New Expedition Owner from IN

[csanch40]

What's up Expedition Forum,

I just picked up my used '04 Expedition XLT after a pretty long search for a second vehicle for camping trips and tailgating. I had looked at several tahoes, suburbans, and expeditions and settled on the expedition because on a vehicle to vehicle comparison, it by far ran the best and had the most extensive service records of any I could find (regular oil changes especially after 100k). It also had only 148k miles and one of the last production 2v 5.4. I was trying to avoid early model 3v 5.4's.

Overall, I am pretty happy with the car and especially what I paid for it. With that being said, I have it in the shop now to fix some things I noticed when buying it. I definitely have a few questions for the forum on their experience with these issues and what to expect

1. It has a pinion seal leak. (I've read this to be pretty common around 150k)

2. It has some valve cover gasket leaks (Again pretty common for mileage and age I hope)

3. It needed new brake pads (Regular wear and tear.)

4. I'm debating switching to 5w30 on this engine. I know its common on the 3v 5.4. Anybody run 5w30 on their 2v? I do live in northern Indiana and winters can be cold and brutal.

5. I've also noticed some "pudding" on the oil cap after short trips. Pulled the dipstick and the oil was clean and no sign of a coolant leak. Looking down into the fill spout it looked clean as well. I know this can be condensation and perhaps mean a new PCV valve is needed.

Other than that the tranny fluid looked clean and it runs and drives like a champ. As it is an older used car, I am not looking for 10 more years, but hopefully a few more and to make it to 200k and few good road trips. Any words of wisdom to help me get there are much appreciated.

 

[Aspen03]

Welcome! Nice color. I'm down in Brownsburg myself

Pinion seal was done on mine at 172k so you're right in that range I'd say.

Brakes are a pretty easy job on these guys plenty of working room, just have to sling a 70# tire/wheel out of the way.

I run 10w30 Mobile 1 full synthetic in mine, no issues. My expedition is sitting at 220k currently and it runs great. I dont park in a garage and the cold had no apparent affect this year aside from door latches getting stuck and not closing.... Previous owner was in Coatesville and ran it for at least 35k before I purchased it according to the records I have.

If the oil was otherwise clean you're fine. All of my GM 3800's would do that because I made very short trips and didnt always get to operating temp for more than a couple minutes. A PCV is so cheap and easy to do yourself, might as well.

I was in the same boat as you selection wise, there aren't many around here w decent miles and condition. I see the front plate in the pic did you get that here in Brownsburg? I know Estes has many lots but the big Ford one is a few minutes from my house. If so nice find, I missed that one. I picked up an 03 navigator about 2 weeks ago and was also looking at expeditions but couldn't find much in indy area that wasnt either overpriced, a 3v, or in awful shape body/interior wise.

The tahoe/suburban and the like of this same era are awful compared to expedition imo. There is so much more flexibility and passenger room in these, suspension setup, cabin noise, electrical reliability, it's amazing Chevy sold anything back them unless people just dodnt even try an expedition. I know what I would have chosen if I had 50k to blow in 2003.

 

[csanch40]

Hey Aspen03,

Thanks for your reply! I'm up in West Lafayette and I did buy it at the big Brownsburg Bill Estes Ford lot. They had a good dealer markup on this one, I'm assuming for the low mileage and very clean interior. However, it does have a good dent on the driver fender. Knowing this, as well as noticing some of the other issues I saw, I shot an offer quite a bit below what they wanted and they took it. I walked out with tax and title paid and a temp registration good til August. (Which I think is a great deal over the private party deals I was in, considering what hell the BMV will be given this pandemic)

I think next oil change I will switch to something heavier and definitely full synthetic. Glad to hear you have no issues.

Also, I agree with you about the Ford vs GM competition in this time period. With respect to GM the 5.3 is a good engine however I noticed so many other issues with the tahoes and suburbans I saw when looking. One had bad electrical problems, one had bad ABS issues, and IMO their interiors did not hold up like Ford products (Drivers seats, center consoles, switches and other instruments, etc. I also could hardly find a suburban with 2nd row bench seats. The ride quality is also much better in the Expy (This won my wife over).

What is frustrating is that this segment of vehicle is dying as a whole industry wide. Body on Frame SUV's with simple V8 engines and 4 or 5 speed trannys will be harder and harder to find. Everything will be highly technical VVT or small turbo engines married to some 10 speed tranny. Progress is good on MPG, but not good on maintenance costs..

As for this Expy I just bought. I am hoping to give it some more life and buy it/me some time before I have to cross that bridge into a more modern SUV. I am just glad that Ford Offered the 5.4 until 2013 or 2014. Fingers crossed.

