Scammed or Clueless? 2009 Expedition

[stamp11127]

I wouldn't put another penny into it before I had the warranty papers in my hand. Talk is cheap. And yes, that was an auction vehicle - now you know why the last owner dumped it.
If you or the selling dealer decide to fix it, one of the normal steps is to measure the cylinder compression unless the head gasket failure is obvious then the readings would be a waste of time. An example would be the coolant is blown out of the surge tank by the quarts.

 

[USMCBuckWild]

I would push for a full on 100k maintenance to be done, complete overhaul of timing components, fuel filter, trans/transfer case/diff fluids, the whole nine yards.

 

[Snag]

Ok rcanfiel we have to know. What did you find out from the dealer. Scammed or clueless????? or better yet, they are glad to cover it or give your money back.

 

[Bedrck47]

By now they may be trying to sell him the bridge that is for sale in Brooklyn

 

[Snag]

me too, I want in. I used to have some ocean front property in Arizona.

Another person just posted with a dead 2011. My god these modular engines are killing me

 

[John Christopher]

Everyone wants to know what the dealer told you. I live in CT but wouldn't buy a car out of state unless it was certified. That way you can take it to any company dealer.

 

[rcanfiel]

OK, Update

Perhaps some might think I didn't do my due diligence, but I did a major amount of research, including having the Ford dealership do a used car inspection. I doubt anyone here did as much research as I did on a used vehicle. However no matter what you do, there are always a dozen other things that people will think of.

The car is sitting at the mechanic's. I provided the requested documentation to the warranty company, provided by the dealer. Unfortunately, the warranty company has not a so good reputation, so not sure if they will find a way to punt.

My current plan is, see what the warranty company will do, for a couple days. If they cover, I will go after the dealer for the balance. If not, I will still go after the dealer. I would also go after the warranty company

Go after (both) = first, personally request fix. Second inform them and also file with Attorney General's office, BBB, small claims court. For dealer, I would also go after their yelp, yp, google+ and other reviews.

Not listing all details here of evidence, etc.

Adding: after dealer heard about the problems, they extended the warranty they purchased for me from the normal 3 up to 12 months.

 

[lbv150]

16,000 on oil change? Holy crap batman! Wow that dirty oil should have been highly visible on the dipstick. Dirty oil is the number one killer of the 5.4

 

[Bedrck47]

Its not that some think you didn't do your due diligence which you most likely did. The fact that it had codes reported to you
battery/antitheft most likely a P1000 code which is drive cycle incomplete would have made my shy away from the expy at least until all the codes cleared. Which can take about 50 miles of driving. That plus when you drove it home and the smoke coming out the back end would have been enough for me to turn around and take it back. But you kept it and it wouldn't start the next morning.

And now look at all you are going through and you don't have a vehicle that you can drive.

I think most of us agree that you were scammed. And also most feel bad that you were.

And we are concerned about the results that you finally arrive at.

I use to live in NJ and I one purchased a used car from a dealer that had a good reputation yet when my wife drove it one day she asked how far was the trip she just made I told her it was jut a little over 100 miles she responded that the car only showed 50 miles traveled. I called the dealer who stated there was no report of that kind of problem It was previous a fleet rental vehicle. If I had a rental that was only recording half the actual miles traveled I surly would say anything either. Long story short I requested a refund or I was going to turn the vehicle over to the state to be checked out. Had my refund the next day

 

[briangelc]

Why are you getting bogged down in mechanics and warranties? You are making his problem into your problem by attempting to resolve it for him. After reading the first post I would have immediately taken that car back for a refund. He didn't disclose that the car had a blown head gasket, right? Case closed. I also would have never left the dealership without a bill of sale, and necessary odometer certifications, sales contract, etc.
If the dealer is ethical, he will just take this car back and try to help you find another car. If he is unwilling to do that, then politely tell him you will resolve this problem in court.
...and reveal his business practices to the public.

 

[1955moose]

Brian is right, anytime a licensed used car dealer misrepresents any item like mileage, or a state inspection is breaking the law. I purchased one of my Mustang gt's about 20 years back, to replace my 85, that had gotten totaled. The car lot testified that it was 85k miles. I bought it, and started checking out brakes, and other items. We discovered it had 186k. I contacted car lot, told them I was going to get consumer affairs involved, they had my cash $4,000 the next day. If your problems happened weeks, or months later, then you would have to consider repairs. All car lots and dealers fib about something, it's just part of selling used cars. But with a total flim flam that they pulled, I'd push the refund issue if you can get it. Consult your attorney or lawyers referral service for legal advice. Automotive purchase legal aspect, vary from state to state.


