Been a while has anyone else had this issue?

[ONEBADMK8]

Hello All. I have my trusty 2003 EB 5.4 with 244k miles.

Recently, new cam and crank sensors (were not needed lol)

What it does is this?

Started up last week ran fine ALL day went to visit a friend, came out to start it up to find it running very odd, stumbling, NO throttle resp. (when I hit throttle it died instantly) then I kept trying to restart it and about 10 tries it started perfectly and ran FINE again until the next day when I started it same thing. NO codes at all.

Fuel pump is working, one thing I tried was to reset the ecm (pos/neg touch) this seemed to work so I am leaning towards ecm but these very rarely go anyone else have or had this issue? I do not want to start firing the parts cannon, thank you in advance. I also have videos, can I post them on here?

I am leaning on ECM because NO codes and resetting it seems to get it to work until I restart, super strange.

 

[Hamfisted]

Do you know if it's the original fusebox and fuel pump ? Next time it does it spray some starter fluid in the throttle-body and see if it fires right up.

 

[ONEBADMK8]

Do you know if it's the original fusebox and fuel pump ? Next time it does it spray some starter fluid in the throttle-body and see if it fires right up.

Yes but I do not think it would be that because when it does fire up and run fine I can drive it to Florida as long as I do not shut it off, fp is fine too. 2 sec prime can be heard as well.

 

[ONEBADMK8]

Do you know if it's the original fusebox and fuel pump ? Next time it does it spray some starter fluid in the throttle-body and see if it fires right up.

Fuel pump was replaced in 2014.

 

[whtbronco]

You described the same symptoms I had when my fuel pump relay was failing.

 

[ONEBADMK8]

You described the same symptoms I had when my fuel pump relay was failing.

Really? I have videos and I cant post them. It will start fine in AM and then 10 min in it will start the rumpity rump then stall, then when I reset the ECM w pos/neg method it is fine until I shut it off again. Is this what yours did?

 

[whtbronco]

Yep, except I never tried resetting the ECM/PCM. I just shut it off and waited a few seconds or sometimes a few minutes. I didn't let this continue for long before fixing it though. As the relay heated up the connection got poor or was lost and as it cooled down again the connection was adequate. It was easy to figure out the cause due to the burnt electrical smell from the central junction box/fuse box behind the passenger kick panel. You may be able to repair it by just replacing the fuel pump relay.

The fuel pump can also exhibit very similar symptoms though which is why Hamfisted suggested the start fluid test.

When my fuel pump finally failed I noticed it sounded a bit off on 2 starts, figured I'd work on it over the weekend. The 3rd start was the end. It stumbled and barely ran, hit the throttle and it died. Restarted a couple times and then the pump totally failed. I listen to my fuel pump at startup every time though, with no accessories on at startup ever, or I wouldn't have known until the start attempt when it failed.

Basically if you have a poor electrical connection anywhere in the fuel pump system you may have the same symptoms.

There's a lot of good related info in this thread as well.

Another fuse box replacement ....

Just replaced my '03's fuse box again. The second fuse box was installed in January 2014 due to the typical melted fuel pump relay and PCM relay. It was manufactured in November of 2013 but still had the old 15 amp Osram fuel pump relay and other micro relays just like the original '03 fuse box...

www.expeditionforum.com

 

[ONEBADMK8]

Yep, except I never tried resetting the ECM/PCM. I just shut it off and waited a few seconds or sometimes a few minutes. I didn't let this continue for long before fixing it though. As the relay heated up the connection got poor or was lost and as it cooled down again the connection was adequate. It was easy to figure out the cause due to the burnt electrical smell from the central junction box/fuse box behind the passenger kick panel. You may be able to repair it by just replacing the fuel pump relay.

The fuel pump can also exhibit very similar symptoms though which is why Hamfisted suggested the start fluid test.

When my fuel pump finally failed I noticed it sounded a bit off on 2 starts, figured I'd work on it over the weekend. The 3rd start was the end. It stumbled and barely ran, hit the throttle and it died. Restarted a couple times and then the pump totally failed. I listen to my fuel pump at startup every time though, with no accessories on at startup ever, or I wouldn't have known until the start attempt when it failed.

