Transmission overheating after service

[John Ferrero]

Cheers. Had vehicle into local Ford dealership for an auto start-stop issue (approx. 59.5k m), when stopping it would turn off as expected then would re-start (a majority of the time it would lurch forward with a shuddee). No problem diagnosed after consultation with Ford Engineering. Brought in again when time allowed, right at 60k m. Again diagnostics showed no codes thrown. After another consultation with FE they determined the issue to be the auxillary tranny pump (embedded in tranny) was not functioning and would cause the vehicle to restart (presumably sensing no fluid flow?). Great, pump replaced along with tranny fluid and filter (which they attempted to charge $200 for, claiming aux. pump was outside tranny and fluid change wasn't required! I simply requested tech to show me under the vehicle where said pump existed outside tranny....they relented and 'ack.' it was in tranny after consulting with their svc. manual and would be covered under warranty and I'd only be charged for the new filter). After the service I noted fluids on my garage floor over successive days, smelled like could be transmission fluid. I brought it back into the dealership where they determined just some residual fluid dripping down. That same evening, yesterday, I took the vehicle on a trip a couple hundred miles into Wi. Was monitoring tranny temp for annomolies (typically ran 205 deg on ski trips with fully load in/on vehicle - from prior monitoring while on ski trips). Seemed good at 205 deg. Around 200 miles into the trip (approx 45 deg out/no load in or on vehicle) I noticed slight slip/hesitancy when trying to accelerate (was doing 83 in light of traffic on expressway). Temp was showing 243 deg. and started slipping/more shuddering. I immediately brought down to 75 and temp. started to drop down to 232. I had to drive another 150 miles to get to destination (and was in the middle of no-where Wi., 10:30pm so pulling into dealer en-route wasn't an option). Will be bringing into local Ford dealer this AM for inspection, any thoughts on issue? I suspect underfill or overfill of tranny fluid. Any opinions on long-term damage of tranny due to event?

 

[shane_th_ee]

I think you should find another Ford dealer. They already lied to you once about the transmission pump location. Then they either assumed nothing was wrong when you found transmission fluid on your garage floor or, again, they lied to save themselves some money...

 

[John Ferrero]

Agreed, had determined I would not deal with them again after the initial lie. Unfortunately was already locked in at that point. The question is has there been any damage that is going to show up later by running at 230 deg.? Just got word from the local Ford dealer up here in eagle River Wisconsin they are two weeks out for service. They will check fluid level but can't drop the pan to see if something is kinked and is limiting flow. So the question am I driving home or leaving up here for 2 to 3 weeks... Wife's not going to be happy either way!

 

[scottdm]

If it's still under warranty ask the Ford dealer where you made the appt 2 weeks out if they want you to drive it and risk destroying the tranny, or if they want to give you a loaner in the mean time? Tell them you don't mind either way since it will be on Ford's dime.

 

[shane_th_ee]

Agreed, had determined I would not deal with them again after the initial lie. Unfortunately was already locked in at that point. The question is has there been any damage that is going to show up later by running at 230 deg.? Just got word from the local Ford dealer up here in eagle River Wisconsin they are two weeks out for service. They will check fluid level but can't drop the pan to see if something is kinked and is limiting flow. So the question am I driving home or leaving up here for 2 to 3 weeks... Wife's not going to be happy either way!

The transmission won't be damaged at 230deg. It's within the normal operating range for this 10 speed, even if it seems high when compared to older transmissions. Note that the there is a temperature at which an error code will be thrown and the vehicle will switch into an overtemp operating mode. But it's higher than 230. (Note that many of us who tow heavy trailers see 230 and 235 under certain conditions.) Now, if you're getting an elevated temperature for some other reason like too much fluid or too little fluid, then you might end up with an issue...

 

[Fozzy]

In theory your truck will go into limp mode due to engine temp at 250 or so. Well before the transmission fluid is in danger as they both use the radiator fluid for cooling. If you have FORscan it’s nice to have both engine and transmission temps displayed above the gauge. I tow my boat in desert heat at 225-235 all day long. The slipping is what you need to worry about. Dang dealership part changers.


