Scammed or Clueless? 2009 Expedition

[pennyanguy]

disappointing to hear...that's hard to do when looking at a vehicle 400 miles away. Thanks for the advise.

Are there better versions of the EL that are less trouble prone...not sure I can afford a newer one and I was shy of the turbo v-6 for hauling (camper)

 

[Flexpedition]

I'd say ignore threads like this and the many others like it.

Model years 2007-2008 Ford sold 150,000 Expeditions in the US and Canada. Ten years later a couple handfuls take a dump and its somehow an epidemic? Really? Its worse than CNN's 24x7 coverage of the Ebola outbreak in the US. Many members come here to complain, and only to complain - literally about everything.

 

[rcanfiel]

Follow up time

I did not post in the interim, because I was not fond of a couple posts treating it like "why the )(&#% do I not just take it back"?

People do not post to be second guessed or questioned. I was trying to educate and inform others.

Anyway, I did not read my latest post, so will provide a summary. After the issues described above (blown head gasket, etc.):

1) Dealer had me contact the 3rd party warranty company, which they had provided. After a few days of paperwork and explanations, they turned it down as "preexisting issue"

2) Called dealer. They went through their rep. I was assigned a customer advocate.

3) After more paperwork and dealing with customer advocate (he called a few shops), I was again turned down as preexisting issue.

4) I decided to have my mechanic do a remanufactured engine from Jasper. $6300 with installation - 3 year warranty including labor. Ready next week.

5) They videoed removing the old "muddy" oil - remember 16,000 miles since last oil change. This will help in court, I believe.

6) Expected to be ready middle of next week.

I fully expect to recoup at least half from the selling dealer.
o As I said, I will first threaten with BBB, Attorney General's office, and various review sites. Seeking compensation for the bad engine, tow, and rental car costs.
o Apparently if there is a question about the dealer's practices, the state can come in and turn every deal they ever did upside down and investigate. Dealers do not like to go through this.
o If they are not making reasonable amends, I will go to small claims court. My mechanic thinks I have a strong case. I will make a very compelling argument and multiple prices of evidence.


POSITIVE
The Endurance warranty I purchased cut the cost by $500 and added a year, when I informed them the dealer was providing a warranty.

I have an engine that now has no miles. As opposed to 130,000 miles with some questionable known issues. I am sure that bumps the value by quite a bit, although I have no plans to sell it.

I have new coil packs, new spark plugs, new timing chain, serpentine chain, belts and hoses, new water pump and a lot of other new parts that will not have to be replaced one at a time.

 

[rcanfiel]

disappointing to hear...that's hard to do when looking at a vehicle 400 miles away. Thanks for the advise.

Are there better versions of the EL that are less trouble prone...not sure I can afford a newer one and I was shy of the turbo v-6 for hauling (camper)

Do not buy 2007-2008. 2007 was new year with many problems. 2008 still had a number of problems. Also avoid 2012. There was a reason I got the 2009. Remember, there is a reason that people sell a vehicle or house. Sometimes a known major problem and it is repossessed or sold without revealing this.

Honestly, you may have to find older to get 100,000 miles for $10K. I did a lot of research, and a 3rd Gen with those miles is unlikely. Or up your budget. The dealers who advertise cheap are the ones with bad reputations and you will not get what you think.

Of everything I learned, do NOT buy AS-IS. If a problem and they do not fix it, it looks a lot better in court if there was any kind of implied warranty.

Make sure you have Ford inspect it (but they look for stuff like codes and brakes, they did not check the fluids or other issues), drive it a lot listening for the issues noted in this forum, check the air filter and oil/tranny/brake fluids that they are good, avoid the years I mentioned, check the BBB/yelp/cars.com type ratings of the dealer. Avoid any dealer who only let you tests it on his lot. Some problems are apparently hidden with suppressive type sprays.

Remember, there is a reason someone sold it. Sometimes, to avoid an expensive fix.

