the truck is not made for that period!! LOL, why would you immediately go to.........well you couldnt plow with it!!! LOL. Its a people hauler, a soccer mom van for those who dont like vans!! Its not severe duty period, in any way, in design, implementation, anything. It is awesome at what it is designed for. if they put a TTV8 they would sell a million of them. the ecoboost is not severe duty but it is one hell of a motor. same with the 5.0 the 5.0 is about as tried and true as you can get. you can easily get 500,000 miles out of properly cared for 5.0, you can also build one to 1,500hp with relative reliability comparatively speaking.
5.0 twin turbo coyote??
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the truck is not made for that period!! LOL, why would you immediately go to.........well you couldnt plow with it!!! LOL. Its a people hauler, a soccer mom van for those who dont like vans!! Its not severe duty period, in any way, in design, implementation, anything. It is awesome at what it is designed for. if they put a TTV8 they would sell a million of them. the ecoboost is not severe duty but it is one hell of a motor. same with the 5.0 the 5.0 is about as tried and true as you can get. you can easily get 500,000 miles out of properly cared for 5.0, you can also build one to 1,500hp with relative reliability comparatively speaking.
WTF are you talking about? Expensive toys? compared to what? What severe duty motor would you like to see in the expy? you need a severe duty motor to make it worthy in your opinion? LOL!!!!
I hope you are not referencing the 5.4 in your 2004?!?!?!?!? that motor was FAAAARRRR from severe duty. Has it done well by you or was it just an expensive toy??
joethefordguy
Full Access Members
well, I don't know about your expensive toy, but mine was built as a Police Package for a fire department, in which it did very well for almost 16 years, thank you very much. I bought it from them and it's doing just fine. the design itself is widely known for its reliability and durability. of course it has its issues. what motor does not?
what makes the ecoboost, et al, expensive toys is their cost, both to buy and to maintain, compared with what they deliver for that money. unless you're racing them, you're really not getting value for money.
of course, this argument could go on for days because it all comes down to what we mean by "value". and, of course, I'm right and you are wrong.
oh, and lest I forget: the severe duty motor I would love to see in the Expy is the "million mile" 12V Cummins. I'm not saying the 12V lasts a million miles, though some have, I'm specifically referring to the rebuilds coming out of a shop in Oregon. If i ever find the damn link again, I'll post it. and as soon as I win the lottery, I'm putting one in.
failing that, I'd settle for an improved Ford straight six.
and yes, I need a severe duty motor in any vehicle I own. I resent paying for repairs for issues that arise solely because bureaucrats are allowed to design engines. I resist putting any more money in a car than absolutely necessary, which is why I don't buy new ones, and haven't since 1985. it's the only time i ever bought a new one and it wasn't worth what I paid for it.
though I grew up in a Chevy family, i switched to Fords because Chevy's just cost too much to drive.
an important metric that is almost universally ignored is cost per mile. almost nobody knows what the cost per mile is for the cars they are driving, and paying for.
Mine, for example, since I bought it has cost me $1.41 per mile counting every part of the purchase price, repairs, upgrades, gas; everything but insurance. I think that's higher than it could be because as a retiree we hardly drive it. we've had it almost two years and still haven't put another ten thousand miles on it, which is killing the cost per mile. but i do know what my total cost of ownership is.
PS this is not the original article, but this might be the shop i'm referring to: http://www.trucktrend.com/how-to/engine/1605-how-to-give-a-cummins-59l-12-valve-second-life
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JExpedition07
That One Member
dude WTF are you talking about? The OP was talking about a 3/4 ton expy. You’d either be plowing with it or towing extremely heavy loads. What 2500 truck do you see with an aluminum block engine? I’ll wait.
JExpedition07
That One Member
The 5.4 is a deep skirted cast iron block with forged pistons and rods.....it was implemented for 3/4 ton use and put into the F-250 as well as half tons. More heavy duty than the 5.0 or 5.3, just look at the blocks lol, namely the mains and beefcake. The 5.0 may be more ‘reliable’ I’ll give you that. But it definitely isn’t heavier duty if you undress them down to the short blocks.
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touche' didnt see the 3/4 ton reference. i dont even understand that reference though. title should say why dont they bring back the Excursion. Which is literally what that was, a 3/4 ton suv with gas and diesel options!!
I owned a 2004 expy with the 5.4. IT WAS A TURD!!!!!!!! slow, lacking power, it blew the damn spark plug out of the head, which IMO ultimately caused it to fail. they repaired the head in the motor and it died a few thousand miles after that. whole side, cant remember which, maybe passenger, was starved of oil. Just because they put it in a 250 doesnt make it severe duty!!! there are plenty of iron block motors out there that are FAR FROM HEAVY DUTY.
