Plz help, rough idle when warm

[undzis]

I have an 05 expedition with 167k miles on it. A wk ago it start running really bad and even stalling. I replaced the fuel filter. It was really bad. After that got changed i could smell gas due to bad spark plugs. So i changed all the plugs. After the new plugs the truck ran great till after driving it for 15mins. Then it would run really rough and had a terrible idle while in gear. Shift it to park or neutral and everything would smooth out and run fine. Also, while in gear if i give it gas it would smooth out and run great again. I have no noticeable lost of power or anything. Well the check engine light cam on and gave 2 codes. Code 0022 and 0345. i replaced the driver side cam position sensor but it didnt fix the problem. So i dropped it off at a local shop.

Today they said the truck had low oil pressure and there was a knock. The knocking im assuming they hear is a diesel like sound that i get from time to time. It has done that since i bought the truck a year ago. Never had any problems til now though. I spoke with them real quick as they were leaving for the day. tomorrow im suppose to talk to them about possible solutions and cost to fix. He suggested that the low oil pressure is do to oil pump but i may need a new motor.

I know there is a very common problem with the cam phasers in this ver motor. Could this be my real problem and not motor or oil pump? I find it hard to believe that i would possible need a new motor when it runs so smooth when cold or while driving. theres no misfire, loss of power or anything wrong other then at idle and in gear after it warms up.

This all started after adding new oil. i used 5w20 castrol oil. oil fillter should probably be replace but i didnt do a full oil change only added oil because it was low. Also i hear using other oil filter other then motorcraft might cause issue and i know it isnt a motorcraft filter on it. But it has ran fine till now. i am due for a new oil change though.

Im at a total loss as to what to think or due atm. Could flushing motor help? Any and all is much appreciated.

 

[undzis]

Also just wanted to add. Oil pressure gauge has always and still reads about 3/4 of the way up the gauge. indicating that i should have good oil pressure. But the shop says that my oil pressure is bad so im assuming they know what they are doing and they're correct about the oil pressure being bad.

 

[FordandPolaris]

I would change the oil completely, including new filter first. Check to see how dirty it is. The diesel clatter is a common problem I think with the 2nd gens. Something with the timing chain guides wearing over time, although I do not have personal experience, only what I have read from others on here. I would not always trust a shop's word, some of the shady ones try and get you to let them replace things that might not necessarily be broken simply for profit purposes. Dealerships will do this too. If you dont use that shop a lot or are indifferent with who you take it to, I would get a second opinion. I would check all vacuum hoses. Do you have a check engine light on? If you do, bring it to a local auto parts store, most will let you borrow a code reader for free in order to read what the light is on for. If you are unsure, they can help you as well.

 

[Whack]

Heard one about a F150 guy that was told that and it turned out to be a cheap fix.

Did the shop measure oil psi manually? what was the reading?

If oil PSI is good, the Cam Phaser Solenoids could be gunked up... major issues with the Cam timing control can cause these codes.

2004 Ford F-150: 5.4L..the VCT Solenoid..check engine..runs fine - JustAnswer

Item #22 in the diagram on the above link points them out.

Best bet is to pull each one and check for debris in the lower screened section.

 

[undzis]

thanks for the advice. I think ill settle up with he shop then try changing the oil and filter and see what happens. ya, there are 2 codes. one is for the the cam timing sensor, which i replaced. the other is the vct solenoid stuck open. Both caan be cause by low oil pressure. This happened right after adding 5w/20 oil like recommended. could using a thinker oil possible fix this like 5w/30 or 15/40 or something? if so what weight oil should i use? If you or anybody else could chim in on any possible ideas i would love to here them. this is the first time ive ever put a car in the shop. ive always been able to fix things myself. ive just been at such a lost. Like many other money is tight and im not afraid to do the work myself. married with 3 kids has a way of doing that to a person . Thanks again.

 

[undzis]

thanks whack for the link. idk exactly what was done. i go there tomorrow to see what all was done exactly and check. i called like 10 mins before the shop closed since i havent heard from them. He half seamed like he didn't want to talk to me about it on the phone. he mentions possible new oil pump or new motor. but since the motor runs so smooth in park, neutral and when im accelerating or just cruising. I cant understand why i would need a new motor though. i will post back tomorrow once i know more. but i know ask about the psi so that's a plus. ty. Would an engine flush help clear out debris if theres any there?

 

[Whack]

Stick to 5w20... Motorcraft makes a semi-syn that is normally available for cheap. I use Mobil 1 which in my location is found for $28 per 5qts. Also make sure you run the spec Motorcraft filter. Double check me, but we run the FL 820s...

You really need to beat them up on the Oil PSI!!! IF they mechanically tested and got a low ball reading, there is a good chance that a new oil pump is in order. With 167K worth of work and sludge, it wouldn't be unusual to need to pop the pan and replace the pump.

If they only tested per the factory manual steps and the only thing left is oil problems, then they need to do a pressure test to confirm low oil pressure is present.

Engine flushing is hit and miss... I got lucky that a few 5000mi changes with Mobil 1 and the MC filter cleaned it up well. I did pop in Sea Foam 500 miles before a few oil changes per directions... I got darker oil in a few hundred miles and changed it with a 0w20 or 5w20 depending on temp outside.

You do risk knocking some stuff loose when doing a flush or using Sea Foam. If that stuff gets loose it can clog all sorts of places like VCT systems or small oil passages. Only way to tell how bad the sludge/varnish/gunk has gotten is to pop the valve covers, timing cover, or pan.

 

[myself]

What usually happens is the VCTs are checked and replaced and no change. Then the cam phasers. The 345 code indicates a bad sensor, but changing that will not fix it either.

The fact it did it after you changed your oil and after your engine gets hot means that at the point where the oil is the thinnest it possibly be, something is not moving the valves correctly. This leads to it being the timing chain and/or tensioners. Generally the latter failes and causes the chains to break or at the min skip a tooth. That small skip can be the issue, but you might have to get new chains, guides, tensioners, etc.. to ensure the entire assembly is working right

if you hear a diesel sound, clean the MAF and it can eliminate manifold sound. If its a ticking/breaking sound, its most likely a chain slap which goes back to the above issue