Best way to get more power?

[Calidad]

As long as you remove it before bringing your vehicle to the dealer, then yes, it won’t void your warranty because there is no permanent modification done to any hardware or software. The module intercepts turbo boost signals from the ECU and the throttle pedal position and increases the turbo boost. The signals are intercepted and modified in the fly.
This is significantly different than flashing your ECU with third party programming. The moment your dealer connects their computer To your vehicle you’ll get flagged.

A coding buddy said all the modern cars have the ability to log aftermarket tunes in the factory system. Basically you have a failure that’s typically seen with tuned vehicles Ford will look into the system and see there was a tune and tell you though luck.

Tune it when you have the pink slip and can afford to fix a failure.

 

[JExpedition07]

I’m more concerned about the stock connecting rods and main bearings at that power level (600+).....just my 2cents. Seems those are the limiting factor on the trucks I’ve seen pushed to the edge.

 

[Grey ghost]

According to 5 star I'm right close to 500 at the wheel. I don't hammer it and drive like a fool my plugs were perfect at 20 k miles. If you need service take the tune out and tell em your battery died.i don't expect any problems from the tune . The videos are informative. Mine has the tow package so it has the 3:73 rear which makes it quicker

 

[bushpilot]

As long as you remove it before bringing your vehicle to the dealer, then yes, it won’t void your warranty because there is no permanent modification done to any hardware or software. The module intercepts turbo boost signals from the ECU and the throttle pedal position and increases the turbo boost. The signals are intercepted and modified in the fly.
This is significantly different than flashing your ECU with third party programming. The moment your dealer connects their computer To your vehicle you’ll get flagged.

regardless of the system - there will be evidence ignition advance and increased boost pressure.

 

[Dice Roll]

I’m more concerned about the stock connecting rods and main bearings at that power level (600+).....just my 2cents. Seems those are the limiting factor on the trucks I’ve seen pushed to the edge.

guys on yellow bullet say an eco boost will puke out rods if pushed that far.

 

[TobyU]

guys on yellow bullet say an eco boost will puke out rods if pushed that far.

Prob because they are those powder cracked ones we were discussing that some had to say were better than old school forged.
Ha ha there.
But we should note that for factory non forged steel rods the new ones are darn good to even the reliable at 450-500 hp levels.
Many old stock cast ones were not up to this par.

 

[rjdelp7]

The Expedition has a single exhaust, with cats. It is not capable of 500hp. Realistically, The tune, people experience is better throttle response and higher rpm between shifts. The advancing of timing gives slightly more power, but limits the vehicle to Premium fuel. Read the Mustang forums, this is a popular topic. Plenty of blown engines, some 'handbuilt' $12k GT350 motors. These are engines designed to be run hard, not production line stock. Ford also had run of tuned 6.0l diesel failures. They are familiar in spotting tunes.

 

[KJ-Idaho]

Don’t let anyone fool you. More power is just that . . . More power! And, if more is what you want, more is what you can get. ;-)

You need to calibrate your expectations on how much is enough. For me, I like feeling the better engine surge, and having the confidence that my mid-weight trailering will go better with the 5Star tune I just purchased ($649) and the K&N CAI i installed.

Will I do more? Maybe. It all depends. If I see that my engine warms up too much, I might put a lower temp thermostat and a better intercooler. I am unlikely to go much further than that. I am already seeing 450 HP and over 520 ft/lbs torque at the wheels vs stock (360/425). 90 HP and 95 ft lbs sounds like plenty to me. 13 lbs per HP is pretty good by any standard for a large SUV and way more than anything you could get as recently as 10 years ago.

A mustang gets sub from 10 (HP to weight ratio) all the way to 6 lb per HP for the GT500. The only way to beat a vehicle like that is with 4wd and way more than the 700+ HP of the GT500. That’s certainly not impossible (Roush is typically 650 HP +/-). But, very expensive and seems to me kind of crazy. If you want to get that kind of speed out of an Expy/Nav, you will still never get the handling of the Mustang. So, if you have that kind of cash floating around, I’d say boost your Expy just a bit, and buy the Mustang for the fun ride.

.

 

[TobyU]

Don’t let anyone fool you. More power is just that . . . More power! And, if more is what you want, more is what you can get. ;-)

You need to calibrate your expectations on how much is enough. For me, I like feeling the better engine surge, and having the confidence that my mid-weight trailering will go better with the 5Star tune I just purchased ($649) and the K&N CAI i installed.

Will I do more? Maybe. It all depends. If I see that my engine warms up too much, I might put a lower temp thermostat and a better intercooler. I am unlikely to go much further than that. I am already seeing 450 HP and over 520 ft/lbs torque at the wheels vs stock (360/425). 90 HP and 95 ft lbs sounds like plenty to me. 13 lbs per HP is pretty good by any standard for a large SUV and way more than anything you could get as recently as 10 years ago.