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[John Ferrero]

Update.....dealer in Eagle River WI. (shout out, they seem to know what they are doing and got the truck up in a day or two when were booking two weeks out) noted the underside of vehicle was coated in fluids (presumably trans fluid). Turns out pan wasn't torqued properly and was leaking fluids all over the place. They torqued the pan and also tellingly noting the fluid seemed dark (odd since just had 5 qt new added when they had to replace the aux. trans pump) and added 3 qt. new fluid. They recommended dropping the pan and service but were already backed up 2 weeks. Vehicle seems to be running a little higher trans temp. than in past; running at 210 now more or less empty where previously only saw 205 running with a FULL load (roof rack/ski rack on back) on interstate in fairly comparable weather. Will push another local dealer (NEVER going back to Bull Valley Ford) to perform another trans service/fluid swap and bill Bull Valley Ford. Service Manager at Bull Valley will push back......

 

[John Ferrero]

Update.....dealer in Eagle River WI. (shout out, they seem to know what they are doing and got the truck up in a day or two when were booking two weeks out) noted the underside of vehicle was coated in fluids (presumably trans fluid). Turns out pan wasn't torqued properly and was leaking fluids all over the place. They torqued the pan and also tellingly noting the fluid seemed dark (odd since just had 5 qt new added when they had to replace the aux. trans pump...wonder if they just recycled?) and added 3 qt. new fluid. They recommended dropping the pan and service but were already backed up 2 weeks. Vehicle is running a little higher trans temp. than in past; running at 210 now more or less empty where previously only saw 205 running with a FULL load (roof rack/ski rack on back) on interstate travel in fairly comparable weather. Will push another local dealer (NEVER going back to Bull Valley Ford) to perform another trans service/fluid swap and bill Bull Valley Ford. Service Manager at Bull Valley will push back......

 

[lbv150]

The ideal temp range for automatic transmission fluid is 175-220. Cooler the better. At 240 the fluid starts to break down and form varnish, seals harden, clutches slip and the tranny is on it's way to being junk.

 

[Fozzy]

The ideal temp range for automatic transmission fluid is 175-220. Cooler the better. At 240 the fluid starts to break down and form varnish, seals harden, clutches slip and the tranny is on it's way to being junk.

Old school yes. Not for the 10R80. Normal operating range is 206-215. 240 just brings it into the warning zone. Truck actually heats the tranny fluid up when it’s cold.


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[John Ferrero]

Update....dealer replaced 13 qts tranny fluids, all seemed OK. Next trip, Kansas City....approx. 400miles. Trip down uneventful, Temp stayed 205-210 with not much load 1100lbs (Passengers/dogs/gear on carryall). Trip back, up till approximately 60 miles into trip the transmission was running fine/temp around 205. Out of nowhere it starts hunting/slipping (moving from 10 to 9 and back/feels like something going on with torque converter???. Was traveling 83mph and 57degrees out (only 900 lbs at this point), temp is moving up from 217 and progresses to 235 over next 15 minutes or so with more slipping/hunting between 10 and 8th gear. Backed speed down to 78 and temp starts to drop slowly from 235 back down all the way to 205 over the next 50 miles or so. From that time on ran between 205 and 215 with a speed range of 75-86 mph. I suspect something is causing cooling issue flow and eventually clears......thoughts?

 

[99WhiteC5Coupe]

Update....dealer replaced 13 qts tranny fluids, all seemed OK. Next trip, Kansas City....approx. 400miles. Trip down uneventful, Temp stayed 205-210 with not much load 1100lbs (Passengers/dogs/gear on carryall). Trip back, up till approximately 60 miles into trip the transmission was running fine/temp around 205. Out of nowhere it starts hunting/slipping (moving from 10 to 9 and back/feels like something going on with torque converter???. Was traveling 83mph and 57degrees out (only 900 lbs at this point), temp is moving up from 217 and progresses to 235 over next 15 minutes or so with more slipping/hunting between 10 and 8th gear. Backed speed down to 78 and temp starts to drop slowly from 235 back down all the way to 205 over the next 50 miles or so. From that time on ran between 205 and 215 with a speed range of 75-86 mph. I suspect something is causing cooling issue flow and eventually clears......thoughts?

Still under warranty? Back to a dealer for diagnosis and repair? Perhaps there will be codes stored to assist with diagnosis?

