Diesel swap into an Expedition. Would it fit?

[gjhanson2]

Hey all, I love my '99 with the 5.4L, but I have always been a huge fan of diesel motors. I'm seriously considering a diesel swap into my Expedition. I know that the 7.3L and the 6.0L Powerstrokes both fit in the Bronco engine bay, but I was wondering if anyone had heard about one of those engines being put into a first generation Expedition or similar year F-150. If not, I was considering a 4.5L Powerstroke V6 (200 hp 440 ft.lb.) from a Ford LCF Medium Duty truck (only produced for two years but the International version with the same exact engine is still in production). I value torque more than horsepower, but I'm sure I can bump the 4.5L to at least equal horsepower to my 5.4. Any help would be greatly appreciated!

 

[KWT2000]

i like your thoughts here. i would be looking at the cummins 4bt swap from a ups/fed ex or bread truck. also the engine would be 2003 or older to stay away from emissions also the 4 cylinder would have less vibration and have alot of torque with great fuel mileage

 

[gjhanson2]

i like your thoughts here. i would be looking at the cummins 4bt swap from a ups/fed ex or bread truck. also the engine would be 2003 or older to stay away from emissions also the 4 cylinder would have less vibration and have alot of torque with great fuel mileage

Thanks KWT2000, I have heard of a lot of Ranger guys swapping for the I4 Cummins but the power and torque figures I've heard for it leave much to be desired, plus, I want to try to keep it Ford if I can (or Fordish haha, even though Ford does owns part of Cummins). Have you heard anything about the 4.5L Powerstroke (good or bad)? Thanks for the response!

 

[tonydiv]

The big issue is weight. The 5.4 weighs 525 lbs and the 6.0 Powerstroke weighs in at just under 1000 lbs (probably doesn't include the intercooler).

I'm also sure that the trans for the diesel is probably heavier too.

I'm sure it could be done, there are just some engineering issues to address.
Why am I so sure, there's a guy around town here who swapped a duramax diesel in to a Camaro, so where there's a will...

 

[gjhanson2]

The big issue is weight. The 5.4 weighs 525 lbs and the 6.0 Powerstroke weighs in at just under 1000 lbs (probably doesn't include the intercooler).

I'm also sure that the trans for the diesel is probably heavier too.

I'm sure it could be done, there are just some engineering issues to address.
Why am I so sure, there's a guy around town here who swapped a duramax diesel in to a Camaro, so where there's a will...

That's a great point. I'd have to completely redo the entire front end. Makes the 4.5L sound a lot more appealing, now I just have to find one! I'm told it's actually the same motor Ford was planning to tweak and drop into the Expeditions and F-150's (I still cry myself to sleep because that plan was scrapped). The reworked one was said to make 390 hp and 520 ft.lb. so I should be able to squeeze plenty of power out of it. I

 

[KWT2000]

the i4 cummins the ranger guys are using is a 3.3L 145 horse and 265 lb ft of torque known as the cummins i4 not impressive but easy to put into a ranger based vehicle the cummins 4BT is a 4.9L 300 horse 565 lb ft of torque and is part of the B series line that dodge used in there pickups but this engine was built only for commercial use.... 500+ horse is very easy to get from these motors.... i dont have alot of info on the early ford v6 diesel. i know the block is based on the ford/mazda 4.0 and is not sleeved. i read that with a fire ring kit you can make impressive power but harder to rebuild... you also need to watch headgaskets as the water jackets are very small

 

[04DrBlur]

Sounds like it would be much easier and cheaper to swap to an Excursion instead.

 

[gjhanson2]

The few people that have diesel excursions tend to hold on to them for a long time, and the reason I'm considering a diesel swap is because I currently lack the funding for the diesel Super Duty I've always wanted. Haha.

 

[secondechomatt]

I would love to see that 4.5 in an expy. It would require a complete overhaul of the truck. Leaving only frame and body un modified. Might as well do a sas while you're in there...with superduty axles front and rear.

 

[tonydiv]

That was pretty much my thought. You'd really have to change over to super duty running gear. I don't think that it would be all that tough because the super duty front suspension is relatively low tech and you really don't have to worry about all the geometry associated with a-arms, etc as on the Expy. I think the whole setup is just leaf springs, a sway bar, and I think a front track bar.

