Ford weekend @ MIR

[toms89]

I know this is a Expedition forum but I thought I would post this link anyways for anyone in the area that may be interested. I plan to go and would love to race my expy if I can get a few issues taken care of first.

I installed new mass air sensor because I was pegging the stock lightning meter. The new one runs great W.O.T. but is having idle surge issues. I also have the clunking sound I previously posted about that has progressed to more of a crack type sound. I believe it is definately drivetrain related due to the timing of it.


http://www.mirdrag.com/ford/



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[Canadian Expy]

I was going to go to Blowing Greeen this weekend for the 13th Annual Nitto Tire NMRA All Ford World Finals but that fell apart so this looks like a good second choice. Have you been before ??
Hey I could maybe get someone to get my lift kit

 

[toms89]

I was going to go to Blowing Greeen this weekend for the 13th Annual Nitto Tire NMRA All Ford World Finals but that fell apart so this looks like a good second choice. Have you been before ??
Hey I could maybe get someone to get my lift kit

I have been to the ford fever classic in the past at mir racing my stang. Been a few years. They will have some increadibly fast mustangs and lightnings there. Many turbo mustangs. Should see some hitting speeds well over 200mph in the 1/4. Thing that I remember most was a drag radial mustang pulling his wheels up and carrying them but starting about 200 ft downtrack. Drag radial turbo stang launching with low boost (for traction) and it coming on strong down track.

 

[Canadian Expy]

Sweet ..sounds good

 

[toms89]

Just checked forecast and it appears we have a good chance for nice weather this weekend at MIR. I just wish my Expy was running 100%. Plan on going and would like to race my expy if I feel she will hold together.

I could be running more boost now if it was not for my tune issues.

If anyone thinks they may go let me know and maybe we can meet up. You can check out the details in the link posted above.

 

[rburch]

Hey Tom, just trying to help with your idle surge. Have you checked for any boost leaks?

 

[toms89]

Hey Tom, just trying to help with your idle surge. Have you checked for any boost leaks?

I appreciate it... may hit upon something I missed.

Bypass is open and functioning correctly at idle. There is no boost.

Believe the issue is not mechanical as I can and did put back in the lightning meter/tune and idles great. The new meter actually reads nice and steady at idle also so I am certain its in the tune.. Something is "confusing the ecu" and its getting "lost".

There is a lot of changes in the tune from one to the other. Many items and tables are scaled to work with new meter. All the data looks good and air/fuel is correct but something in the tune is tripping the ecu up!?

 

[rburch]

Well i was into Eclipses a few years ago and i know allot about problems that arise when boost is involved.

Maybe you should try the 1st tune with the new MAS. If the Expy ran great with the first tune but the MAS was pegged then i would try the first tune with the new MAS. There wouldnt be a difference other than the new MAS cant handle a higher flow.

What Mas are you running? And have you changed the IACV? I hate that Ford put the IACV so close to the EGR valve!

You could also do a IACV delete when you run at the track. Just take out the throttle stop and replace it with a screw you can adjust. But it would eventually turn into a pita changing back and forth.

 

[Canadian Expy]

I'm out of money now so I can't make plus the dollar is doing sh$t

 

[toms89]

I'm out of money now so I can't make plus the dollar is doing sh$t

I kind of suprised you considered coming down. Its a bit of a hike from Canada! Thought it would be cool though if you did.

 

[toms89]

Well..I am set to head up to the track for the weekend. Actually booked a place to stay thats a bit closer as I live over 2 hours away. Think the weather is going to cooperate but it is supposed to be windy as a cold front is passing through tomorrow.

Been playing with the expys tune and happy with the way it is idling right now. Should drive well for the trip. If I feel it is running well enough when I get there I will run it for test & tune tomorrow night. Maybe in the bracket classes Sat or Sun as there is no class for the Expedition. Even if they let me in the lightning class they would smoke my a$$..lol.

If anyone in the area decides to come stop and introduce yourself. My expy looks like the one in my avatar...lol. only worse. Paint is not that great up close. Doubt there will be too many expys racing soo...

 

[treycool94]

i would go if i had a race car

 

[toms89]

Well i was into Eclipses a few years ago and i know allot about problems that arise when boost is involved.

