my plan all along! Since the turbo's use the same oil as the engine, I believe that it's going to be imperative to keep that shared oil clean since the shafts on the turbos are spinning upwards of 200,000RPM...and yeah, you read that correctly. Just my opinion though...we'll see how it turns out for me in a few more years........as far as the other myths....that's exactly what they are so nothing more need be said because to address fantasies is to lend them credence.
jeff
The 'blow by" that gets drawn into motors PCV system, has moisture and crap that can leave deposits on turbo fins. Too much build up will unbalance the turbo and kill it. Shutting down a hot engine, before turbo cools is not good. The oil protecting it, stops flowing and burns off. That creates a dry start conditions and will lead to turbo a fail. Just changing oil, before required will not help. Synthetic oil and a "catch can", is the way to go.
OP
OP
Machete
My Rig. 2000 EB 4x4 5.4L
Uhh...it was 8 Ford mechanics mate, not 1, 8 out of 10 and one of the 10 admitted he didn't know because he was new to Ford. All 8 mechanics cited the same basic reasoning for the 5.0 v8, reliability, ease of maintenance, cost of maintenance, forced induction on small engine.
Who else but a Ford mechanic's word would you take, someone who has a 60 month car payment on an eco boost?
I do not have a high mileage ecoboost vehicle. And like you I have a 1986 BMW with 240K miles, and a 1999 Expy with the same mileage. I gave the Expy to my son also. I also "hold" cars, the reliable ones. We are like twins.
So I will point out that pretty much everybody builds cars that will achieve high mileage now. Hell, even the Koreans build quality, reliable cars. Japanese cars are in my opinion built better than european cars, but they all are capable of lasting a long time. Even GM builds some quality products now! Shocking!!!
My point is that you probably dont have to worry about an ecoboost catastrophe, because modern cars are generally very reliable, especially in the hands of guys like you and me who are capable of proper maintenance.
So I will point out that pretty much everybody builds cars that will achieve high mileage now. Hell, even the Koreans build quality, reliable cars. Japanese cars are in my opinion built better than european cars, but they all are capable of lasting a long time. Even GM builds some quality products now! Shocking!!!
My point is that you probably dont have to worry about an ecoboost catastrophe, because modern cars are generally very reliable, especially in the hands of guys like you and me who are capable of proper maintenance.
Ford had spark plugs ejecting out of 2nd gen, 5.4l. The water pump on the 3.5l v6 is located inside engine and cost $1500 to repair. Just because something is "newer", does not mean better. Hyundai started offering a 100k mile warranty, but price of there cars went way up. Honda and Toyota lean more toward more reliability, than performance. German cars are very costly to maintain.
I got a buddy who bought an auction 09 or '10 KIA for $2200 with 200k mi....now has >300k. No major issues.
JExpedition07
That One Member
Fords highest sales were in second gen the new ones are failing to sell from what I hear. Lots will avoid just because of ecoboost and will continue to justified or not it's just a wide held belief in V8 power. People have migrated to Tahoe and Yukon in flocks, consumers have spoken loud that Ford is failing the full size SUV front. I don't care what the ecoboost says on paper it's different in real life, fast lane truck did a towing competition between Navigator and yukon and the Yukon had wayyyy more power over hills with that trailer and beat out the ecoboost big time. The ecoboost was losing speed floored and the GM kept speeding up the same hill the ecoboost failed to accelerate on. Consumers want what they want shoving things down their throats won't work. Ford is learning this lesson with the explorer their smaller ecoboost fails to sell and it is lowest selling in its class. There are a lot like me that will never buy one, but I'll buy a coyote V8.
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Meant to say 1 dealerships mechanics.
I have many Ford techs in my phone, most Drive EB 150's or PS 250's. All with Turbo's. They swear by them. They don't speak badly about the 5.0, they say it is a great motor. All in who you talk to.
If you want MORE Grunt at a lower RPM, you go EB. They get the same MPG +/- 10% of the 5.0, but with more power.
All I can say, is the EB moves this Expy effortlessly. I can say that, cause I have owned 2 15+ Expy's.
Our motor is tried and true, 15+ have the 1st Gen motor with all the fixes learned from the first few years of the EB in the 150. If you want to get accurate longevity, go on to the 150 forums and ask the 2014 150 owners. Their drivetrain is the closest to ours.
What BS have you been reading, obviously not REAL numbers. The Explorer is the highest selling Midsize SUV in the US. Pretty sure it is the highest overall SUV. That was even for the first half of 2017!