 

[Aspen03]

The BMV was actually quite pleasant. They just opened up the one here in town the other day for appointments only. I had to register and plate the Navigator. I walked to door, confirmed my appointment, escorted me to a station, did the paperwork, dropped some cash, done in 9 minutes. Entire thing round trip including driving took me less than 20. I had a tv being mounted and was back before they finished. I was you guys should just keep this up.

Estes tends to run high on a lot of their vehicles list prices but are usually open to negotiating as long as you dont have some comission crazed salesperson out for blood. Of the people I've known that purchased there most felt they got a reasonable deal. A few got taken but that's half their own fault since they signed off on a bad deal.

As long as it was maintained I'm sure you'll see some decent life out of it. Like I said I'm at 220k and would fully expect this to go another 50k it runs so well and had good maintenance history

The interior quality of Chevy is pretty terrible until you get into the 2013ish era, whenever they did the major revisions on vehicles. The buttons and finishes on anything from about 1999-2010 are awful. I've seen 60k mi vehicles w hvac controls you just have to guess at what button is what.

The 4spd of these is definitely an Achilles heel for economy. It's astounding someone couldn't manage a 5 or 6spd back then, they existed just not in a heavy truck segment. Gas was cheap though so, ya.

I wanted captains chairs in the expedition and couldn't find one that did. Now that I have one I've seen like 30 of them, all w trashy bodies though and wouldn't have made my criteria for purchase anyway. The navigator has the 2nd row console and while that's not ideal for us, I still like it better than a bench looks wise. We have 6 people in the family, just had to adjust who sits where. I wanted the captains to have separation between kids and have easy access to the back. For now we just flip up a seat but I know one day something there will fail so trying to eliminate that.

For me I think I would take an EcoBoost over the 3v. I actually like the 15+ models quite a bit. They're a different animal driving wise, very quiet. I would like to pick up a low mi super clean 17 EL Limited or so that has the longest warranty possible. Not ready for that payment yet however. I enjoy having no debt other than the house.

 

[csanch40]

Hey Aspen03,

Glad the BMV was easy. I guess that makes sense though.

A little update. Like I thought the shop came back and I definitely needed the brakes and pinion seal done. They also came back and said that the valve gaskets were not the problem, but an intake manifold leak of coolant was the culprit. They said it was very common on the 2V 5.4. Unfortunately, the estimate on doing everything was more than I could take in one swipe, so I am starting with the brakes and pinion seal. I am going to have to drive carefully until next month when I can get it back in.

I am a little disappointed that Estes let so much slide on this. And perhaps a little disappointed in myself for gambling on this car. At the very least I would expect them to have put on some safe brakes. The other repairs I can understand. Anyway it was a cash as-is deal and they took my very very low offer, so I guess we both got what we deserved.

Yeah captians chairs are great for families getting in and out. We only have 2 dogs at the moment so the bench helps keep them settled lol. My experience with EcoBoost has been a little fraught. We had an escape with the 1.6L and the car went through 2 engines and multiple codes and coolant issues. We tried to like the car but couldn't come around to it. On the other hand my brother has the F150 with the V6 EcobBoost and it seems like a great engine on that platform. He has 100k trouble free miles. Maybe one day my ecoboost anxiety will subside and I will gamble on one. But like you, I am not looking to add more debt.

 

[Aspen03]

Unfortunately most dealers don't service 16 year old vehicles unless its something that they can market as a huge benefit. It's not profitable mostly because If someone sees this shiny new part then they are like I see you did this so you HAD to see this why wasnt it fixed and so on. I'm sure the brakes were "safe" as in operable. Thats probably the one thing they would do since it could result in an accident on a test drive if anything. If you're able and saves you $ do your own brakes. Minimal tools required other than a jack and stands to hold the massive beast. RockAuto has kits for all 4 wheels on the low $200 range with rotors/pads. Depending on the mood of your local O'Reilly Auto Parts a lot of times theyll match prices on same/similar product, with the RA shipping cost taken into account of course. Nice way to save a few extra bucks if you cant afford to wait on something.

No idea what you paid but if you got it for around 3.5-4k you wont be bad total investment wise I dont think. Probably in closer to 6k at that point after repairs which at 148k and if its clean and nothing rotting out isn't bad. These vehicles are getting to a point where a slight premium will be paid for a decent example if you really want it. If its over that and you're planning to keep this awhile then you probably still did just alright so long as no other major things pop up in the next year.