A mustang gets sub from 10 (HP to weight ratio) all the way to 6 lb per HP for the GT500. The only way to beat a vehicle like that is with 4wd and way more than the 700+ HP of the GT500. That’s certainly not impossible (Roush is typically 650 HP +/-). But, very expensive and seems to me kind of crazy. If you want to get that kind of speed out of an Expy/Nav, you will still never get the handling of the Mustang. So, if you have that kind of cash floating around, I’d say boost your Expy just a bit, and buy the Mustang for the fun ride.

.

Mostly my original point too.I recommend people spend less and not buy a brand new SUV but by one 2 or 3 years old that still in near-perfect condition or even older and then use the money they save to go buy them a play toy or a hot rod. I would rather have two for the price of one than to have one that does double duty or try to make it do double duty. As you said an expedition or an SUV will never be a Mustang.

 

[Calidad]

Mostly my original point too.I recommend people spend less and not buy a brand new SUV but by one 2 or 3 years old that still in near-perfect condition or even older and then use the money they save to go buy them a play toy or a hot rod. I would rather have two for the price of one than to have one that does double duty or try to make it do double duty. As you said an expedition or an SUV will never be a Mustang.

I drove my SLK 350 today instead of the beast err Expedition

 

[sjwhiteley]

I think the ‘more power’ has two mental drives associated with it for this type of vehicle. First, if it was weak on power, there would be an obvious desire to bring it up. In the Expedition, however, it is a pretty pokey vehicle for such a weight. Thus, ‘if this is what it can do standard, imagine what it can do with more power!’ attitude.

regardless, more power is fun!

 

[NyackRob79]

regardless of the system - there will be evidence ignition advance and increased boost pressure.

While it’s true that an engine problem or transmission problem error will log the current boost level, unless there is aftermarket hardware present that can confirm this, dealer will assume the overboost was due to a fault somewhere in the system. If you remove the boost module before bringing your vehicle in for service, they will NOT automatically suspect aftermarket intrusion, certainly not on an Expedition. Even if they looked for it, the lack of any aftermarket hardware or software directly tied to the powertrain doesn’t allow them to simply void your warranty on a hunch. Your vehicle will be serviced just fine.
Now with a permanent 5-star tune reflashing your ECU, they’ll be able to tell right off the bat a software mismatch.

 

[5280tunage]

@gordonf238 you kind of touched on what I wanted to ask. All of these are based on OBDII and in general, while every mfr has the ability to modify their flavor of software, I've been applying tunes (both direct and indirect) in my last 3 jeeps. As long as I removed it prior to having service done, I never ever ran into an issue. And some of my tunes were basically as far as you could go on my last Jeep (2011). They made substantial improvements especially with the Hemi, but again, I never had a problem.

Back to the OP's question though. About more power, what I'd love to know is what everyone's experience is with warranty coverage and the various tunes we hear about. In my past experience (and I've been building cars for 20+ years), it's usually pretty clear that a dealer would have to prove that any warranty related issue was "Caused" by a modification in order for the claim to be denied. My last Jeep had everything from modified intakes, manifolds, throttle bodies, exhaust, ignition, etc, and I never had issues getting service (with the exception of getting a new radiator due to a winch install).

But seriously, I'm contemplating a lot of these updates. So my question, being new to Ford in general, what might be the outcomes:

OBD2 connector tune? Possible Gain? Base warranty issue? Ford ESP issue?
Downpipes? Possible Gain? Base warranty issue? Ford ESP issue?
Aftermarket intercooler? Possible Gain? Base warranty issue? Ford ESP issue?
Low temp thermostat? No real gain. Base warranty issue? Ford ESP issue?
Cat Back exhaust? Minimal gain. Base warranty issue? Ford ESP issue?
CAI? Descent gain. Base warranty issue? Ford ESP issue?
Turbo controller? Descent Base warranty issue? Ford ESP issue?

Etc....

Just curious, i'd love to know users issues with these items. I'm not going to do as much as I have with my previous cars, this engine feels great as it is. But I'm at 6K+ Ft. of elevation every day, so what ever I can do to get back to sea level ratings LOL.

 

[5280tunage]

@gordonf238 you kind of touched on what I wanted to ask. All of these are based on OBDII and in general, while every mfr has the ability to modify their flavor of software, I've been applying tunes (both direct and indirect) in my last 3 jeeps. As long as I removed it prior to having service done, I never ever ran into an issue. And some of my tunes were basically as far as you could go on my last Jeep (2011). They made substantial improvements especially with the Hemi, but again, I never had a problem.