JExpedition07
That One Member
The 2.3 Ecoboost sales numbers are absolutely atrocious and worst in class, they added displacement because nobody bought them but it's still not working. The explorer sells most with the naturally aspirated 3.5 V6 engine and 3.5 ecoboost in second. I am talking powertrain sales figures not explorer as a whole... the small displacement ecoboost sells the least by far. I'm not saying there is no market for the ecoboost I'm just saying there is a big market for the 5.0 and in this truck there is demand for it. Btw the ecoboost really can't be compared to the 6.7 Powerstroke they have nothing in common, the only gasoline engine we can really even put in It's league is the 6.2 V8.
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Where did your kill story go? The 07 vs 16 0-60 is 2.5 seconds difference, and the 15+ is a little heavier because of added safety features. Off the line a 15+ will easily walk you.
You mentioned TFL Truck. Not sure what video you watched...click on the following link, scroll to 10:45 in the video. Right at the end they floored it, and it did not immediately gain speed. But it maintained a much lower RPM, had a better time overall, and they raved about it cruising up with little effort. That was against the 6.2 in a Denali with 40 more HP.
I have been watching Roman and his crew for years...so good try.
Why if there is Soooo much demand for the 5.0 do the Eco’s, both 2.7 and 3.5 people rave about once they drive one. I love the fact that people who are speaking negatively about the EB, don’t own one. Those of us that drive them, speak VERY highly of them.
I drove all the Large SUV’s out there when we were picking out our 15, we have Limited EL 4x4. Drove a Suburban, and it felt like it couldn’t get out of its own way. Loved the interior. In order to get the 6.2 at the time I had to go to a GMC Denali, and 15K more. Loved our 15 so much, when a lady cut my wife off at 45MPH and it was totaled, we bought a 17 that was EXACTLY the same. Wife didn’t even hesitate. She wanted the same!
For the OP, buy a EB 15+, you won’t regret it!
ExpeditionAndy
Full Access Members
http://carsalesbase.com/us-car-sales-data/ford/ford-explorer/
Ford Explorer
2016 248.507
2015 249.251
2014 209.994
2013 192.397
2012 164.207
2011 135.704
2010 60.687
2009 52.190
2008 78.439
2007 137.817
2006 179.229
2005 239.788
2004 339.333
2003 373.118
2002 433.847
2001 415.921
2000 445.157
1999 428.772
1998 431.488
1997 383.852
1996 402.663
1995 395.227
1994 278.065
1993 302.201
1992 306.681
1991 250.059
1990 159.626
Ford Explorer
2016 248.507
2015 249.251
2014 209.994
2013 192.397
2012 164.207
2011 135.704
2010 60.687
2009 52.190
2008 78.439
2007 137.817
2006 179.229
2005 239.788
2004 339.333
2003 373.118
2002 433.847
2001 415.921
2000 445.157
1999 428.772
1998 431.488
1997 383.852
1996 402.663
1995 395.227
1994 278.065
1993 302.201
1992 306.681
1991 250.059
1990 159.626
JExpedition07
That One Member
I deleted it because it was a long post... Andy those sales figures you post mean nothing to this conversation that's including all powertrains. Not to be a A hole. I'll repost it I hammered down against a new expy out of the tolls at 20mph because he was trying to fly past me threw the EZpass lane to the left of me to cut me out... there was barely any difference in speed at all and I won simply because I maintained a straight line and he had to hit the breaks where it reduces to two lanes... he didn't have the speed to overtake me and flipped out when he lost and told me I was number one with his finger. He may have been faster over a long haul but from 20-80 mph he couldn't pass me and he had a long run to do it, and oh how much he tried to no success. I will say he was slightly quicker but the speed came on way to slow. 0-60 on 07 is 7.5 seconds the new one is 6.5 seconds that's not two seconds FYI. That 6.2 is now available in the Tahoe RST btw sick looking truck... the difference there is that powertrain will have double or triple the life of ecoboost. I have never heard anyone down talk the 5.0 coyote everyone says how great it is. The 5.0 has 395 horsepower and 400 lb ft of torque the thing flies... they use a blown 5.0 in the Shelby F-150 and get 750 horsepower out of it. I understand I sound like an ultra opinionated A hole but I do recognize the ecoboosts high output and usefulness I'm not saying it's a bad engine, I'm just saying it's not a replacement for the bigger V8 in HD application. In our trucks I think reluctantly that it's fine and will work great because we don't work these all that hard.
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