 

[Calidad]

Friend had a Explorer do this for yrs many dealer visits finally old crusty tech says anyone check the cooler? Yep bad cooler from factory was plugged so no fluid flow through it. 120,000 and the explorer finally had proper transmission cooling he just sold it at 260,000 still going strong lol

 

[John Ferrero]

Yes, will be back to dealer....

 

[Blulak77]

Did you ever get your issue resolved. I’m having very same or similar issue with my 2018 expedition. I’ve been two two different dealers and they can’t figure it out. I’ve had transmission rebuilt once in the process and most recently a brand new trans and replaced trans oil cooler and still having overheating issue and losing trans fluid. I’m wondering if it’s coming out the vent due to something overheating the transmission or it’s leaking transmission fluid from a line or something and the loss of fluid is what starts the overheating. I have to drive for 30-40 mins before temps climb.

 

[DJAucutt]

John, I believe I read that your auto start/stop was acting up. Has the work done so far cleared that issue? My 2018 Max Limited has about 53K. Dealer just replaced both front wheel bearings under power train warranty. I rarely tow, so temp has not been an issue. Start/stop works very seldom. Shudders when it does work. Tranny sometimes hesitates between 3-4. Have you experienced hesitation in lower gears?

 

[lbv150]

Update....dealer replaced 13 qts tranny fluids, all seemed OK. Next trip, Kansas City....approx. 400miles. Trip down uneventful, Temp stayed 205-210 with not much load 1100lbs (Passengers/dogs/gear on carryall). Trip back, up till approximately 60 miles into trip the transmission was running fine/temp around 205. Out of nowhere it starts hunting/slipping (moving from 10 to 9 and back/feels like something going on with torque converter???. Was traveling 83mph and 57degrees out (only 900 lbs at this point), temp is moving up from 217 and progresses to 235 over next 15 minutes or so with more slipping/hunting between 10 and 8th gear. Backed speed down to 78 and temp starts to drop slowly from 235 back down all the way to 205 over the next 50 miles or so. From that time on ran between 205 and 215 with a speed range of 75-86 mph. I suspect something is causing cooling issue flow and eventually clears......thoughts?

Sounds to me that you are pushing it too hard ? These are trucks and not designed for sustained high speed. I think you answered the question as you backed off and the temps dropped.

 

[John Ferrero]

Sounds to me that you are pushing it too hard ? These are trucks and not designed for sustained high speed. I think you answered the question as you backed off and the temps dropped.

for sure dropping speed helped bring temp down but I don' t believe that to be true that the truck can't deal with prolonged 85mph lightly loaded. Prior to the temp rise it was running at 207-210 the whole time. Also, haven't had an issue since and I run it constantly at 85mph on interstate when clear to do so. When discussing it with a Ford tech from another dealer he didn't believe the vehicle was being pushed at all. He did say if towing or having high load maybe but not with what I was running. He guessed some sort of fluid flow issue that resolved itself.

 

[Expedition Dave]

Sounds to me that you are pushing it too hard ? These are trucks and not designed for sustained high speed. I think you answered the question as you backed off and the temps dropped.

These trucks are designed to run 100mph all day long in 100+ degree heat, loaded, up and down and all around (Obviously, not towing).
Depending on heat, drag, boost and RPMs, your trans-temp will see a bump of a few degrees. The result of the "jump-up" may be a radiator flap issue which seals up and opens under certain conditions to increase engine warming and fuel mileage with better aeros.

Some folks in warmer climates gut the entire system and have found a work around for the warning light--or just remove the flaps and not the actuators.

Good luck.

 

[Fozzy]

for sure dropping speed helped bring temp down but I don' t believe that to be true that the truck can't deal with prolonged 85mph lightly loaded. Prior to the temp rise it was running at 207-210 the whole time. Also, haven't had an issue since and I run it constantly at 85mph on interstate when clear to do so. When discussing it with a Ford tech from another dealer he didn't believe the vehicle was being pushed at all. He did say if towing or having high load maybe but not with what I was running. He guessed some sort of fluid flow issue that resolved itself.

I pull my boat, that’s almost 7K loaded out at 80 mph in Nevada heat (100+)for the last two years and have never had it get into the yellow. So close but never to limp mode. Something is not right with yours. Only thing I had overheating was my tires and wheel bearings.