Need more towing grunt-suggestions??????

[captain chaos]

Ok. So here’s the deal: I have a 2000 Expedition 4wd w/ a 4.6 and stock 3.55 gears. Unloaded it cruises right down the hwy, gets decent mpg (for what it is), is comfortable and all is good. The problem is, My family and I really enjoy camping and the second I hook that 24’ TT to it the ‘little engine that could’ it really starts showing its shortcomings. There’s just not enough grunt there.
The thought of running OD with that camper in tow is laughable (I never even try) and even locked in 3rd it has trouble cruising w/ the TC locked if there’s any significant wind (though if the wind is light it will cruise 55-60 just fine). The last camping trip we took had us fighting a 25+mph cross/headwind (basically aimed right at the front fender), I believe “quartering wind” is the term, anyway the old girl was NOT happy. Trying to maintain 56-57mph the thing was struggling to even stay in 3rd. TC lockup was only possible maybe 30/40% of the time. I could just envision screaming hot transmission parts and an engine that was just huffing/puffing as hard as it could. I could clearly use some more grunt. I do realize that those are pretty poor towing conditions though so I don’t expect it to be able to just cruise along happily in 4th fighting a 25mph wind.

Here’s the deal though as there are some complications; I’m not in the market for another vehicle. My Expy is paid for and I have no desire for a car payment on something we drive MAYBE 5000mi/yr (basically just camping and occasional trips). Besides that, we’re looking at possibly moving the in the next yr or 2 so spending is on somewhat of a lockdown.

I know full well the answer is “get a 5.4” but there are some problems there:
-Clean Expys are a hard find around here. Rust is a SERIOUS problem with them and most of the 1st gens are looking pretty beater-ish by now. I really don’t want to get rid of a fairly nice Expedition for what would essentially be a clapped out looking beater. My hatred of car payments prevents dropping enough coin to pick up a newer/nicer version. I know its vain sounding but my wife likes ‘nice-ish’ looking vehicles and I just don’t really want another beater either. I’ve driven PLENTY of them in my day and I’d like to move past that.

-I feel like I get just good enough mpg (~14city/ 19hwy) to justify driving this tank from time to time (which the family and I enjoy). I really don’t want to flush that down the toilet in the name of more HP. I considered looking for a 2wd 5.4 in the hopes of preserving as much of that mpg as possible but those seem to be a rare beast.

So, what I need is a way to get some more ‘umph’ in the 2000-3000rpm range. I don’t care one bit about gaining HP past 3500rpm as I spend 98% of my time in the 2-3k range. That’s where I tow at and that’s where I need the power to be. There are options for gaining hp (headers/tuners/etc) but dyno charts to gauge the difference seem to be hard to find and the ones you do find often don’t show what's going on in the 2-3000rpm range. They all just want to brag about what kind of peak hp they gain (irrelevant).

I feel like a re-gear would help but I don’t want it screaming down the hwy either as 1) it’s annoying when going any distance and 2) it kills mpg.

I was wondering if anyone had some insight or experience that could help me in my quandary. I am open to other vehicles (or even brands) but it MUST have room for 5-6 min (have 3 kids) and be older/affordable (debt=bad).

Thanks. (sorry for the long winded post!)

 

[bedrck46]

I think you really know the answer Get a 5.4 Sad to say.

I had a 99 with 4.6 and a pop-up that weighed around 3000 to 3500 when being towed. Going up hills here in PA was not enjoyable I was lucky if I could maintain 25 mph. I don't consider that being safe and am more of a hazard to others.

I now have a 2001 with 5.4 and on the same hills I have no problem maintaining speed.
The 99 4.6 had 3.55 gears as does the 5.4 although I would prefer the 3.73 gears
I do not know what would be involved in changing gears but that might be something you would want to consider

 

[bedrck46]

check this link As you will see the weights listed can be confusing in that is what they can tow but in reality you will find that even if they can tow that weight the question is how will the engine and gears handle the weight with some power to spare

 

[bcmaxx]

our 2001 5.4 sucks wind on any hill with our 24ft tt, I cant imagine a 4.6! my brother in law tows a 28ft 5th wheel, he actually swaps on smaller tires when he tows ( poor mans gear change) and it works. just a suggestion.

 

[Copper93]

Have you considered new cams. You can get "RV" cams. They offer better low and mid range torque.

 

[captain chaos]

our 2001 5.4 sucks wind on any hill with our 24ft tt, I cant imagine a 4.6! my brother in law tows a 28ft 5th wheel, he actually swaps on smaller tires when he tows ( poor mans gear change) and it works. just a suggestion.

Fortunately, it's very flat here and so long as the wind is mild she does OK. It'll run fine in 3rd with the TC locked. You'll never win any races though. Lol! Any kind of hills or strong winds has her in 2nd gear though trying to maintain 55 (or even close to it)
I already run a 245/70-17 and just put them on (brand new). I just don't care to go smaller.

Have you considered new cams. You can get "RV" cams. They offer better low and mid range torque.

I have considered it but it's tough to find anyone who has any data as to what kind of gains can be expected, especially in that critical 2000-3000rpm range. When you add up cams and a tune that can be an expensive gamble.