If they offer a warranty, verify it is a company with a good record if you must buy it. You can always drop it later. If you get a 3rd party warranty, they will make you wait a few months and 1,000 miles before they will cover it. Take the dealer warranty - at least it is generally good from day one (but not for preexisting issues).

I recommend Endurance. They have a good reputation. An old Expedition is expensive to fix. And the price they quote can often be negotiated. I learned that the hard way.

 

[Bedrck47]

Follow up time

I did not post in the interim, because I was not fond of a couple posts treating it like "why the )(&#% do I not just take it back"?

People do not post to be second guessed or questioned. I was trying to educate and inform others.

Your original topic was "Scammed or Clueless"
And now you say you were "trying to educate and inform others"

You were SCAMMED and the dealer was not CLUELESS

The members on this forum were trying to EDUCATE you when they said take it back.
You now have an expy with no miles on the engine That's good
But was all the extra headache and money worth it>
Is the up coming legal action worth it?

Go back and read your post #8 in which you stated "
I chose the 2009, to get past engine/tranny issues in the 2007-8 model.

Did you really get past the engine problems?

They say you can't teach an old dog new tricks Members tried to offer you advice and suggestions but YOU were determined that you wanted what you were SCAMMED into buying.

 

[1955moose]

Being that this is a Ford Expedition forum on not only repair advice, but all aspects of these vehicles. When a potential buyer asks for an honest opinion of a particular year, or engine group, I have to be honest. Their may only be a handful of members that report engine issues on this forum, and yes they sold tons of them. But think of how many did have engine issues with cam phasers, weak or failing oil pumps, etc. Their not all on our website to report. It's like 2 humans can be on the same high fat diet, along with heavy alcohol consumption, one lives to 85, the other dies at 50, why you ask, luck, metabolism, who knows. Point is, being a mechanic, and a person with a conscience, if somebody asks me an honest opinion of a vehicle with known issues, how can I honestly recommend it? I don't know about you flexpedition, but I can't honestly recommend it to the reader with confidence. If somebody asked me honestly what would you buy, a 1975 Toyota Celica or a 1975 Ford Pinto back in the day. It was always the Toyota, why because it didn't break!


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[rcanfiel]

Your original topic was "Scammed or Clueless"
And now you say you were "trying to educate and inform others"

You were SCAMMED and the dealer was not CLUELESS

The members on this forum were trying to EDUCATE you when they said take it back.
You now have an expy with no miles on the engine That's good
But was all the extra headache and money worth it>
Is the up coming legal action worth it?

Go back and read your post #8 in which you stated "
I chose the 2009, to get past engine/tranny issues in the 2007-8 model.

Did you really get past the engine problems?

They say you can't teach an old dog new tricks Members tried to offer you advice and suggestions but YOU were determined that you wanted what you were SCAMMED into buying.

And that is why I stopped posting. I do not need to be hit with a hammer when I chart my own course. I am quite aware that people on forums have strong opinions. I have the same.

I do not believe there was a scam. I believe the dealer was not careful in acquiring the vehicle. And did not really do a good job in prepping it. But I do not plan on taking on their loss.

And yes, I expect this to be worthwhile.

 

[Clemson82]

For what it's worth, I'm glad you shared and, speaking for myself, I learned a lot from the comments posted by both sides. Thanks!

 

[rwmorrisonjr]

Do not buy 2007-2008. 2007 was new year with many problems. 2008 still had a number of problems. Also avoid 2012.

Off-topic question: what's wrong with the 2012 models? I have one and haven't had any issues in the past 105k miles, and I bought it brand new.

 

[stamp11127]

I'll venture out on a limb here. A good portion of the problems can be traced to poor maintenance by the owner(s), synthethic lubes with the extended fluid changes they offer.
How often do we "lazy Americans" change oil on time or earlier, use the cheapest products instead of the products that meet or exceed oem specs?
The other side of the coin is that the manufacturers don't build a large safety margin into the products - especially on the electrical side. Slight changes in load cooks the circuits and you get to buy the entire smart junction box for example.