New (to me) 2010 Expy. New to Ford. Newb questions...

[MCExpy10]

Good evening fellow Expedition owners. This is my first Ford, well my wife brought one into our marriage. I needed something beefier to pull my boat, and boy does it ever. I paid PLENTY for this car, and I'm wondering if you might be able to answer some questions for me or perhaps share in my misery.

The biggest thing is when it's cold it runs rough. I'm reading similar stories here on the forums about this. Once it warms up, it's smooth, but until then it's a bit lethargic. I'm convinced it's an ignition coil, the dealership thinks I'm crazy because it's not throwing a code. I bought an extra warranty on this thing, so I'm kind of at the mercy of that before I just go and start fixing things myself. The truck has a hair less than 90,000 miles on it, so I had the dealership replace the spark plugs. It runs better, but not fixed.

Next, on the freeway, if I jam my foot to the floor, it takes about 3 seconds or so for it to downshift, find a gear, and move. It's so lethargic. I'm used to transmissions taking a while to shift, but this is pretty much a safety issue.

Lastly, I just noticed this one tonight. All of the sudden my sunroof has developed an "Auto" feature. Before, I used to have to hold the button down to open or close it all the way. Now I just tap it and it goes almost all the way open (except for about 2" where I need to hold the button), and tap it again to go all the way closed.

Has anyone experienced any of these issues, or have some solutions? Help me feel better about my purchase please...

 

[Gruz7]

Welcome!
Sounds to me like you need a cool pack and possibly new plugs as well... Mine had an issue similar to that and the misfire was cured with all new plugs, still need to do the coils
Also the sunroof "issue" you're experiencing is ford adding ease of use to the accessories they changed the sunroof to automatic in maybe 2005... If you are concerned about the 2" it still has to open after you press the auto button then just hold that same button again and it will open all the way (this is what I do with mine)
After the plugs and could are replaced a lot of your running issues may be solved
Thanks!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ManUpOrShutUp]

If the dealer will replace the coils under warranty, then go for it. If you're paying out of pocket though, test them before replacing them. Coils are either good or they're not; replacing working ones with new ones won't accomplish anything. If all of your coils are found to be in working order, I would start simple and clean the throttle body before moving on to other things.

 

[MCExpy10]

Thanks for the responses! I had the spark plugs and boots replaced. It cost me $300 (that's WITH them "helping me out").

Is the lethargic transmission performance related to the plugs/coil issue then? To me it seems like it's hunting for gears more than anything else. I haven't driven too many 6 speed transmissions, but I've never experienced something this slow to respond. I rented a new Escalade (8 speed, I think?), and that was like instant power to the wheels. I just find it hard to believe this transmission is acting as designed. Like I said, I pull my boat with it, it's quite a lot of weight and it doesn't act like it's slipping or anything. Just when I get on it, it takes 3 seconds or so and finally puts it to the road.

Also, about the sunroof. It didn't use to do that. I used to have to hold the button down to get it to all the way open. If all of yours are doing it too though, I guess maybe I was doing it wrong. Why does it leave just 2" though, weird? Haha!

 

[soundtransmissi]

I have noticed a big difference in downshifting with my 2013 (which I bought last year) as compared to my 2006, which was surprisingly quick for such a big rig. I just attributed it to the 6 speed vs 4 speed transmission.

 

[GAINMOB]

welcome to the site

 

[MCExpy10]

I ended up taking it to a different dealership this morning to get a second opinion. They ran a diagnostic at my expense. They called me and said the transmission thing is normal. They're going to check to see if there's any software updates, but we'll see. They also couldn't duplicate the ignition coil thing. Big surprise there. Although they said they had a way to test each one.

Maybe I'm going crazy. I'm bummed that I've spent so much money in the 2 months that I've owned this thing when I paid what I did.

Someone tell me that overall these are good trucks, and I made the right choice going with an Expedition.

