I'm at a crossroads of sort. I could use some input.
I can get a 2017 Expy EL Limited now for about 55k. But I'm having a hard time getting the dealer to go higher that 15k on my F150. Even
www.kbb.com says 20k.
thanks.
You have an interesting conundrum Sopher,
Sorry that this is so long but I wanted to give you some useful info so I hope this helps you. Although I am not going to tell you which way I think you should go, I’ll try to give you a path to a place where making that decision will become very easy for you! I know that most people don’t negotiate for a living but once you’re able to eliminate the “unknowns”, the decision will become much clearer!
Either way you go I think if you end up buying a ’17, you will enjoy it and if you end up buying a ’18, you will enjoy that too! I know that DL has said he’s waiting to get a ’18 and I’m happy for him just as I am for any on here who get to buy a new truck so there is no “lose”.
I’m not going to argue that Flex’s comments about leasing seem to make sense but I never lease but that’s just me. What you guys do is up to you.
I tend to agree with DL in that after everything I’ve been able to find & read about the ’18, that I seriously doubt that it would have the 2.7 as an option so just for fun, let’s take that out of the equation and see if we can break it down this way.
Things that you already know or of reasonably sure of;
Presently, the best price on a ’17 El limited is 55K but you didn’t mention if that’s their price or if that’s your OTD price. I work in OTD but know that many people do not so which is it?
The ’17 doesn’t come with the 10spd, it has the 6 spd. I think those of us that have it, like it but you will have to drive it to see if you do.
The ’18 will probably be somewhere in the 5% to 7% higher range considering the 10spd, the higher level of tech so just for fun, let’s say that changes that 55K to 58K or possibly even 60K because of reduced incentives or higher “overhead” to the dealer etc. So a 3-5 grand increase seems close, agreed?
The deal-complicating trade….they are offering you 15K and you want 20K. Again, about a 5K difference.
Only you know if selling outright is a viable option for you or not but while it’s best to sell, you would have to coordinate to get the “loyalty” money by owning it on the same date that you buy. Dealers are getting somewhere around 1500-1800 for that.
I try to keep the buy-trade as separate deals, get the trade done then the new. They will want to tie them together because this is what they do for a living and are very good with fast numbers mixing percentages, fractions and markups vs deducts. If you are not, a good SM or GM can and will eat your lunch. I can “fly” with them either way but I still try to separate the deals “to make it easier on them” is what I’ll tell them. I’ll give them as far as a “based on buying X model” but never based on a specific price for X!
How bad do you need a dealer after the sale? If like me, you may never have to walk into his lot again so for me, it didn’t matter how far the dealer was that I bought from. They will most likely, never see me again. ANY Ford dealer will do oil changes & warranty work. Will one that you buy from smile more, maybe but that’s it, unless like my GF, you tuck a crap load of free oil changes into the deal. But either way, this is something that you already know. FYI- I got a local Grease&Go that charges me 34 bucks and used my Mobil 1 & my filter but considering how much a pita these are to change (w/o making a mess) and that I don’t have a trench or a car lift, it’s perfect for me.
Your credit- Every single salesman I’ve even know in nearly 60 years has told me the same thing “I could sell five cars a day if I could get them financed”. This is big because a 525 score, no-credit fool is going to get slammed with a high price and higher percentage and Bam, take it or leave it. The 784 score stellar-credit is going to have the SM getting your coffee for you and your SM putting in the sugar because they know that for them, half of the deal is already done!
So those are the things that you know.
Now let’s take about the things you don’t or can’t know. & the really important stuff:
You MAY have not got the best price on a ’17 EL Limited yet. I don’t know where you are located or if the 55K was a OTD price or not. One ploy I have used is to visit any dealer very close to the Dealer I want to deal with and I’ll take an hour, drive one of his trucks then have him write me up a price sheet. No commitment, no down payment. Then roll it up facing outwards and let the Dealer you want to deal with see it. Don’t be crass about it, he won’t need to see their name to know who it is from, he will recognize the form itself….it does work and everything helps.
A dealer with a lot full of ’17 Expy’s will want to get them sold because he needs the space for the ‘18’s
A dealer with only a few may want his space for new Mustangs or 150’s so he also has incentive to get them sold.
A dealer with no spare space on his lot places a cost premium per space per week so again, he has reason to sell.
Since you have no way of knowing what his issues are, you have to be willing to take the time to go to all the Ford dealers until you find the one that “hungry” and there is always one that hungry! Once you hand over your D/L and come back from your test drive while they have run your preliminary credit(they don’t need permission to do this), one of those dealers is going to show his hand…that he’s hungry and your “*****”. My GF doesn’t like when I call them that but I negotiate for a living so it comes with the career.
THEE single most important thing to remember is that we all want to be loved, so treat everyone with respect and work to raise THEIR comfort level by laughing with them, coaxing, cajoling and lightening the mood so everyone knows that we’re all here for a win-win for all. You want them to WANT to help you and you NEED their help so you can help them! Gabbish? Don’t be afraid to let them know that you are ready to buy, happy to buy and ABLE to buy cause half their deal is done by them knowing that you are a Stellar-credit guy! The more they like you, the harder they will work FOR you.
I took my GF with me because when we are together, everyone assumes that we’ve been married for 30 years because we laugh so much, show lots of affection and have fun with everything. This is important because the old time-honored “hardball” method doesn’t work with the people you will meet in dealers. What it will get you is them getting off the boat (leaving the deal) at a much higher price than you need because they don’t WANT to help you because, well, because they think you are a dick!
Also, continue to remind the SM or GM that whatever “hit” he takes by helping you, he is going to make it right back on the next guy! Over and over but not too much….people learn by repetition but get angry at their intelligence being insulted so be subtle but effective.
You need to raise their comfort level so high they will invest the 2-3 hours that it takes to get a good deal done….one other thing, ALWAYS go to a dealer with a full stomach. That’s actually a rule I enter into any negotiation using because when you can’t run on empty and you will subconsciously rush through important details if you are hungry.
Buying a car or truck when you don’t HAVE to buy is a great & wonderful place to be so enjoy it and enjoy the process…..it really is fun and something that we usually don’t get a chance to do very often so make the most, have fun and good luck!
jeff
FWIW: (
http://www.expeditionforum.com/threads/2017-expy-limited.30717/ for the details)
My ’17 OTD price was $53,890.00. With everythingexcept the computer suspension and rear dvd's. That’s taxes(6% in MD), Registration, tags, freight, docs etc. I ordered ZERO adds from the finance guy, no extended warranties, no tire warranties, no paint warranties no warranties on warranties...you get the idea.
