Negotiating a lease vs. purchase

[NyackRob79]

Looking at the outgoing 2020 models right now. Would prefer to lease for 24-months, after which I intend to purchase a 2022/2023 model with facelift, Sync4, big screen, etc.

But dealers aren't very flexible on lease negotiations. Has this been an experience for others here?

Outgoing model years (2020) were being incentivized 12-15K off MSRP last year around this time.

If you can negotiate the MSRP down, then you're paying much less for a lease because the depreciation is less. Capitalized Cost Reduction is what it's called.

Maybe I need to lay harder on these dealers.

You'd think they'd be eager to move these units, especially now that Caddy/Chevy/GMC are out with their new models, which always outsell the Expys.

But neh, Ford dealers seem to think 82k Expy Platinum is worth its asking price.

 

[Dice Roll]

Things are tough to negotiate right now. Might be low supply? I’m having trouble even getting the time of day on a new challenger order. It’s a totally optional thing, so if they think I’ll be crawling back, they are sadly mistaken.

 

[grumpyoleman]

Ditto on Dice Roll's comment. We were shopping for a used Lincoln a few months back and had more than one dealership not even bother to call us back. Ended up buying a new (left over 19) from a relatively local dealer and glad we did, but for all the dealerships that blew me off I wish them the best, because I will never go back.

 

[2018ExpyPlatinum]

Problem with leasing is most incentives are usually less than a buy. Manufacturers usually control the interest rate, not the dealer, so one less place to cut a deal. The other issue is when the new models come out (2021's) the manufacturers usually cuts or does away with incentives from the out going model (2020). You might get a better deal on a 2021, pending inventory, which also determines lease deals.

 

[Dice Roll]

I’ve never seen them cut incentives on old stock, if anything they increase as it gets really stale having those sit next to the brand new ones.

 

[marantzer]

First post here, I've used this forum in our shopping process so I'd like to pay it forward. We recently were going through this process. Started looking at Platinums and, with the lack of incentives, were not comfortable paying the premium for that model this far into this generation's life cycle. We then started searching for Limiteds with the Stealth & Convenience Package to get to the price point that we were comfortable with. The dealer was somewhat responsive, probably because I just purchased a Raptor from them in May, but definitely didn't seem to be 'hungry'. It didn't help that we wanted pretty specific colors/models that they didn't have in their own inventory, but we had to essentially do the searching to find the vehicle we wanted. Most of the incentives that were available (expired 1/4) were for people who had trades and checked other boxes (veteran, insurance company, etc) so we ended up using x-plan pricing. I'd say we got an okay deal, 0% financing helped, but certainly not what would have been available if inventories were higher nationally. Interestingly enough, when Ford let us build a 2021, it was actually a few thousand dollars cheaper than the 2020 we bought due to decreased option pricing. We literally could have ordered a 2021 and gotten it for the same price as the 2020, possibly without the finance incentive. We cross shopped the GMs Yukon/Tahoe, the Lexus GX, and the Toyota Highlander and no one seemed willing to incent us enough to go with their model, so we went with the one that we think will serve our needs the longest. If it had not been for my company car going away by the end of March, I would have bowed out of the current market and waited until financial conditions change to make a purchase.

 

[lobsenza]

Personally, I think leases are very expensive way to drive vehicles. Purchases are much more economical.

 

[2018ExpyPlatinum]

Dice Roll...In a normal model year that is true. For example, when new models roll out in Sept/Oct, previous model year incentives do go up some, but normally by now (Jan) when new models are out for four months, many manufacturers cut rebates. They want to sell the new stuff, don't care about the old stuff. Sometimes they increase money to dealers, but what the dealer does with it is up to them.

I considered buying a CT6 V, but as inventory was sold, and 2021 model year started, GM cut all incentives for 2020 V's. This is GM's normal way of doing things as do many manufacturers.