Basically if you have a poor electrical connection anywhere in the fuel pump system you may have the same symptoms.

There's a lot of good related info in this thread as well.

Another fuse box replacement ....

Just replaced my '03's fuse box again. The second fuse box was installed in January 2014 due to the typical melted fuel pump relay and PCM relay. It was manufactured in November of 2013 but still had the old 15 amp Osram fuel pump relay and other micro relays just like the original '03 fuse box...

www.expeditionforum.com

TY great info. I have no electrical smell or burnt smell in that area. But Like I said I can be hot or cold drive it all day EVERY shut off I have to reset the ecm to get it to be normal. When it is normal I can drive it ALL day and not a single issue but if I shut it off I have to do that procedure. I have an ECM on the way from my buddy out of a wrecked 03 with my part # so Ill try that. Only thing left after that I would assume would be weird grounding issue? Never seen this before in any vehicle.

 

[ChrisCoffmon]

Seems I had the same issues awhile back. I Swapped fuel pump relay with w/wiper relay to verify. That was my issue. When I bought a new relay and swapped them back out, the relay I bought from the auto parts store didn’t last long before it happened again, more than once this happened. Last one was dealer purchased and fixed it for good. Maybe quality difference in manufacturing??

 

[ONEBADMK8]

Seems I had the same issues awhile back. I Swapped fuel pump relay with w/wiper relay to verify. That was my issue. When I bought a new relay and swapped them back out, the relay I bought from the auto parts store didn’t last long before it happened again, more than once this happened. Last one was dealer purchased and fixed it for good. Maybe quality difference in manufacturing??

TY again for the info. I thought that whole thing was non serviceable? I meant he one in the pass kick panel.

 

[R0cketMan]

The one in the passenger kick panel is “non-serviceable” but you can de-solder the relay from the board and solder in a new one if you have the skill/ability to. I had a similar issue as it would die 10 minutes into my drive, key off, it would start right up and then be fine for the rest of the trip. My fuel pump relay was bad, so I soldered in a 30 amp relay. The OEM is only 10 amps.

 

[R0cketMan]

There was a hole burned into the side of my old relay but I couldn’t see it without taking the fuse panel completely apart down to the circuit board.

 

[ONEBADMK8]

There was a hole burned into the side of my old relay but I couldn’t see it without taking the fuse panel completely apart down to the circuit board.

Awesome ty for that info.

 

[ONEBADMK8]

Well now I have no prime and no fuel at the rail. Either the soldered in relay and or pump.

 

[whtbronco]

Have you had a chance to remove the CJB/fuse panel and inspect the fuel pump relay and the system board?

This thread has a good bit of info related to the CJB:

2003 Ford Expedition Fuel Pump Relay (R303) Damaged

Please help! My 2003 Ford Expedition started randomly stalling and I would wait a few seconds and it would start up until one day it didn’t start at all. I checked the fuse box and discovered the fuel pump relay (R303) was melted above one of the pins. I soldered a new relay (R303) and removed...

www.expeditionforum.com

 

[ONEBADMK8]

Update, relay is clicking and working get the prime for the first 3-4 startups then none, then i smelled fuel (which I did since this started) and now it smells really bad, went to hook up FP gauge to find the Schrader leaking like a siv!! I got it inot the garage and will update tomorrow.

 

[ONEBADMK8]

Did the Schrader valve cause it was GUSHGING fires up ran perfect. Until I shut it off. Went to restart SAME thing. Then it would not even prime. I waited like 10 min, banged on the tank with a wrench, hit they key got a prime and fired right up. Gonna order a fuel pump.

 

[ONEBADMK8]

UPDATE Was the fuel pump. I did the pump & sender that is all it was, running like new again.

 

[whtbronco]

Good news, thanks for the follow-up.

Did you replace the fuel filter as well? I replace my fuel filter every 30k miles or so and rarely get any dirty fuel that drains out of it. When the pump failed it was amazing how much nasty gray crap came out. Maybe coincidence, but I suspect it was bits of the motor.

 

[ONEBADMK8]

Was fuel pump, did new pump and sender all good.