Back to the OP's question though. About more power, what I'd love to know is what everyone's experience is with warranty coverage and the various tunes we hear about. In my past experience (and I've been building cars for 20+ years), it's usually pretty clear that a dealer would have to prove that any warranty related issue was "Caused" by a modification in order for the claim to be denied. My last Jeep had everything from modified intakes, manifolds, throttle bodies, exhaust, ignition, etc, and I never had issues getting service (with the exception of getting a new radiator due to a winch install).

But seriously, I'm contemplating a lot of these updates. So my question, being new to Ford in general, what might be the outcomes:

OBD2 connector tune? Possible Gain? Base warranty issue? Ford ESP issue?
Downpipes? Possible Gain? Base warranty issue? Ford ESP issue?
Aftermarket intercooler? Possible Gain? Base warranty issue? Ford ESP issue?
Low temp thermostat? No real gain. Base warranty issue? Ford ESP issue?
Cat Back exhaust? Minimal gain. Base warranty issue? Ford ESP issue?
CAI? Descent gain. Base warranty issue? Ford ESP issue?
Turbo controller? Descent Base warranty issue? Ford ESP issue?

Etc....

Just curious, i'd love to know users issues with these items. I'm not going to do as much as I have with my previous cars, this engine feels great as it is. But I'm at 6K+ Ft. of elevation every day, so what ever I can do to get back to sea level ratings LOL.

Bueller?

 

[AKentPhoto]

I'm new to FI Fords and that is where dealers get testy when it comes to tuning. The gains are so tempting more people want to do it, but it has made manufacturers very sensitive due to more failures due to bad tunes and people not understanding how to treat a tuned vehicle. That is not to say all tuned vehicles will fail, but there are precautions I would take when it comes to tuned vehicles.

Shorter oil change intervals. Hot turbos shorten oil life and oil circulation is critical on turbos. When they blow, they can send parts of the turbines into the engine. Just ask anyone with an Audi A8 TTV8 about the oil return screen that notoriously would get clogged.

Another thing I would do is let the engine run at idle for a few minutes after a hard run. After towing or long steep grades etc. Anytime the engine has to sit under boost for any extended period. Back in the day they used to sell turbo timers that did it for you and would cut the ignition after a set time or oil temp.

Do these engines have any circulation feature after the ignition is switched off? That is what all the *** cars do... Pretty smart. Instead of running the whole engine like the turbo timer, a pump will continue to circulate the oil to prevent it from burning in the hot turbos. Worst thing you can do after beating on it up a hill is stop
for gas and kill the engine immediately.

If you tow make sure your tuner offers a towing tune. If not and you are headed to Colorado with a trailer I would flash back to stock.

Day to day things will be normal though. Tunes just allow you to apply more stress to the motor on the top end. If you do it in a respectful way and know how to treat a turbo it will live a long happy life.

 

[AKentPhoto]

Bueller?

To answer your question this mostly has to do with your personal dealer. I would start the conversation with your service manager and see how open they are to seeing mods. My service manager at Audi has a big turbo Jetta. My Lincoln rep I have only spoken to a couple times as I have yet to be in for service, but I pretty much had him say he would let me know if parts need to come off.

FYI dealers have to take pictures for corporate whenever doing major warranty work. Ie new turbos etc. Dealing with tunes is old news for Be/Audi so they put a flash counter on their ECUs. Any reflash of any kind will tag your vin nationwide.

Thanks to the diesel guys Ford is ahead of the curve when it comes to being aware of tunes and what damage they can do. Now that turbos are making their way to gassers they already know what's up. This is also why FCA is behind and doesn't care much about tunes, because most of their lineup is N/A...

 

[bushpilot]

Are dealers a little more forgiving when you have extended warranties?

 

[AKentPhoto]

Depends on the dealer and the warranty...
I'd personally prefer to find a performance shop that has a good reputation with an extended warranty company. That is going to be your best bet. They tend to know the vehicles better and know weak points better as well.

 

[bushpilot]

Depends on the dealer and the warranty...
I'd personally prefer to find a performance shop that has a good reputation with an extended warranty company. That is going to be your best bet. They tend to know the vehicles better and know weak points better as well.

let me rephrase....are FORD Dealers more (mod) forgiving when you have a FORD extended warranty?
can a NON Ford Dealer (aka independent shop) bill against the FORD Extended warranty?

 

[AKentPhoto]

Wish I had some experience to share but I kept my drivetrain on the raptor stock and had a great dealer that always looked the other way on all the suspension mods...

Only claims I had to make on extended were trans valve body and infamous 3rd brake light leak...