 

[KWT2000]

i took some measurments today, the 7.3 is only 3 inchs wider than the 5.4, the motor mount to top engine is about 11 inchs different which could be adjusted... theres plenty of room to run the boost tubes and mount a good size inercooler...

 

[nvycrmn]

im not gonna lie. i think a diesel expy would be awesome. but you will probably spend just as much on the swap as you would for your truck. i would save your pennies, buy the superduty, then start workin on the expy as a project truck. thats my plan. i was plannin on doin a sas but never thought of a diesel. great idea.

 

[gjhanson2]

Thanks for all the help guys! I've been doing a bunch of research and I think I've decided to slap a diesel and F-250 running gear into a Bronco (same front clip as the old square-body F-250's, some even come with the 7.3's tranny) and then I'll tub out the Expedition and make it into a desert runner. It would just take too much work to make the Expy a diesel.

Oh, and in case anyone was curious, I found out that Ford had planned to try the 4.5L V-6 Powerstroke out in 2005 Expy's and F-150's and decided there wasn't enough demand, then did the same exact thing with the 4.4L V-8 diesel they were thinking about putting into the 2011's. I'll be keeping my fingers crossed and hope that the third time's the charm. Hopefully it won't take too long!

Thanks again for all the help!

 

[walnuts4x4]

awww... dont give up... would be a sick idea... I've wanted to put a 460 in when or if I do a SAS swap...

 

[gjhanson2]

The swap into the Bronco would just be a lot easier, all the running gear from a pre-Super Duty F-250 would bolt right on. But don't think Betsy, my beloved Expediton will be forgotten. I'm feeling a stroker kit I found: make her 5.4L into a 6.3L or maybe a Procharger Centrifugal Charger. But I'm sure a smaller diesel will be available for the Expedition a few years down the line, so I figure she'll eventually see an engine without spark plugs.

 

[gijohn45]

I always wondered if you could take the diesel drive train out of an excursion and modify it to fit the expedition... that would be a easier option I would think...

And yes you would want to put a live axle under it instead of the ifs... but that is not that hard.

 

[climbinghalfdom]

A diesel expedition is possible!

The swap into the Bronco would just be a lot easier, all the running gear from a pre-Super Duty F-250 would bolt right on. But don't think Betsy, my beloved Expediton will be forgotten.....But I'm sure a smaller diesel will be available for the Expedition a few years down the line, so I figure she'll eventually see an engine without spark plugs.

Someone is doing it!!! The moment we have dreamed of is almost here.

Read all about it.. Who would have thought a 4bt swap for a 2003 Expedition is possible but it can be done. Personally I would like to keep the Automatic transmission.

YEEE HAAA

join the 4BTswaps forum then read, read, read,
http://www.4btswaps.com/forum/showthread.php?15772-2003-Ford-Expedition

I wish I was cool enough to do it myself. I'd like to pay someone to do the swap for me. I have a 1998 XLT Expedition 4.6L V8 2WD. Any takers? Send me a PM.
Kevin in the Grand Canyon

 

[jacks3am]

yeah you should definetly do this! diesel is so much more superior to gasoline

 

[One Mean Green]

Revival of old thread.

I read about the guy doing a swap of a Cummins 4bt into his 2003 Ford Expedition and since I want to get away from the Triton Motors with their problematic aluminum heads and I was originally thinking about a 390 swap but after stumbling on the Cummins 4bt swap I started thinking about going that way instead. Decent used 4bts are not that expensive and the ability to get more than the stock 105hp is a plus as well. There are many ex bread wagons and delivery vehicles around as well as military surplus ones so the supply is pretty good.

My thoughts are to get a 4bt and an adaptor to run the stock automatic transmission and AWD set up in my Eddie Bauer. I believe the hardest part of the swap besides the electrical would be fabricating the motor mounts. Since I plan on doing a 3 inch body lift I am sure that would help with the engine height issue and oil pan clearance issues. I don't plan on doing any towing with my vehicle so the transmission would probably be okay as it is and since I will eventually want to do a mild lift on the suspension that might help also.

I know I will have to buy a stand alone transmission controller and probablydo some rewiring but I think with some time and effort a 4bt is a do able project. I know that I have some time before my 5.4 needs to be replaced and checking around eBay and truck salvage yards I can probably find some of the parts used.

I have no interest in the 5.9 because it weighs too much and clearance would be a lot tougher. I probably will have to take part or all of the front clip off as it is.