Electric Fan and towing

[01yellerCobra]

Has anyone that tows swapped to an electric fan? If so, which fan did you go with. I have an electric fan sitting in the garage, but I doubt it would work in the truck.

 

[tonydiv]

Read the info on the Flex a Lite site about their fan and towing. The flex a lite draws more cfm across the radiator than any other setup (the shroud helps with this). They say that it is good up to 18,000 total gross vehicle weight.

Flex-a-lite Monster Direct Fit Electric Fans 270 - SummitRacing.com

 

[1997SCEBFEX]

Thought about it too, but can tell you that I towed this monster around to/from the East to West Coast and in between fully loaded many times w/ no probs.

Not pictured is my roof-mounted air deflector & the Nose Cone was a great addition to divert the air from that massive surface area.

 

[01yellerCobra]

Thought about it too, but can tell you that I towed this monster around to/from the East to West Coast and in between fully loaded many times w/ no probs.

Not pictured is my roof-mounted air deflector & the Nose Cone was a great addition to divert the air from that massive surface area.

Are you running an electric fan? I don't think I'll tow something that big. But I do know the wife is starting to wonder where we could store a toy box.

 

[Thermo]

yeller, the big thing to keep in mind when looking at an e-fan setup is the CFM of air that the fan will pull. The magic number you need to be looking at is 3,000 total (assuming you are running 2 fans or 1 large one). Getting less than 3,000 and you are asking for problems. You can go with more air flow, but what you will find is that it will be a big draw on your electrical system. So, however you want to do that.

I am one of those that has switched over to an e-fan setup. I used it when towing a car trailer with a 73 El Camino on it. Never saw the temp needle move.

 

[BakerEdition]

I have bought one of these radiators and a duel E-fan set up from troyerperformance.com
the fan set up was a little over 400.00 but state of the art...i upgraded to a 200 amp alternator already.

All Aluminum Radiator Ford Expedition 1999 2000 2001 2002 99 00 01 02 at MT | eBay

 

[mindgame]

a duel E-fan set up from troyerperformance.com

Same here...

 

[sgtowing]

yeller, the big thing to keep in mind when looking at an e-fan setup is the CFM of air that the fan will pull. The magic number you need to be looking at is 3,000 total (assuming you are running 2 fans or 1 large one). Getting less than 3,000 and you are asking for problems. You can go with more air flow, but what you will find is that it will be a big draw on your electrical system. So, however you want to do that.

I am one of those that has switched over to an e-fan setup. I used it when towing a car trailer with a 73 El Camino on it. Never saw the temp needle move.

He is the e-fan man.

 

[toms89]

Here is an interesting read.

I didnt write it but feel there is some truth to it. I know its speaking about a mazda by the concept still applies.

The Myth Of The Electric Fan

Im sticking with the stock fan with my build because I know its very reliable and has no demand from the alternator. I already have additional load on the alt from a larger fuel pump and heat exchanger pump.

Check out question #4. And this is from an electric fan manufacturer.

http://automotive.flex-a-lite.com/frequent-questions/

 

[01yellerCobra]

That's interesting tom. Especially coming from an electric fan manufacturer.

I did some research and found out the Mark VIII fan I picked up for the Cobra is rated between 4500 and 5000 cfm. I like having the e-fan on the Cobra. I've changed the on/off points in the tune. And it's never had an issue. Even using the A/C in Arizona in the middle of summer.

Might have to take some measurements and see where my thoughts take me.

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[daoud elmassri]

Good morning a littel in poot on your build . No pun but here it is I jave installed the mark viii fan in my 2000 expedition I pulled my 24ft Grady White last week the boat ways about 10,000 lb fuly loaded had no issues at all sje tow like no tommorow temp did not move . I also did not brack no speed records just took my time towed on 50 miles or so . The truck right now is pritty much stock except K@n coldair intake thats it . The only thing I dont like about this efan is the fan stays on once the temp get to 170and stays on I have to change temp relay to a 200 - 210 it comes from a 86-87 corvet this should take care o . the isue.

 

[toms89]

Again....I didnt write the article and I know there is efficiency to be gained by going electric because it may be turned off at speed. But for reliability I think the stock setup is hard to beat.

The real test for any electric fan would not be at speed towing, heat etc....the ram air is generally sufficient at that point to make the fan unnecessary. These trucks have very open grills and large radiators!! The test is the same conditions when you are caught in heavy stop and go traffic when you do not have sufficient natural airflow across the radiator.

After my modifications to the expy I took the family to the outer banks with boat in tow. We got caught in horrible traffic in 95+ degree heat. Stop and go for 2 hours at speeds less than 10 mph. Not fun but if you visit the outerbanks frequently you know this is quite common. A/C was running full time and the stock fan passed the test.

