Dice Roll
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I thought it was losing power at 10k miles. Catch can immediately made it feel better.
Spark plugs
- Thread starter 2021Expy
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Boosted
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My Taurus has the non-eco-boost 3.5L and uses the same plugs as our Ecoboost motors. I just put them in at ~127K miles and felt an big difference between the WELL worn plugs.
DieselMonk
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I run stock everything, no catch can and 87 octane. Can’t feel any difference in the wintertime between supreme and regular. Doesn’t matter what I do, if it’s cold out below 5C my fuel economy goes down the drain. Doesn’t matter if I go 110kmh in rear wheel drive or go max 70kmh in 4A for 350km during the snow / ice storm we had 2 weeks ago exactly. Fuel economy was the same with 13.6L / 100km using regular fuel.
When the outside temperature is above 7C, and dry out, makes like at least 1.5L - 2.5l / 100km of difference in fuel economy in mine.
To me having the advantage of high octane fuel during wintertime and living at sea level, not towing, is a waste of $$$. The higher octane fuel is only good in higher elevation, sporty driving, trailer tow, real hot out etc. Neither of we have a lot around here or not doing much either.
Then there is winter blended gasoline which does not have as much energy than summer blended gas. You can do all you want in the winter time on a gas engine, as colder it gets, the worse off your fuel economy is going to be. It’s not like running supreme will offset the cost of fuel consumption. For regular driving it just cost more and the ecoboost drinks it just as much.
Don’t get me wrong, if I tow a trailer, high altitudes, very spirited driving, my SPP does ger premium fuel. Period. But for the regular stuff… nah.
SyndicateZ
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I think people get premium gas as it helps keeeps the valves cleaner
DieselMonk
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No use on this generation ecoboost as it has direct injection and port injection to a total of 12 injectors.
Dice Roll
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Having oil sent into the chamber is a bad deal no matter what they want to claim about the direct injection cleaning it off. I don’t have a logger like I did when I had my ls1 car back in the day, but I’ll tell you what happens.
My ls1 had knock retard consistently showing as I drove in real time with a laptop by my side. It IMO made the car quarter mile inconsistently. I added a set of filters and a catch can made from simple auto store shelf stuff, and the knock retardant went to zero. It had so much oil in the catch can it wasn’t funny, it would even clog those clear filters and I knew it needed changed when the engine lost power.
Anytime oil enters the stream, you are at a disadvantage. Maybe it cleans it off the valve enough, I dunno. Don’t care. That’s bad.
I felt the power drop in the expy and felt it come back over a period of a few hundred miles after the catch can went on. I dump a scandalous amount of oil out every three thousand miles.
My ls1 had knock retard consistently showing as I drove in real time with a laptop by my side. It IMO made the car quarter mile inconsistently. I added a set of filters and a catch can made from simple auto store shelf stuff, and the knock retardant went to zero. It had so much oil in the catch can it wasn’t funny, it would even clog those clear filters and I knew it needed changed when the engine lost power.
Anytime oil enters the stream, you are at a disadvantage. Maybe it cleans it off the valve enough, I dunno. Don’t care. That’s bad.
I felt the power drop in the expy and felt it come back over a period of a few hundred miles after the catch can went on. I dump a scandalous amount of oil out every three thousand miles.
Dice Roll
Full Access Members
As for not feeling the difference in fuel, I’m not sure what to say. I live around 800 feet above sea level and I can notice the power loss in the winter. Rather I can feel the gain when it flips the timing map for the 93.
I don’t log the tanks, but it uses more fuel on 87 too, in city driving anyway. That’s one reason I almost never run 87 and will drop to 89 on occasion. The handful of tanks on 87 told me all I need to know and it’s that I don’t want anything to do with it. I do pay enough attention to how my vehicles drive that I might be on a spectrum, so it’s possible I’m just that much more in tune with what is happening. My wife’s camry was my car for 5-6 years and it gets way better mileage on 89 than 87. Her V6 Mustang got a lot better mpg on 89 as well.
As the one guy stated, you might get a better dose of cleaner in some brands. Top tier and a few others like BP would be better for that, although I can’t say if the amount varies by grade.
What I do know is Shell 93 has friction modifier in it and that is worth paying whatever extra it costs to shop there. I try and do my 89 tanks there to get a portion of the 93 and that additive. If I can’t find shell, I run bp, the only other brand is Costco when their pumps aren’t busy(almost never for at least three years), and Kroger only when I can max out the dollar off promo.
I strictly run shell 93 from the same high volume stations in my 69 GTX 440 car.
I don’t log the tanks, but it uses more fuel on 87 too, in city driving anyway. That’s one reason I almost never run 87 and will drop to 89 on occasion. The handful of tanks on 87 told me all I need to know and it’s that I don’t want anything to do with it. I do pay enough attention to how my vehicles drive that I might be on a spectrum, so it’s possible I’m just that much more in tune with what is happening. My wife’s camry was my car for 5-6 years and it gets way better mileage on 89 than 87. Her V6 Mustang got a lot better mpg on 89 as well.
As the one guy stated, you might get a better dose of cleaner in some brands. Top tier and a few others like BP would be better for that, although I can’t say if the amount varies by grade.