 

[bedrck46]

Do you feel safe driving it like that??

 

[captain chaos]

Do you feel safe driving it like that??

Safe, yes.
Do I feel like I'm doing my transmission any favors: NO!

Honestly, the trans is probably my biggest worry. Heat buildup when it can't maintain TC lockup is a pretty serious deal. I'm thinking a trans temp gauge might be in the near future just so I can monitor it.
The engine I'm not too worried about. They'll take a beating, it's just annoying turning tons of rpm to get down the road.

What I'm really after is the ability to maintain TC lockup, in 3rd for 85%+ of the time (remember, mostly flat land here). If it has to drop down to climb a grade that's no biggie.

 

[bedrck46]

look into a OBII Bluetooth device about $10-$15 and the Torque Pro app for a smart phone you would be able to get trans temp

 

[bedrck46]

you list "in a van down by the river" and then say "remember, mostly flat land here"
Is that in the state of confusion??

 

[captain chaos]

"Is that in the state of confusion?? "

NO, but I visit there often.

The van thing is just a reference to my favorite SNL skit.
I reside in the crap-hole known as Indiana.

 

[bedrck46]

You say you feel safe driving it like it is. In my opinion I disagree for the following reason. Anytime your towing and feel underpowered or you have to fight the winds due to being underpowered I would say that isn't very safe conditions especially having a wife and 3 little ones on board. Look into selling your 4.6 and find one with a 5.4 I doubt that there would be a big difference in what you sell one for and what you would pay for. I sold my 99 4.6 for $2600 and found a 2001 5.4 EB for $2100. that left me with $500 to have the windshield, and exhaust manifold replaced
Again just my opinion

 

[01yellerCobra]

IMO the usual bolt ons (headers, intake, tuner) aren't going to give you enough to make a difference. The 4.6 just isn't big enough. I think your choices are to swap a 5.4 into your truck since you want to keep it or step up to forced induction. A PD would give you the oomph you're looking for in the range you want.

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[sgtowing]

Supercharger???????

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

 

[Madmaxwell87]

You mention 2-3k rpm as where you spend your time but according to this link Ford 4.6L & 5.4L Specs | Ford Modular V-8 peak torque for the 4.6 is at 4,000 rpm so you need to wind the motor out higher to get peak efficiency. Your tires are about a 1/2" taller than stock so you if you hadn't just got new tires you could downsize. Bolt ons will help but wont change anything drastically as mentioned. With all the other restrictions your options are a gear swap to get the rpm up and the load moving easier or forced induction for more power all over. To do forced induction safely and reliably for towing you'd want to swap in a lighting motor so a gear swap would be much cheaper (~$1200).

 

[bcmaxx]

Safe, yes.
Do I feel like I'm doing my transmission any favors: NO!

Honestly, the trans is probably my biggest worry. Heat buildup when it can't maintain TC lockup is a pretty serious deal. I'm thinking a trans temp gauge might be in the near future just so I can monitor it.
The engine I'm not too worried about. They'll take a beating, it's just annoying turning tons of rpm to get down the road.

What I'm really after is the ability to maintain TC lockup, in 3rd for 85%+ of the time (remember, mostly flat land here). If it has to drop down to climb a grade that's no biggie.

I just added a cooler, and a deep trans pan after watching my temp readings, even on a light hill. all good now. I'm sure just an aux cooler would help. I only use o/d at highway speed. The edge cts does a wonderful job of shifting and maintaining lockup. I fine tuned my 1-2 and 2-3 timing and firmness

 

[larry7]

Hmm...I see questions like this all the time. I have 2 campers, kept the old one for my grown children to use when I bought the new one. I'm on camping forums, diesel forums, truck forums yada yada yada. I'm also a truck driver for buster brown. Some one is always trying to get more power out of a small block gasser for towing. I really haven't seen an acceptable answer. It is what is. You could spend alot of money making power, but its expensive, and not really driveable, think race car. As others have said minor changes and mods won't give you anything you'll notice and you're just wasting money. The other thing is gassers make their power at high rpms, the very thing you're trying to avoid. Thats how they're designed. The only way to get power at lower rpms is a blower/turbo, think diesel or eco boost, thats why these motors are such great towing engines. It doesn't help that campers are the worst towing trailer out there. The high flat front end tows like a brick. I'd guess a 6000lb boat would probably tow better than a 4000lb camper (on flat ground). If you can live with being slow then spend the money on the trans, beef it up with a custom build. You're right in worrying about the long term damage so bring it up to par and live the motor. You can't hurt the motor. Personally I dont like being slow.I tow the camper with a diesel pickup. At work however I drive what they give me. When I'm loaded at 80,000lbs in the hills of PA or WV I just deal with it. I might be going 45 by the time I top a hill, something like Fancy Gap and I could be doing 30. There's nothing I can do about it so I don't let it bother me. But again, IMHO, if you decide to do anything at all spend it on the trans and or gearing. Forget about fuel economy, you cant have it all, you said you only drive it 5000 miles a year anyway.