Its nice to hear most have good experience with electric fans with the expy It does make it more comforting to consider in the future. If for nothing else to allow me cool my expy between rounds. I will say my experience with my highly modified 89 mustang electric fan was not as promising. Heavy stop and go summer traffic and I could just watch my temp gauge begin to creep up hence my reservations.

I am also very skeptical of the exaggerated gains in hp and mpg claims made by the manufacturer. Maybe if the stock fan clutch was locked up it would take 17 hp to turn at high rpm?! If you ever had this happen you know it because it sounds like a 747 as you give it gas!!

 

[toms89]

That's interesting tom. Especially coming from an electric fan manufacturer.

I did some research and found out the Mark VIII fan I picked up for the Cobra is rated between 4500 and 5000 cfm. I like having the e-fan on the Cobra. I've changed the on/off points in the tune. And it's never had an issue. Even using the A/C in Arizona in the middle of summer.

Might have to take some measurements and see where my thoughts take me.

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It would be nice if this could be done on the expy. I have seen the option in the expy software but dont know that the hardware supports it. Where is the control wire or driver for fan relay?? I assume the cobra came with electric fan?!

 

[01yellerCobra]

It would be nice if this could be done on the expy. I have seen the option in the expy software but dont know that the hardware supports it. Where is the control wire or driver for fan relay?? I assume the cobra came with electric fan?!

Yeah, the Cobra cam with an electric fan. The stock thermostat is rated at 195 degrees, but the stock setting has the low fan coming on at 214 degrees. I lowered everything about 10 degrees to keep it in check. I also have an aluminum radiator waiting to go in.

It seems there's pros and cons to both sides. This might end up being a future mod. I was getting ready to swap out to an electric fan on my Mountaineer just because a new clutch was close to $200 and I had an electric fan sititng in the garage. I was going to use an aftermarket controller so it would act like a stock set up.

I imagine having the huge radiator helps too. In my younger days I had a 1970 Mustang that I swapped a 351W into. The stock little radiator just couldn't keep up. Even with a fan out of a half ton van. I swapped to a big block style radiator and it never went above 180 degrees.

 

[Thermo]

Ok, i am going to toss in my 2 cents on the subject and some of the "thermo-knowledge" as I see it and for others to ponder. First off, making the assumption that both an e-fan and a mechanical fan pull the same amount of air, one would assume that it takes the same amount of air. In reality, it takes a different amount of air. Like the article somewhat states, the e-fan is more efficient (ie, takes less power). Why is that? Simple, the e-fan spins at 1 speed where the mechanical fan has to operate over a much larger range. If you want to test me, it is simple. With the motor ice cold (which should have the mechanical fan in a free spinning condition), open the hood and then start the motor. Now, rev the motor slightly and listen to the mechanical fan change speed and feel the amount of air the "free spinning" fan is blowing. Moving any amount of air requires a finite amount of power (basic laws of physics). Where, in an e-fan setup, the fans do not move at all because the switch is not made up (assuming a properly designed system, if you need help, let me know). So, even with the motor ice cold, some amount of power is being taken from the engine to move the air. How much power is being used, like the article said, only the manufacturer knows truely. The numbers I have seen is in the 6-8 hp range from a 4.6L mustang article about e-fans.

Another advantage that I will put in here is that e-fans will allow the motor to warm up faster because like you could have proved, the mechanical fan is still pulling some air through the radiator. The thermostat doesn't "pop" open once it hits a magical temp, it slowly opens over a temperature range. So, as you start getting close to the desired temp (within about 40 degrees or so), the thermostat starts letting some of the warmer water through the radiator, which is then cooled slightly by the mechanical fan, removing heat, and slowing how fast the motor heats up. The e-fan is still sitting there, not turning since it has not reached its turn on point (if properly set up).

Like the article somewhat talks about, if you put the two fans on equal terms (same air flow), the e-fan is going to require less power because:

1) the fan is enclosed in a hoop around the fan blades, preventing air from being discharged out the blade tips, not being effectively used and actually can be sucked back in to be pushed by the blades multiple times
2) the blades of the e-fan only spin at 1 speed, so, therefore can be more finely tuned to pull the maximum amount of air using the least amount of power.

Like a lot of you have said, the stock fan does what you need, so why change it. I tend to agree with this point. But, at the same time, I also have to pose a question: If mechanical fans are "more efficient", then why are all manufacturers (even semi's now) switching over to e-fans in an attempt to make better mileage? Just some food for thought.