Maybe you should try the 1st tune with the new MAS. If the Expy ran great with the first tune but the MAS was pegged then i would try the first tune with the new MAS. There wouldnt be a difference other than the new MAS cant handle a higher flow.

What Mas are you running? And have you changed the IACV? I hate that Ford put the IACV so close to the EGR valve!

You could also do a IACV delete when you run at the track. Just take out the throttle stop and replace it with a screw you can adjust. But it would eventually turn into a pita changing back and forth.

The eclipse is a different animal with turbo. Hell even my mustang is a lot different with the centi blower.

The SCT mass air is dependent upon the "value tune" that goes with it. It scales down the fuel related tables and values plus mass air table to give it the extended range. This gets you in the ballpark but still needs tuned. The IACV is stock unit that came with my upper lightning supercharger assembly. Im sure it is working fine it is the ECU's actions with it that are causing the issues. Don't remember the locations of egr vs IACV on the stock setup but with the lightning intake it is on the opposite side of the plenum.

I spent a lot of time trying to dial in my mass air table today and think I made significant improvement. I believe the tuner just went off of the value files....I know because I have access to them. He then took one point at idle and made appropriate % adjustment and applied it to the lower range of the table. The problem with this is in the real world the air fuel ratio is not linear on how it responds to the table in my application. So I believe while it is idling at the one point it is fine but once it goes north or south of there it is off by varying amounts. I adjusted various points today down low and some I had to add fuel...others I had to take away.. I will see how it works long term soon enough but she ran well for a couple hour drive.

Really think it needs properly tuned on a dyno so load can be controlled easier throughout. Tuner has dyno but its an inertia dyno, no load.

 

[toms89]

i would go if i had a race car

Your allowed to watch. You might be impressed with some of the vehicles there. Some of the top mustangs and lightnings in the country will be there. Many high dollar turbo mustangs and lightnings.

 

[rburch]

Built boosted engines definitely need to be tuned on a dyno for the reasons you listed above. Thats the only way to get the air/fuel and the mas correct throughout the rpms. As you stated the air/fuel isnt linear to the table in your software, and this is the case with allot of tuning software including DSMlink which is what im familiar with. Which is why a dyno is an important part of tuning. The dyno will show you where power is falling off and therefore show you at what point you need to adjust your tune.

Im sure you know this, started rambling! LOL! I was assuming you were tuning with a dyno.

 

[Canadian Expy]

I kind of suprised you considered coming down. Its a bit of a hike from Canada! Thought it would be cool though if you did.

I would driven down no problem but, spent my money on that lift kit. We don't have the quality races up here so I don't mind heading down for something good. Next year!!!!

 

[toms89]

I am back from my from my trip to the track. Left this morning. Decided not to stay for the last day. A bit sunburned, exhausted, low on funds and did not want to deal with the traffic coming home later.

I was the only expedition racing and received all kinds of attention due to the "sleeper" aspect of it. It was unbelievable the amount of spectators and racers that were coming up in the pits to check it out and ask questions. Everyone wanted to see under the hood. Kinda makes the effort worth while I hope maybe someone got decent video of it and will post it on you tube.

It ended up running a best of [email protected]. Best mph of the weekend was 104.76. It was running low 13.20's early on but after adding a few degrees of timing it broke into the 12's again. Made one 13.20 pass with the parking brake fully engaged. Figured it out about 1/2 track when I saw the brake light on the dash and looked down at the brake. I think I may have noticed if it was not for the idle surge while approaching the tree. Could not tell anything once I punched the throttle. Considered staying today as I felt I could better my e.t.s but decided it could wait.

Did see some fast mustangs.. One turbo mustang ran in the 6's at over 200mph. If I would have stayed for eliminations today they were going to have a wheelstand contest which would have been interesting to watch.

After one of my passes friday night on my way back on the return road right in front of me I saw a ranger I believe (race truck, tubbed, full cage etc..) get squirrely right pass the finish line when he lifted, hit the wall and roll onto the roof. Felt bad for the driver but they got him out and he looked ok other than being very shook up of course. Safty crew was right there in no time as they are parked near finish line.

 

[rburch]

Sounds like it was a fun weekend.

 

[Canadian Expy]

Sounded like a good weekend ....Next year!!