 

[GAINMOB]

That's why I don't do used...I know all can't...good luck

Mr. 10K

 

[ManUpOrShutUp]

Is the lethargic transmission performance related to the plugs/coil issue then? To me it seems like it's hunting for gears more than anything else. I haven't driven too many 6 speed transmissions, but I've never experienced something this slow to respond. I rented a new Escalade (8 speed, I think?), and that was like instant power to the wheels. I just find it hard to believe this transmission is acting as designed. Like I said, I pull my boat with it, it's quite a lot of weight and it doesn't act like it's slipping or anything. Just when I get on it, it takes 3 seconds or so and finally puts it to the road.

I find the transmission in my '11 EL to be pretty smooth aside from the occasionally abrupt downshifts when coming to a stop (which is as designed for the 6R80). You can't compare it to an Escalade though. A 2015 Escalade clocks in 0-60 times of 5.6 seconds according to C&D. A 2010 Expedition does it in about 8.6 seconds; my EL does it in about 9.6 seconds.

 

[MCExpy10]

I find the transmission in my '11 EL to be pretty smooth aside from the occasionally abrupt downshifts when coming to a stop (which is as designed for the 6R80). You can't compare it to an Escalade though. A 2015 Escalade clocks in 0-60 times of 5.6 seconds according to C&D. A 2010 Expedition does it in about 8.6 seconds; my EL does it in about 9.6 seconds.

You're right, that's not exactly fair. It's pretty smooth when it's going through the gears, it just gets a little sketchy when I need to pass the "self-righteous" Prius driver doing a cool 45 MPH in a 70 while in the fast lane. The dealership told me that the performance for the transmission was normal, but that they would check for software updates. Pretty sure I have the latest because I too noticed that clunk when coming to a stop, and had them fix that (with a software update) before I bought the truck. The dealership said because it's all drive by wire, the response time is a little slower. Mix that with the 6 speed transmission, and you experience what I have been.

My question though is say I really needed to move the truck. Would it be bad if I just popped the gear shifter into 3 and floored it? Would that essentially be putting it in the same "passing" gear as if I had waited the 4 seconds (and I'm not exaggerating, really about 4 seconds)?

The dealership thought that overnight it was maybe losing fuel pressure due to a bad fuel injector, thus rough starts in the morning until pressure was built back up. I'm also wondering if that is also why my crank time seems a little longer than expected.

Thanks for all of your knowledge, much appreciated!

 

[ManUpOrShutUp]

You could do that, but I wouldn't recommend doing it at highway speeds. Besides, if it's not shifting properly then the issue should be corrected rather than worked around. If your vehicle is under warranty or the dealer is in some way concerned they will be responsible for the cost of repairs, "operating as designed" is their way of absolving themselves of responsibility. I am not saying that is necessarily what is going on here, but advisors are trained to pitch that line.

 

[JollyRoger]

I would be willing to bet money it's your coil packs. You are close to 100K and they do get weak with age and use. There's no surefire way to test them under load, and many times they aren't acting up enough to throw codes. I've been down this road with 2 Expy's ('07 and '10) and had exactly the same problem you've had...mash the gas and the engine hesitates, thus the transmission can't find the right gear, and the engine feels like a 4 cylinder. Some of the coils may be fully capable of delivering enough spark during idle and slow speeds to mask their deficiencies, but under hard acceleration they aren't delivering enough spark to fully ignite all the gas. I remember being convinced that it was the transmission the first time it happened.

OEM Coil packs are very good and reliable, but I've been experimenting and I'm having great luck with these AC/Delco ones from Mexico. I hate buying parts like this, but $112 vs. $400+ means I can buy 2 sets if needed and still be way ahead. I've had no problem with them so far. New ACDelco BS C1659 Set of 8 High Performance Ignition Coil Brown Boot | eBay

You can change these yourself if you are even slightly mechanically inclined. There are videos on YouTube. For $112, I would start here. You are going to need them anyway when you hit 100K miles.

