Trainmaster
Old School Member
Climate Control Improvements
- Thread starter Trainmaster
- Start date
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I'd really miss the cooled seats.
DieselMonk
Full Access Members
Your SPP doesn’t have cooled seats? Really? Mine does!
Of course it does! But if it had only the 3 controls that were in Trainmaster's post it wouldn't.
TonyR0206
Well-Known Member
I have the 15.5" screen in mine in which you can only control the temperature through the touch screen. It's not ideal, by any means. My biggest gripe is that there is no easy way to control the temp for the whole cabin. You have to physically go in and set the front / rear separately. You'd think that in 2025, as in other vehicles, that Ford would think that their customers would like to not have to take multiple steps and take their eyes off the road repeatedly to set the temperature for the rear of the cabin; or to have a setting that synchronizes the front temps with the rear. Ok...I'm done complaining. Everyone have a Happy New Year!!
Andy B
Full Access Members
Disagree. I love automatic heat controls where you set the desired temperature and not just how far open the heat flapper door is. It keeps me comfy as the engine warms up and as the outside temperature changes.
Andy B
Full Access Members
Oh man, I loved those vent windows.
And Chevy's "Astro ventilation" which was just outside air from the cowl ( slightly high pressure) with no heat, no cooling, controlled by a flapper door.
Andy B
Full Access Members
23 SPP here, I have cooled seats too.
GixxerJasen
Full Access Members
That sounds miserable to those of us in Texas.
DieselMonk
Full Access Members
DieselMonk
Full Access Members
I just leave the rear on 22C and just adjust the front to 23C in the winter. If someone wants it warmer in the back they can adjust it themselves on the separate control in the middle center, or wait until I change it.
Andy B
Full Access Members
It was a separate system additional to the normal heating and AC. And don't you have NIGHTS in Texas?
GixxerJasen
Full Access Members
Oh nights! Yes, we have those, it gets down to a chilly 85F at night here in the summer.
That is chilly.....any snow ???
GixxerJasen
Full Access Members
What is that?
Trainmaster
Old School Member
Got in the 23 today, pressed the AUTO button and the AC light lit. It was six degrees out and dry. Nothing would make it go out. So I turned the truck off, opened and closed the door, restarted it and now it heats.
Anyone know how this thing is supposed to work? I've read the Owner's Manual and the 210 pages in the shop manual referencing the automatic climate control.
I just want to know how this thinks and how to fool it into giving me heat when it's six degrees outside.
Anyone know how this thing is supposed to work? I've read the Owner's Manual and the 210 pages in the shop manual referencing the automatic climate control.
I just want to know how this thinks and how to fool it into giving me heat when it's six degrees outside.
ROBERT BONNER
Full Access Members
Carefully observe the outdoor temperature reading (as opposed to what temperature you know to be true). I think you were experiencing the opposite problem, for the same reason, that I and others I know have experienced. Defeating it in your case, might involve shutting the HVAC system off until the outside temperature reads correctly. I've explained the problem that these post '22's all experience below:
There is way too much software in these systems. Sometime between '20 and '22 MY, the Ford Truck/Full Size SUV Climate control guys had way too much time on their hands and started writing software that they didn't need. I have a '20 Expedition and a '22 F150 and the behavior and performance of the two systems is significantly different, despite having the exact same buttons, and owners manual definitions. One of the biggest differences is this:
The behavior of the outside thermometer. On the '20 the thermometer adjusts to changes in temperature very rapidly. Start out in a cool garage on a hot day and the thermometer reads the change in temperature within 30 seconds of exiting the garage. The '22 DOES NOT. It has some sort of idiot memory and buffering software that "remembers" the last temperature recorded during the last drive and starts there on initial start-up, it is buffered such that it waits until the vehicle reaches a certain speed (~35mph?) before it will budge off of the "last recorded temperature", then it changes slowly, like 1 degree F every 5-10 seconds.
Between me and my hunting buddies we have (2) pre 22's and (3) post 22's, that are routinely exposed to the same temperature conditions during hunting season. Consistently when our trucks are parked in the evening at say 35 deg F in the fall in northern MI, then restarted in the afternoon the next day at 65 deg F and sunny, the outdoor thermometer will start at 35 F on the +22's and stay at that temperature until the end of the trail where speeds are below 20mph for several miles, only after we're on a main road does the temperature start to climb slowly, eventually equalizing at the actual temp. On our typical routes this can take up to 15 minutes! The -22's immediately display the actual outdoor temperature and heat/cool as anyone would expect when auto is selected. If the +22's are set to any auto interior temp, while the outside temperature reading is radically off (30 deg + differential), they will blow heat and will cook you out, completely ignoring the interior set temp. The only way to prevent it is to either turn off the system or select max a/c and modulate the fan manually until the outdoor temp reads correctly. What a mess, they all do it, there are NO faults shown in the systems, this is considered "normal" behavior. What a huge disappointment. My brother's $104K '25 Platinum F350 does it. I'm sure the expensive Navi's do it too.
There are so many things wrong here. With a proper interior feedback loop, the system doesn't even have to know the outside temperature, sure, knowing it could help the system respond quicker, I get it; but, if you tell the system to lie to itself about the temperature under certain circumstances, you're defeating the whole purpose. If I still worked at Ford I would have had a field day with this with the Product Development guys, I would have had them crying like babies and begging me to stop in front of their many VP's. Ah, the good ole days.
Trainmaster
Old School Member
Thank you for the detailed and intelligent answer. I never would have figured out this one.
Two words: "Absurd," and "Why"?
There must have been a reason.
Two words: "Absurd," and "Why"?
There must have been a reason.
Last edited:
ROBERT BONNER
Full Access Members
There are always reasons, just not good ones. My speculation, knowing Ford's internal blind spots and management drivers, I believe this is probably how it happened:
1. The internal drive for ever increasing fuel economy is obsessive to the point of being self-loathing and self-destructive. At some point someone looked at the climate control guys and told them that they owed the team a tenth of an mpg. The HVAC guys decided that if the climate control could take into account the outside temperature they could reduce the amount of A/C compressor time to cool/defrost under some conditions, especially moderate or declining temperature conditions. So, they came up with an algorithm that successfully reduces compressor time under moderate ambient temperatures.
2. Then during early development the vehicle exhibited a false outdoor temperature reading due to hot soak in a parking lot, or an icy condition that coated the probe under the outside mirror with ice. Since this temperature reading is now driving HVAC performance, not just information to the customer; this led someone to suggest "dampening" the outside temperature readings to avoid such start-up anomalies.
3. Development time ran out, or someone got promoted, fired, demoted, retired, mid development and no follow-up beyond typical spring ride and drives by the team in and around SE Michigan when temperatures are the most moderate and slow changing. No one experienced the temperature swings that cause the problems that real customers like you and me experience in relatively rare (but real and important) conditions.
This happens because early development for anything drives systems to experience operational extremes (the tails of the bell shaped curve, whether that is temperature extremes or durability over rough surfaces, or salt bath corrosion, etc.); however, as production gets closer, development focuses on refinement of attributes and performance that are experienced by the wide center of the bell shaped normal curve, instead of the tails.
That's my theory.
Note that there are Plant Vehicle Team folks reading these forums, so there is still hope that someone might address this with a future software update (Please!!) If it were me, I would vote to eliminate the outside temperature dampening entirely. I'll take the occasional and short anomalistic HVAC behavior until the temperature probe registers the correct temperature instead of having to stare at a temperature reading of 35 deg F while I have the windows rolled down in the 70 degree sunshine for 15 minutes.
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