JasonH
Full Access Members
Because longevity and serviceability are much more important than pure power in a 3/4 ton vehicle. Those vehicles are designed primarily for work. While the 1/2 tons work, they also double as family haulers and work/play vehicles. A 3/4 ton needs power yes, but it also needs a long life. A highly stressed 5.0 isn't really the architecture for a vehicle that will be working hard all the time. That's why Ford went with a OHV engine for its new engine.
joethefordguy
Full Access Members
are you seriously condemning an engine design on one example? sorry yours was a lemon, but c'mon man, get over it already.
to be fair, if I had one spitting spark plugs in traffic and Ford wanting to charge me a few grand for new heads, I'd probably be chasing them down in the streets with pitchforks and torches. that was one of the things I checked for before I bought mine; that the plugs had been changed relatively recently, i.e., new design.
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Thunderbirdsport
Full Access Members
Because if I want a heavy ass diesel in a truck, I'll take a Super Duty with a 7.3 PSD. Keep that little wannaba cutey-pie toy...the mall crawler crowd that rolls coal on parked cars can have that generic shit.
joethefordguy
Full Access Members
Because if I want a heavy ass diesel in a truck, I'll take a Super Duty with a 7.3 PSD. Keep that little wannaba cutey-pie toy...the mall crawler crowd that rolls coal on parked cars can have that generic shit.
what value does sneering at other's choices add to this group? are you 12? or making up for small organs?
it's amazing how rude people can be behind a keyboard.
Thunderbirdsport
Full Access Members
My point was made tongue in cheek. Most of the folks who want an SUV with a diesel already likely have an excursion.
It's a damned lot of work putting a cummins in a Ford, let alone an Expedition and making it work, with the goal of having a reliable diesel powered half ton SUV.
For the cost, you could probably get an Excursion with none of the headaches.
But hey, I'm just the guy that's determined to stuff a 7.3 (gasser) into either my Expedition, or an Excursion sometime next year.
The average guy that just wants to diesel swap a non-diesel vehicle...is either paid to do it, extremely bored, or already has the engine to be swapped.
Which one again, are you?
It's a damned lot of work putting a cummins in a Ford, let alone an Expedition and making it work, with the goal of having a reliable diesel powered half ton SUV.
For the cost, you could probably get an Excursion with none of the headaches.
But hey, I'm just the guy that's determined to stuff a 7.3 (gasser) into either my Expedition, or an Excursion sometime next year.
The average guy that just wants to diesel swap a non-diesel vehicle...is either paid to do it, extremely bored, or already has the engine to be swapped.
Which one again, are you?
i dont even know what to say to this!! i would basically disagree with this in almost every point of view. i love cars, i love wasting my money on them!! if you think that 5.4 is a severe duty motor there is no hope!! there would be ZERO reason to ever put a cummins 12V motor in an expy from the factory.
one example!!!!do a google search my friend!!!
Expedition Dave
Full Access Members
I get why everyone wants a 7 million HP truck that can jump Godzilla for 1-point 90 million dollars... I've owned several 500-700+ hp cars and sedans.
WHAT I can't understand is why Ford can't build the SUV I REALLY WANT.
WHAT I can't understand is why Ford can't build the SUV I REALLY WANT.
Thunderbirdsport
Full Access Members
I'd be happy with about 400, 450 horse and an equal amount of torque (honestly rather have the torque over the HP in a 3 ton+, 8 seat kid hauler/boat dragger.
That it can be a V8 with equal or better mileage than the 5.4 currently there is a plus. I've certainly nothing against the the 3.5TT but I'll also do an exhaust, so it it has a little tone and maybe a bit of rumble...the whole healthy V8 sound.
The added complexity of throwing in a turbo and it's related bits on a lifted truck doesn't appeal to me. Though a stock Coyote conversion is also on the radar, I think the bigger, simpler engine would be more suited for pulling a boat, 7 people, and some gear to the lake every weekend. But hell, I could probably buy a PSD Excursion and have money left over for the cost of swapping engines, a standalone engine management system, much less the trans controller stuff...which is all uncharted territory for me.
Plus the thing would need to be as easy to drive as factory....I can't be sitting on the shoulder, trying to adjust a tune because the controller(s) are having a hard time with something...
That it can be a V8 with equal or better mileage than the 5.4 currently there is a plus. I've certainly nothing against the the 3.5TT but I'll also do an exhaust, so it it has a little tone and maybe a bit of rumble...the whole healthy V8 sound.
The added complexity of throwing in a turbo and it's related bits on a lifted truck doesn't appeal to me. Though a stock Coyote conversion is also on the radar, I think the bigger, simpler engine would be more suited for pulling a boat, 7 people, and some gear to the lake every weekend. But hell, I could probably buy a PSD Excursion and have money left over for the cost of swapping engines, a standalone engine management system, much less the trans controller stuff...which is all uncharted territory for me.
Plus the thing would need to be as easy to drive as factory....I can't be sitting on the shoulder, trying to adjust a tune because the controller(s) are having a hard time with something...
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