 

[Deadman]

I looked an a Lease on mine just to hear them out and it was OMG expensive. After a few years you walk away broke and with no car! lol

 

[mcb345]

In response to the original post I’m pretty sure all manufacturer incentives are gone for 2020 leases and you’d probably have to negotiate a 2021 lease.

I’m very familiar with leasing, but 24 months is usually a crappy residual so you’d probably want to go with 36 months.

Assuming you have 720 credit or higher, find out what the best money factor is and residual for the specific model (edmunds lease forums are great for that) pick your car / MSRP, run the calculations from a negotiated selling price you feel is legit based upon lease rebates and all that and email a half dozen or more dealers asking if they can honor the monthly payment you’ve calculated.

Tell them you know the money factor you can qualify for, you know the residual etc so they know they can’t ******** you. All you care about is monthly payment and what you have to put down (shoot for little to no down payment). You shouldn’t care about what numbers they put for cap cost reduction or how they work it really, that’s their problem. Just know what monthly payment you think you can achieve based upon your calculations (including tax).

keep in mind, selling prices you see advertised or others are getting aren’t exactly achievable in many cases for leasing. Again, Edmunds lease forum for 2021 Ford Expedition will be invaluable for you.

 

[vincentrose]

While a lease payment might be a little less than a loan payment, with a lease, after the lease is up you lose the car. Thousands of dollars paid out and no car to show for it. Leases doesn't benefit anyone but the dealer

 

[mcb345]

While a lease payment might be a little less than a loan payment, with a lease, after the lease is up you lose the car. Thousands of dollars paid out and no car to show for it. Leases doesn't benefit anyone but the dealer

Leases are great for people that want a new car every 2-3 years. Not everyone wants to own a car, pay for maintenance like tires and brake jobs, extended warranties, deal with reliability issues and have to deal with selling it. You’d take a massive hit if you bought and sol every 2-3 years, not to mention for a pricey car like the expedition you’d be paying taxes on the full price of the car every time you bought a new one, most states you just lay the use tax for leases.

I love leasing, my kids can trash the car and I care less about it, as long as they deem it normal wear and tear it’s not my problem after 36 months! Plus you can then drive brands that are terrible to own long term, ie Range Rover, Jaguar, etc, because they’re always under warranty while you’re driving them.

Bought my expedition, but we are leasing a Volvo XC90 for those very reasons above and then 3 years down the road I’ll get one of latest and greatest crossover SUV’s, or at least whichever is running the best lease deals at the time.

People sh*t on leases that enjoy long term car ownership and the financial benefits that come along with owning a car for many years. But, just like some people want a new iPhone every year, some want new cars. I’m a car enthusiast so I want in a new car every 3 years, but I make sure to get the best lease deals out there by doing my research and knowing how to calculate the numbers.

 

[charlespsu]

We purchased our 2020 Limited with Special Edition in November. $73K list, we got them down to $66,000. This isn't itself a fantastic deal, but they also gave me more for my trade than other sites. We also got 60 months at 0%. Back in November in my area the 2020's were selling pretty quickly so I'm comfy with the deal with made.

 

[Trainmaster]

The choice to lease or buy is not a choice about cars.

It's a financial and philosophical choice. One about money and how we choose to use it.

 

[mcb345]

We purchased our 2020 Limited with Special Edition in November. $73K list, we got them down to $66,000. This isn't itself a fantastic deal, but they also gave me more for my trade than other sites. We also got 60 months at 0%. Back in November in my area the 2020's were selling pretty quickly so I'm comfy with the deal with made.

I’m very curious what kind of lease deals people are getting on something like the Stealth or Special Edition. I’d assume some people end up spending over $1000 per month.

 

[carymccarr]

Personally, I think leases are very expensive way to drive vehicles. Purchases are much more economical.

Depends on how long you own your vehicles. If you own for 2-3 years probably a lease is better.

 

[mcb345]

Looking at the outgoing 2020 models right now. Would prefer to lease for 24-months, after which I intend to purchase a 2022/2023 model with facelift, Sync4, big screen, etc.

But dealers aren't very flexible on lease negotiations. Has this been an experience for others here?