If you have some of your own ideas, please put them out there and I will toss around some ideas that I have. Please note that I am a firm believer in the gains are not great when doing the switch from a mechanical fan to an e-fan. But, at the same time, I know working on my truck after the e-fan mod has become tons easier because I now have 8" of clearance between my fans and the motor. I sit on the radiator, stick my feet down in front of the motor and I lean in a little bit to work on the motor. Makes things so nice if for no other reason.

 

[1997SCEBFEX]

Are you running an electric fan? I don't think I'll tow something that big. But I do know the wife is starting to wonder where we could store a toy box.

No Sir.
Last e-fans were on the '99 two-wheeled sport tourer and the '96 LT4 Grand Sport Vette.

 

[toms89]

Ok, i am going to toss in my 2 cents on the subject and some of the "thermo-knowledge" as I see it and for others to ponder. First off, making the assumption that both an e-fan and a mechanical fan pull the same amount of air, one would assume that it takes the same amount of air. In reality, it takes a different amount of air. Not following you here unless you are stating different fans have different CFM's flow capacity. No argument there. Like the article somewhat states, the e-fan is more efficient (ie, takes less power). Why is that? Simple, the e-fan spins at 1 speed where the mechanical fan has to operate over a much larger range. If you want to test me, it is simple. With the motor ice cold (which should have the mechanical fan in a free spinning condition), open the hood and then start the motor. Now, rev the motor slightly and listen to the mechanical fan change speed and feel the amount of air the "free spinning" fan is blowing. The article may have stated that Moving any amount of air requires a finite amount of power (basic laws of physics). Where, in an e-fan setup, the fans do not move at all because the switch is not made up Bingo!!(assuming a properly designed system, if you need help, let me know). So, even with the motor ice cold, some amount of power is being taken from the engine to move the air. How much power is being used, like the article said, only the manufacturer knows truely. The numbers I have seen is in the 6-8 hp range from a 4.6L mustang article about e-fans. This is more realistic!!

Another advantage that I will put in here is that e-fans will allow the motor to warm up faster because like you could have proved, the mechanical fan is still pulling some air through the radiator. The thermostat doesn't "pop" open once it hits a magical temp, it slowly opens over a temperature range. So, as you start getting close to the desired temp (within about 40 degrees or so), the thermostat starts letting some of the warmer water through the radiator, which is then cooled slightly by the mechanical fan, removing heat, and slowing how fast the motor heats up. The e-fan is still sitting there, not turning since it has not reached its turn on point (if properly set up).

Like the article somewhat talks about, if you put the two fans on equal terms (same air flow), the e-fan is going to require less power because:

1) the fan is enclosed in a hoop around the fan blades, (some not all) preventing air from being discharged out the blade tips, not being effectively used and actually can be sucked back in to be pushed by the blades multiple times
2) the blades of the e-fan only spin at 1 speed, so, therefore can be more finely tuned to pull the maximum amount of air using the least amount of power.

Low rotating mass design due to limited rpm range. Mechanical fan has to be much beefier due to the volume of air necessary at idle and the relatively low rpm of the motor and of course the large rpm range. There is also much tighter clearance to radiator and shroud with electric which cannot be done with mechanical due to engine movement.

Like a lot of you have said, the stock fan does what you need, so why change it. I tend to agree with this point. But, at the same time, I also have to pose a question: If mechanical fans are "more efficient", then why are all manufacturers (even semi's now) switching over to e-fans in an attempt to make better mileage? Just some food for thought.

Not sure where it was mentioned that mechanical fans are more efficient. Let me make it clear I do not believe this. Maybe your refering to the article where it spoke about the inefficiency of converting mechanical energy to electric back to mechanical. This is simple physics but the loss is far less than the gain. Electric will still be more efficient...properly designed of course. This is why I said feel there is some truth to it not that I agree with it. I would also point out that much of the electic fans are installed in most vehicles now is due to easier packaging and tighter clearances. The reason why front wheel drives have always had electric fans..... So I would not assume fuel milage is the sole reason a manufacture chose to do it.

If you have some of your own ideas, please put them out there and I will toss around some ideas that I have. Please note that I am a firm believer in the gains are not great when doing the switch from a mechanical fan to an e-fan. But, at the same time, I know working on my truck after the e-fan mod has become tons easier because I now have 8" of clearance between my fans and the motor. I sit on the radiator, stick my feet down in front of the motor and I lean in a little bit to work on the motor. Makes things so nice if for no other reason.

Just some of my food for thought to bounce off you thermo.
...

 

[Canadian Expy]

Tom are you trying to make us blind!!!???
I can barely read your reply
The blue font is terrible
but thanks for the e-fan info

 

[01yellerCobra]

Sounds like it just boils down to personal preference. Both set ups will work. Just depends on what you want to use.

 

[mindgame]

Chiming in with one more benefit of efans...

You end up with a cra* load of space to stand in between the radiator and engine