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[rcanfiel]

16,000 on oil change? Holy crap batman! Wow that dirty oil should have been highly visible on the dipstick. Dirty oil is the number one killer of the 5.4

I noted that not sure why Ford dealer did not detect that nor the extremely dirty air filter nor the bad head gasket. They are on my radar if this not resolved.

 

[rcanfiel]

Why are you getting bogged down in mechanics and warranties? You are making his problem into your problem by attempting to resolve it for him. After reading the first post I would have immediately taken that car back for a refund. He didn't disclose that the car had a blown head gasket, right? Case closed. I also would have never left the dealership without a bill of sale, and necessary odometer certifications, sales contract, etc.
If the dealer is ethical, he will just take this car back and try to help you find another car. If he is unwilling to do that, then politely tell him you will resolve this problem in court.
...and reveal his business practices to the public.

It is my assessment that the dealer got stuck with this vehicle from someone, at auction or from a direct purchase. They were very cordial after the Ford used car inspection. They fixed what would have been $1400 in repairs to front windows that did not go up properly. When the codes were

I am not convinced they knew about the head gasket. I test drove it 40 miles round trip to Ford and it seemed fine. I did not know it was smoking on the 90 mile trip home, as it was night time and foggy. My wife noted it to me later, following in the rental car, but her cellphone was dead.

I am giving this a couple days to see if warranty company will do their part and then seek the remainder or a refund from the dealer. If they go from accommodating to rejecting being reasonable, I will unload a lot of hell on them.

 

[Bedrck47]

Find this interesting In your first post you stated

"So I picked it up last night and drove it home. My friend followed in another car, and noticed some smoke (and so did I). But it was night and raining, so I thought little of it."

And in you last post you state,

"I did not know it was smoking on the 90 mile trip home, as it was night time and foggy. My wife noted it to me later, following in the rental car, but her cellphone was dead."

Very Confusing statements.

 

[rcanfiel]

Its not that some think you didn't do your due diligence which you most likely did. The fact that it had codes reported to you
battery/antitheft most likely a P1000 code which is drive cycle incomplete would have made my shy away from the expy at least until all the codes cleared.

The dealer had it and said they cleared the codes. Does not mean codes would have revealed the head gasket issue, but I do not pretend to be a mechanic...

 

[1955moose]

One thing I learned from my attorney nephew, is don't vary from your original story. Whatever you told the first manager/ owner, stay with that story, don't wander. Write it all down, document times, dates. Receipts for everything. Judges always want to see proof, not here say.


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[rcanfiel]

Just got call from warranty company. They denied it because it was prior existing. Sounds like Obamacare

I am following my steps, 1. 2. 3.

Now to go after the dealer.

 

[rcanfiel]

Find this interesting In your first post you stated

"So I picked it up last night and drove it home. My friend followed in another car, and noticed some smoke (and so did I). But it was night and raining, so I thought little of it."

And in you last post you state,

"I did not know it was smoking on the 90 mile trip home, as it was night time and foggy. My wife noted it to me later, following in the rental car, but her cellphone was dead."

Very Confusing statements.

There were 3 people in the following car. What is confusing? I was really not sure if it was smoking or not, until I thought about it later. It was dark, foggy and rainy that night. At first, I just thought it was fog going across the road. The next morning I noticed it, because the smoke was coming out the tailpipe, not the engine area.

 

[lbv150]

Looking back at the original posts on page one....if when everything's said and done with the dealer and you are stuck with the thing, instead of putting $2500 into just a head gasket I would put in a Ford or other remanufactured engine. Only a matter of time before the cam phasers seize, worn piston rings, timing chain breaks and all sorts of oil related engine problems. And we still didn't cover transmission and AC issues....been there and done that once with a used '06 Expy...never again.

Wish you the best

 

[rcanfiel]

Looking back at the original posts on page one....if when everything's said and done with the dealer and you are stuck with the thing, instead of putting $2500 into just a head gasket I would put in a Ford or other remanufactured engine. Only a matter of time before the cam phasers seize, worn piston rings, timing chain breaks and all sorts of oil related engine problems. And we still didn't cover transmission and AC issues....been there and done that once with a used '06 Expy...never again.

Wish you the best

That is the plan. I was willing to go with the warranty repairs. But now that it is off the table, I want a remanufactured or used engine. If used, not too high miles and not anything before 2009. And if swapping out the engine, I will replace the kind of parts that cost a lot because you have to remove the engine.

As above, very dirty air filter and 16,000 miles since last oil change mean potential other engine problems. And as my mechanic said, SOMETHING ELSE may have caused the head gasket to blow.

I chose the 2009 Expedition because it was not an 08 or earlier. It is my understanding (from a lot research) that the engine and tranny that year addressed a lot of the issues you mentioned. And that the 2009 required a lot fewer repairs than earlier models.