My 2 cents...hope it helps. Thanks

 

[GAINMOB]

Welcome to the site

Mr. 10K

 

[ManUpOrShutUp]

I would be willing to bet money it's your coil packs. You are close to 100K and they do get weak with age and use. There's no surefire way to test them under load, and many times they aren't acting up enough to throw codes. I've been down this road with 2 Expy's ('07 and '10) and had exactly the same problem you've had...mash the gas and the engine hesitates, thus the transmission can't find the right gear, and the engine feels like a 4 cylinder. Some of the coils may be fully capable of delivering enough spark during idle and slow speeds to mask their deficiencies, but under hard acceleration they aren't delivering enough spark to fully ignite all the gas. I remember being convinced that it was the transmission the first time it happened.

OEM Coil packs are very good and reliable, but I've been experimenting and I'm having great luck with these AC/Delco ones from Mexico. I hate buying parts like this, but $112 vs. $400+ means I can buy 2 sets if needed and still be way ahead. I've had no problem with them so far. New ACDelco BS C1659 Set of 8 High Performance Ignition Coil Brown Boot | eBay

You can change these yourself if you are even slightly mechanically inclined. There are videos on YouTube. For $112, I would start here. You are going to need them anyway when you hit 100K miles.

My 2 cents...hope it helps. Thanks

You can and should test the COPs before replacing them. While the ones used in these vehicles are prone to failure, they are not a maintenance item. At nearly 100K all 8 of mine are functioning as they should and my average MPG is 16.8 to boot, which is virtually unheard of in an EL. Your advice to me would be to replace them "just because"? The ones in my wife's car have 180K on them and are functioning as they should as well. Should we replace those just for the heck of it also?

 

[JollyRoger]

It's my preference and opinion. You can take it with a grain of salt. This is why I end my posts with "My 2 cents".

I base it on the fact that I've had 2 expeditions and one F150, all with 5.4v, all with over 100K miles. All 3 of the vehicles have had at least one or more COP's fail around 100K. Again, that's 100% of my 5.4v's. My opinion is that if one of them fails, a few more may not be far behind. I would rather spend the money and replace them all at the same time, rather than wait for each one to fail and then try to test them all to see which one it is, only to have yet another one fail a few months later.

Again, this is my opinion. It is not a recommended maintenance item by Ford. You can certainly take a different approach and I won't mind in the least. I'm not here to argue.

Thanks!

 

[98eb5.4]

The dealership thought that overnight it was maybe losing fuel pressure due to a bad fuel injector, thus rough starts in the morning until pressure was built back up. I'm also wondering if that is also why my crank time seems a little longer than expected.

i'd think that would be easy to check out, at least whether or not fuel pressure loss overnite is happening

 

[mmaylock]

Try putting some dilectric grease in each end of the spring in the COP boots. It's a very easy and inexpensive test. Not to mention it will help maintain a good connection regardless. It cured my '07 from poor acceleration that I had been experiencing for months.

 

[MCExpy10]

Try putting some dilectric grease in each end of the spring in the COP boots. It's a very easy and inexpensive test. Not to mention it will help maintain a good connection regardless. It cured my '07 from poor acceleration that I had been experiencing for months.

That is an excellent idea. I had the spark plugs replaced along with the boots. Is there any reason you wouldn't want to do that? Or maybe any reason why the dealership wouldn't have done that?

 

[mmaylock]

That is an excellent idea. I had the spark plugs replaced along with the boots. Is there any reason you wouldn't want to do that?

Not to my knowledge. Dielectric grease seals rubber connections and prevents corrosion of electrical connections.

Or maybe any reason why the dealership wouldn't have done that?

Sorry, I can't say.

 

[GaryH2]

Also, about the sunroof. It didn't use to do that. I used to have to hold the button down to get it to all the way open. If all of yours are doing it too though, I guess maybe I was doing it wrong. Why does it leave just 2" though, weird? Haha!

I have a 2007 EL with a sunroof. Mine will auto-open (except for the 2") like your but I need to hold the button to close.

The manual says that it leaves the 2" to reduce buffeting at speed with the sunroof open.

Rgarding the transmission, have you asked about reprogramming the trans? I wonder if its a mapping issue. My 07 responds very well to my right foot (it also has the 5.4 3V with 6 speed).

About the coil plugs, I consider myself lucky that I have the originals at 173,000 miles.