I pretty much plan on throwing 1k at any vehicle in the course of a year. If it's less I chalk it up as a win. That's 1-2 payments on a new vehicle. I'll take that anyway. I'll be a little over for 2020 on the expedition but only because it will need tires heading into winter, that's not a repair in my eyes so not counting being over the budget, still I expect to be no more than 1500 in maintenance and repair for this year unless something catastrophic fails. I tend to take fairly good care of my vehicles, it helps having 3 mechanics in my family, each w a different fondness/experience. One works almost exclusively on imports, one won't touch an import w a 10ft pole and my uncle has been repairing/building transmissions for about 35 years. Anything internal is over my head but if its something I can see or touch I can usually handle the repair. Having been a tech for a bit helps in diagnostics and means I have tools.


I'm surprised you didn't smell any coolant on inspection if it was leaking though it was also very windy the past few days and could easily be missed if standing in the wrong spot.

I'm in the process of selling a vehicle myself and one of the first things I did was steam clean the engine bay...a week before posting it so I could see any leaks I wasnt aware of and didn't give a surprise to someone. I try to e as fair as can be when selling and give all the info up front. Might cost me a few bucks but better than the headache of someone complaining after the fact, that and people are crazy so no telling what they'll do and then they know where you're at.

 

[csanch40]

Yeah I'm actually in a little under the 3.5k when you factor in price before tax, title, and license. That fact is really keeping me sane right now considering that I could have paid what they wanted. So fair to say we are all breaking a little even here. You are absolutely right. These cars from this era are harder and harder to find at a decent price and clean. The era is over, even though people like us still find the great value this segment still has. So considering I found one at all with very low mileage for the age is a win.

I don't think I got the coolant smell because the car hadn't been run much until I bought it. Looking at the mileage on it from when it was traded in and when I purchased it.

I'm from California originally and my Dad who was technician is not here to help me so I definitely miss having family as a resource to fix cars. Glad that you benefit from it! I recently sold a car as well and I probably overcommunicated all the issues with it. At least I could live with myself and felt like no one was going to come back and mess with me for selling a falsely advertised car!

 

[Adieu]

The BMV was actually quite pleasant. They just opened up the one here in town the other day for appointments only. I had to register and plate the Navigator. I walked to door, confirmed my appointment, escorted me to a station, did the paperwork, dropped some cash, done in 9 minutes. Entire thing round trip including driving took me less than 20. I had a tv being mounted and was back before they finished. I was you guys should just keep this up.

Estes tends to run high on a lot of their vehicles list prices but are usually open to negotiating as long as you dont have some comission crazed salesperson out for blood. Of the people I've known that purchased there most felt they got a reasonable deal. A few got taken but that's half their own fault since they signed off on a bad deal.

As long as it was maintained I'm sure you'll see some decent life out of it. Like I said I'm at 220k and would fully expect this to go another 50k it runs so well and had good maintenance history

The interior quality of Chevy is pretty terrible until you get into the 2013ish era, whenever they did the major revisions on vehicles. The buttons and finishes on anything from about 1999-2010 are awful. I've seen 60k mi vehicles w hvac controls you just have to guess at what button is what.

The 4spd of these is definitely an Achilles heel for economy. It's astounding someone couldn't manage a 5 or 6spd back then, they existed just not in a heavy truck segment. Gas was cheap though so, ya.

I wanted captains chairs in the expedition and couldn't find one that did. Now that I have one I've seen like 30 of them, all w trashy bodies though and wouldn't have made my criteria for purchase anyway. The navigator has the 2nd row console and while that's not ideal for us, I still like it better than a bench looks wise. We have 6 people in the family, just had to adjust who sits where. I wanted the captains to have separation between kids and have easy access to the back. For now we just flip up a seat but I know one day something there will fail so trying to eliminate that.

For me I think I would take an EcoBoost over the 3v. I actually like the 15+ models quite a bit. They're a different animal driving wise, very quiet. I would like to pick up a low mi super clean 17 EL Limited or so that has the longest warranty possible. Not ready for that payment yet however. I enjoy having no debt other than the house.

You can just remove the midrow middle seat for a walkway to the back

 

[Aspen03]

I've considered that but the lack of an arm rest on the outboard seats wouldnt lend as much comfort. I'd really like to find a set of chairs to swap. Assuming that's possible anyway. I figure it's all about the same mounting since they move and fold in the same manner.

 

[joethefordguy]

i bought an 04 SSV 4x4 a year ago; it was under 100K miles. it was in showroom condition, especially the interior. I think it was a fire department supervisor's vehicle. all told, including fuel and tires - absolutely everything - I've got $12,410.22 in it now and it's sitting at 103,098 miles. i couldn't be happier with this truck.

I do plan on keeping it considerably longer than ten years. at my age, it should see me out.

edit: FWIW the closest comp i can find anywhere is about 7K. it's over mileage, not as clean or in as good shape, and it's not an SSV.