Replace '06 engine?

[shermn8r]

I have an '06 Eddie Bauer edition with 165,000 miles. I have just been told by a Ford dealership that I probably need a new engine (about $7,000). I'm getting a 2nd opinion tomorrow from another, non-Ford mechanic.

My thinking is, I will have a new (remanufactured) engine, so 0 miles on it, a warranty, and years more service. On the other hand, the vehicle still has a tranny and drive train with 165K miles on it.

So, my quandary. Do I pay $7K for repairs for an otherwise mechanically sound vehicle, or go $25K in debt for another used vehicle? (I won't buy new) Also, the dealer says the engine replacement is a worst-case scenario - once they tear the engine apart they'll know more about what repairs it actually needs, but they said I should prepare for the worst.

I've read a little about issues with the '06 5.4l engine. Some people recommend installing a different engine when a replacement becomes necessary.

My intention has always been to keep this vehicle as long as possible, but I never factored in an engine replacement.

Mechanically it's been a good vehicle with few problems and I'm **** about preventive maintenance. Last week I had the alternator and serpentine belt replaced at another Ford dealer. The alternator failed on me 200 miles from home and they advised replacing the belt at that time due to wear. I also have nearly $900 in new tires on it. Cosmetically it has mild hail damage and the famous tailgate corrosion started showing up last year.

So..... your thoughts?

 

[stamp11127]

What is the problem that made you take it in?

 

[shermn8r]

After replacing the alternator and serpentine belt, I wanted a full check-up on it. Basically a bumper-to-bumper look at fluids, filters, joints, bearings, whatever. It's been awhile since I had anyone look at it in depth (last time was 100K at a Ford dealer).
The dealership listened to a noise coming from the engine and decided that they shouldn't proceed until the engine issue was resolved.

 

[stamp11127]

I'd wait on the 2nd opinion and compare notes to what the dealer has stated.

Wouldn't hurt to ask the cost of reman engine/trans combo before pulling the trigger on anything.

 

[69Hcode]

Did you hear the noise? Can you describe it? I'm sure someone on the forum has had the same issue it might not be that bad.

 

[shermn8r]

Just a slight knocking/tapping noise. Doesn't sound like anything to my untrained ear.

 

[69Hcode]

Does it go away when warmed up? Is it just for a few seconds when it first starts?

 

[shermn8r]

No, it's constant. Maybe more pronounced when engine is warm. Also, engine uses oil. No leakage, but about 1/2 quart every 300 - 400 miles. Engine has been making the noise for a long time and I always attributed it to low engine oil so I always keep it topped off.

 

[DetroitDarin]

Oh jeezus - RUN AWAY from that dealership. These engines tick a little bit. Does the engine have good power? Does it get normal fuel economy? If the ticking is LOUD - like...a diesel maybe? I'd bet it's one of your spark plugs has backed out (happened to me). Two shops thought the rods were bent, one shop swore it was the Cam Phasers. a MIDAS of all places pulled the coil pack, saw the plug flopping around inside; replaced the plug and the truck is fine now.

 

[GAINMOB]

wait for 2nd opinion and given that u wont by new...$7K is better that $25K over however many years unless you don't have the $7K...also...if able...try to do some of the repairs yourself...the alt and belt can be done in ur drive way with basic tools...if youre physically capable of doing it so if you don't have any medical probs you'd be good to go and we're more than willing to help guide you along with step by step directions and youtube is a great resource

 

[shermn8r]

Yes, the ticking is normal, I've listened to it for years and always wondered why it did that, but I accepted it, as I accept the noise the power steering has always made. However, it has seemed to be more noticeable, especially when you're up against a wall, like in a drive-thru.

Engine pulls strong on the highway. Cruise is set at 80 and varies only slightly with hills and strong headwinds. I've been consistently getting 14 mpg highway and 10-11 mpg around town. Seems about right for an engine this old.

I could have made the repairs myself, I guess, although I'm not mechanically inclined. I have the tools at home, but I wasn't at home at the time. I also couldn't do it in the time it took a mechanic to do it. For me, an alternator and serpentine belt would have taken me most of the day using my Chiltons, and there would have been a lot of @#$%^&* language, tools embedded in walls, smashed fingers and multiple extra trips to the auto parts store for things that I broke along the way. All in all, $400 was probably a bargain compared to the physical and emotional toll it would have taken on me.

The dealer did mention cam phazers, among other things, in our conversation. To his credit, I think he was trying to convince me to NOT have the repairs done, but to get another vehicle. Also to his credit, he never told me to look for something at the dealership, but to look at car prices in general around town.

There's another Ford dealership local that I'll get a quote from as well as my usual mechanic. So, what should I say to other mechanics? Should I tell them that a Ford mechanic told me I need a new engine? That seems like I'm leading them to a high-profit conclusion that they should be coming to on their own. Should I just say that I hear a new noise in the engine and let them decide for themselves?

 

[01yellerCobra]

Don't tell them anything. Let them come to their own conclusions. Phasers are pretty loud. But they don't require a new engine. The clicking could be injectors. You can hear them in the wife's vert with the hood up.

 

[69Hcode]

An exhaust leak can make a ticking sound. It will change with temp as the manifolds warm up. Can you tell if the sounds are coming from the sides of the engine. Make sure no studs are broken off the manifolds.

 

[shermn8r]

After trips to 2 Ford dealerships and 2 other trusted mechanics, they all say the same thing - my cam phasers are bad and I need a new engine. They also all say the same price - $7,000 plus or minus a couple hundred dollars.

The cam phasers can be replaced, but the cost to replace them (parts/labor) is not much less than to replace the entire engine. Replacing them means you may still have additional problems with the engine due to the bad cams, or from something else as yet unknown. With a new engine I will have a full 3 year warranty on it.

So tomorrow I drop off the Expy with my friendly neighborhood Ford dealer.

Thanks to everyone who gave me great advice here!

 

[DetroitDarin]

Cam Phaser replacement is about $2000, tops around here. MAYBE 2500. I think they are playing you. If the cam phasers are bad, NOTHING else has to be broken. Check out the cam phaser lock outs from Livernois Motorsports.

Livernois Motorsports Exclusive Products - Cam Phasers & Lockouts - Livernois Motorsports

Get ahold of those guys and they will help.

 

[AggieExpo]

if you look at my brisk spark plug post i had a similar problem with the dealership telling me that my engine was shot. it ran rough and was in poor shape. new plugs and and new cops and it now runs "too me" better than new. I too agree with DetroitDarin. i had the dealership here in college station, tx quote me 2000 for new cam phasers on a previous visit. are you getting a check engine light?