Outgoing model years (2020) were being incentivized 12-15K off MSRP last year around this time.

If you can negotiate the MSRP down, then you're paying much less for a lease because the depreciation is less. Capitalized Cost Reduction is what it's called.

Maybe I need to lay harder on these dealers.

You'd think they'd be eager to move these units, especially now that Caddy/Chevy/GMC are out with their new models, which always outsell the Expys.

But neh, Ford dealers seem to think 82k Expy Platinum is worth its asking price.

@gordonf238 - have you tried locating specific cars you’d want around the country and emailing the dealers what price you’re willing to do for a lease?

Again, check out the 2020 of 2021 “Ford Expedition Lease Deals and Prices” forum on Edmunds to make some reasonable calculations.

I’ve shipped a few leased cars from other states and it’s a lot cheaper than you’d think. $600 from Cleveland OH to TN for example. I’m a HUGE advocate of never setting foot in the dealer for negotiations once your mind is made on what to get.

 

[carymccarr]

@gordonf238 - have you tried locating specific cars you’d want around the country and emailing the dealers what price you’re willing to do for a lease?

Again, check out the 2020 of 2021 “Ford Expedition Lease Deals and Prices” forum on Edmunds to make some reasonable calculations.

I’ve shipped a few leased cars from other states and it’s a lot cheaper than you’d think. $600 from Cleveland OH to TN for example. I’m a HUGE advocate of never setting foot in the dealer for negotiations once your mind is made on what to get.

Couldn’t agree more. Why people spend any amount of time at a dealership outside of simply signing papers and grabbing keys is beyond my comprehension.

 

[dlcorbett]

I’m very curious what kind of lease deals people are getting on something like the Stealth or Special Edition. I’d assume some people end up spending over $1000 per month.

When I leased my 4x2 ltd 301, I leased for 67k ttl(66k sticker, 61k after mil, student, and invoice, rolled 3k from trade), 15k miles for 36mnths in delaware for 725 a mnth(700 but added wheel pkg which was a waste.) And 36k buyout. If I purchased for 72mnths, my monthly pmt would've been well over 900 and thats with less than 5% interest and would not have reached the value of the truck by that time. I was the second one in that area with the 4th gen expy, they were late with my truck. I was offered the first in the east coast, blk platinum swb 4x4, sticker 81k, for 72k before taxes, 36 mnth 12k miles, for 795/mnth. Looking back at it, I wish I got that truck, but I rele didn't want 4x4 and they seemed ki da pushy with the deal at the time. When I called them back at the eom, they still had the truck but wouldn't work with me over the phone to finalize the deal.

 

[mcb345]

When I leased my 4x2 ltd 301, I leased for 67k ttl(66k sticker, 61k after mil, student, and invoice, rolled 3k from trade), 15k miles for 36mnths in delaware for 725 a mnth(700 but added wheel pkg which was a waste.) And 36k buyout. If I purchased for 72mnths, my monthly pmt would've been well over 900 and thats with less than 5% interest and would not have reached the value of the truck by that time. I was the second one in that area with the 4th gen expy, they were late with my truck. I was offered the first in the east coast, blk platinum swb 4x4, sticker 81k, for 72k before taxes, 36 mnth 12k miles, for 795/mnth. Looking back at it, I wish I got that truck, but I rele didn't want 4x4 and they seemed ki da pushy with the deal at the time. When I called them back at the eom, they still had the truck but wouldn't work with me over the phone to finalize the deal.

Seems like a great deal for a Platinum as long as you aren’t putting a lot down!

The rule of thumb for a lease is typically with zero down, if you can pay $100 per $10,000 doing great. Example, $600 for a $60k car, $800 for $80k car.

I’ll add to my previous comments, don’t set foot in the dealer for negotiations and EMAIL dealers and go straight to the General Manager. They should be straight shooters, simple yes or no, have them write up the paperwork in advance claiming you don’t have time to sit down. It works. You avoid the finance guy trying to nickel and dime you in person as well.