HELP - 04 Expy won't start

[gbostick82]

Hello All,
I've been searching the threads trying to find something similar to what my Expy is doing/did and found some similar situations but thought I'd check on some other opinions.

Today I started my 2004 Expy XLT 5.4L 4x4 (which just surpassed 100k miles) and I heard a loud vacuum/blowing type sound which seemed like it might be coming from the floor or behind the dash. This is the first time I've heard this before. About a half mile down the road as I was trying to think of what this sound might be my gauges went dead with the needles flying to the far right then to the left and sitting for a few seconds before coming back to normal and at that point, the vacuum sound stopped. The car drove fine until arriving at my destination to which now I can't get the car to start. The radio, a/c blower, gauges seem to come on and work for me, I haven't tried the windows or lights but when I turn the ignition, nothing. No clicking, no trying to turn just an instrument panel thats all like up with my check gauge light and several others on.

I called a friend with a 99 Expy and he suggested it was the starter which he thinks has gone bad, my father in law was suggesting the alternator and/or batter, and when I called the dealer they said none of those things would make the gauges act up and that it would have to be something that ran to the GEM module and they're saying either a bad GEM module and/or fuse box due to water damage or possible a bad ignition switch.

I'm fairly good with instruction and have been starting to work on my cars a little more recently but before I have towed tomorrow I debating on whether to have taken to my house for more access to work on the car or to take directly to shop to let somebody who does this for a living handle.

Any advice or if you need more info, please ask and I will try to provide.

 

[Stoned06]

I know on the 97-03 F150's the gauge sweep was an indication of a battery going dead. I would first test the battery, or go to Autozone or the like and have them test it for you, or you could try jumping the vehicle. If it jumps, then the battery/alternator could be bad. If the battery is good, then the alternator is still good since when those go bad, they kill the battery. Does the car crank over? If so the starter is OK. If not, the starter or relay could be bad.
I am still trying to determine what could make the vacuum sound. A bad alternator? The starter staying engaged...but that would usually be a loud gear grinding that is easily detected. A spike in the voltage causing the fan or blower to speed up. Don't really know what that could be. Good luck in determining the problem.

 

[gbostick82]

I'm going to try and jump in the morning, the truck is stuck in a strip mall parking lot right now. I'm hoping it's the battery, that could be the easiest solution. I've got no crank however, everything warms up with the key two thirds turned (ACC position I believe) but when you try to turn over, it's as if I had done nothing at all.

The dealer service department seemed to think it couldn't be the battery, starter, alternator etc. They're telling me that the only thing that would control the gauges would come from something in or behind the fuse box.

Also, I didn't mention before but after trying to start once I had turned the ignition off, I did smell a slight burnt odor near the battery and the firewall. I couldn't smell from inside but when I had the hood up and walked over to that side of the car to look at the battery I noticed it. Also, the battery is fairly new, thinking about 18 months old +/-.

 

[ELVATO]

Does your mileage show up, or is it a bunch of dashes? I remember my dash lit up like a Christmas tree when the PCM relay part of the fuse box gave out. You'll have a burnt PCM relay if it's bad.

Also, when the gauges flew, did the engine cut out, or was it just the gauge cluster that lost power?

Take off the trim piece going to the fuse box, and see if there is any water back there? Also, have your manual ready, and check all your relays and fuses. The half relays (smaller, skinny ones) can be interchanged. The same goes for the bigger ones.

Also, make sure the connections to the battery are OK.

 

[gbostick82]

When the gauges flew, the engine didn't cut out, just the cluster, and it only lasted for a few seconds but that's also when the blowing/vacuum sound died and went away. My mileage does show up, no dashes there.

I did take off the trim piece and look into the fuse box, no water present at first glance, took flashlight and looked down into wire clusters below fuse box and no water present there either, and flooring all seemed dry around also. No rains been present over the past few days either.

I did check the connection from the battery into the firewall and that seemed to have a good connection. As for the relays and the half relays, I'm a novice when it comes to this stuff...it sounds like your saying they're interchangeable and relay 1 can be swapped for relay's 2-6 w/o issue? Same for 201, 202, or 203...Manual says that 203 is my PCM Relay...are you saying that I should take out 201 (trailer tow park lamp) and put into bank 203 and see if that is the issue?

Please forgive my ignorance, I hope to continue to learn as I go on much of this.

 

[gbostick82]

As a quick updated, I tried to jump the car this morning and no luck with that. I also swapped a couple different relay's into relay 1 to see if the relay was bad, however the high beams, park lamps and rear defroster worked when checking the different ones. I also, swapped out relay 203 as that was a PCM relay. Still not making any progress.

I tapped on the starter a few times to see if that made any difference, it didn't.

All electical components seem to be working, windows, high and low beams, parking lamps, odometer, rear defrost, radio, drivers seat, interior lamps, instrument panel, etc. If I was having the leaking through the windshield issue like I've read about from others wouldn't these systems not be working properly? Battery seems to be in good shape, maybe not enought voltage to turn over but I thought I would get a clicking sound or something of the sorts if that was the issue.

 

[Stoned06]

Have you looked under the loom cover on the passenger side firewall? That is where the starter relay is. It's possible that fried and that is what the burnt smell was. The whirring could have been associated with the starter selonoid until it or the relay burnt up.

 

[gbostick82]

Thanks for everyone's help and ideas. After having to get the car towed and not having the ability to get started or worried not to have the necessary equipment at the house to test the starter, alternator, ignition switch and the likes...I had the car towed to Firestone who after testing said the starter was gone, replaced for $189 part and $59 labor. Expedition has been starting just fine for the last two days and doesn't seem to have any additional issues right now.

 

[Xpedmom]

I have an 06 5.4l 2wd and yesterday it started to miss at an idle and when i would give it gas it was stop but as soon as i would slow down or stop it would start back up. Pulled into a sonic car hop turned it off to order and it would not start back... We rolled it out and finally go it started took it to the local part store and they said #2 bank was running rich code pending, and today we replaced the mass air flow sensor but for me to get it to start i have to go from off to run on the switch several times before it will start. Does anyone have any other ideas what could be wrong??????

 

[ELVATO]

So you basically have to prime it in order to start? How many miles are on the fuel filter?