What I do know is Shell 93 has friction modifier in it and that is worth paying whatever extra it costs to shop there. I try and do my 89 tanks there to get a portion of the 93 and that additive. If I can’t find shell, I run bp, the only other brand is Costco when their pumps aren’t busy(almost never for at least three years), and Kroger only when I can max out the dollar off promo.
I strictly run shell 93 from the same high volume stations in my 69 GTX 440 car.
DieselMonk
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If this is the case you must have had an oil consumption problem with the ecoboost. Mine is just about due for an oil change… I’ll check the level.
Question is if it burns that much oil, should be there something fixed? Residue on the intake valves should be no problem for the port injection to clean.
You talk about a friction modifier in the Shell gas? Usually one puts a friction modifier into LSD rear end… not quite sure why Shell puts that stuff in the gas? Maybe it’s just autocorrect at its best again. Lol
In the winter as colder it gets, more gas is getting dumped into the cylinders. Not worried about retarding the timing, because it is so cold anyway.
Now my GT500 doesn’t have knock sensors, without that she only gets Supreme. All I get is 91. We don’t even have 93 around here.
Dice Roll
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Nope, you’ll not notice this amount of oil out of the crankcase. It’s a crazy amount to see having made it up to the intake level. Imagine it being misted into the intake charge. Not good.
You need to do some learning on things like oil into the air/fuel mix, why that is bad, what it can do, and also the friction modifier. That wasn’t a typo. I did a lot of learning from guys that are way smarter than I am and had way more experience and knowledge than the average guy walking around.
That's the issue. Since direct injection squirts fuel directly into the combustion chamber, there's no fuel being sprayed in the intact tract, including the backs of the valves, to dilute the carbon build-up. Since 2018, the 3.5 Ecoboost has had both direct injection and port injection. The port injectors do squirt fuel in the intake tract, but they only run at low engine speed and light load. The engine runs on the direct injectors the rest of the time.
As for oil being sent to the combustion chamber, that's been going on since positive crankcase ventilation became a thing in the 1960s.
Dice Roll
Full Access Members
It’s worse with forced induction and the pcv used to be vertical or near to it on older engines. Something like an old big block dodge doesn’t suffer with caked intake valves generally. The 3.5 is at least sitting vertical, you run into ones sitting horizontal like the ls1 and that’s a real bad deal.
Correct, Port injection does help with the coking, but does not solve it. BUT, if that fuel is higher end with Ethanol, and detergents, like say Shell V-Power(93), it will help to maintain Valve cleanliness with the help of Port Injection. BUT, BUT, if the contaminant never gets there in the 1st place because of a Catch Can, EVEN Better!!!
@Dice Roll Is spot on. V-Power, Shell's 93 has one of the best additive packages out there.
Shell V-Power® NiTRO+ premium gasoline | Shell USA, Inc.
Give your car the fuel it deserves with Shell V-Power® NiTRO+ Premium Gasoline, which removes up to 100% of performance-robbing deposits in your engine.
I have put the NGK's in my 2011 Ecoboost 150 gapped at 30. They were about 16 dollars each. I usually go with motocraft but they keep changing the part number. Some say it is improved. Some say to avoid counterfeit plugs. I am not sure about my 2019 and 2020 expeditions( I have only had 6 months) but 2011 f150 was bad on plugs with carbon tracing causing a shudder under heavy throttle.
DieselMonk
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We do have Shell, but no 93 Octane around here in my neck of the woods. 91 is all there is and it contains ethanol too. Ugh!@Dice Roll Is spot on. V-Power, Shell's 93 has one of the best additive packages out there.
Shell V-Power® NiTRO+ premium gasoline | Shell USA, Inc.
Give your car the fuel it deserves with Shell V-Power® NiTRO+ Premium Gasoline, which removes up to 100% of performance-robbing deposits in your engine.www.shell.us
Ethanol is GOOD! A slight MPG hit, but the benefits highly outweigh the negatives.
Remember. Not all NGK's are created equal. Different levels. Which part number did you install.
Dice Roll
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Get the NGK plugs off rockauto and save some serious coin.
DieselMonk
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Let me rephrase. I don't mind ethanol in regular blend. But in supreme, that should stay ethanol free. Given I think our supreme here has 5% ethanol, but that is 5% too much for me. More headaches than it is worth. It is so bad, we actually use at times aviation fuel, specifically for smaller off road engines.
More ethanol is better, in any Turbo based gas motor. Removing it in Premium is counter to the point of Premium. Ethanol provides evaporative cooling, and slows the combustion process, helping to make a complete burn. One of the reasons the MPG does not drop even close to the same percentage as the Energy content does.
The point of more Octane is to prevent knock, which Ethanol also helps with because of what I mentioned above.
Comparing a closed fuel system modern turbo charged motor to an off road most likely open fuel system simple motor that probably is exposed to moisture regularly is comparing apples to baseballs.
Put it simply, Ethanol Good! Especially for Turbo Motors. Heck, most of my vehicles have been tuned for MORE ethanol. My 2020 Explorer ST ran for over a year straight before I traded it on E50, and our 2020 Expedition ran for the Summer months on a turned back Full E85 tune. Only reason it didn’t run year around was because of travel typically in the winter to areas with less E85 availability.
