FORDS ALUMINUM BODY SECRET:

[aquariumdoctor]

Our 2015 Ford Expedition in California with 20,000 miles has Aluminum Corrosion on the front hood and rear hatch door. Ford has known about this problem since the year 2000 and has done nothing about it, documented in Technical Service Bulletin TSB 16-0028. Dealerships are aware, but do not disclose the factory defect prior to sale, which is Fraud.

 

[ExplorerTom]

Actually- see the 16 in the TSB number? That's the year the TSB was issued.

So they didn't necessarily know about it in 2000- it just applies to vehicles dating back that far. And since you have a 2015, you vehicle was produced (and most likely originally purchased) prior to the TSB coming out.

So IF you experience the aluminum corrosion, take it back to the dealer.

But don't lawyer up just yet.

 

[aquariumdoctor]

Spoke to dealership and its been going on for years, with tons of post with same problem on Expeditions, Explorers and Mustangs. Class action suit already started on east coast and is due to iron contamination at the factory. It will be at the dealer tomorrow for the roof to be re welded and galvanic corrosion on hood and rear door. Ford says its not covered under corrosion warranty and after 3 years 36,000 miles its not covered.

 

[99WhiteC5Coupe]

Our 2015 Ford Expedition in California with 20,000 miles has Aluminum Corrosion on the front hood and rear hatch door. Ford has known about this problem since the year 2000 and has done nothing about it, documented in Technical Service Bulletin TSB 16-0028. Dealerships are aware, but do not disclose the factory defect prior to sale, which is Fraud.

View attachment 19415

More information: http://www.expeditionforum.com/thre...gister-a-complaint-read-fords-response.16012/

 

[jeff kushner]

I've owned 3 Expeditions all together and still own the '05 & '17 and even my '99 had "cancer" on the hood in the center. The '05 has a very slight amount on the rear liftgate but not sure if there is any on the hood since I haven't really looked at it in the past couple of months other than to start it up every couple of weeks.

I'm as surprised as anyone that Ford hasn't addressed this yet. I have been restoring vintage bikes for many years and have learned a couple things about painting and it sure seems to me that Ford isn't properly etching the base metal because it looks like the paint isn't able to properly bond. I'm also sure that some of you guys know a lot more about this situation than I do but I certainly agree with the OP in that Ford has had many years to rectify this but it seems that their only response is to avoid & elude responsibility!

jeff

 

[ExpeditionAndy]

The liftgate on my 05 was horrible in terms of bubbling paint and that aluminum oxide corrosion. There were a couple of spots on the hood as well. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that by now the 2017s aren't going to have any problems or I will become the customer from hell.

 

[aquariumdoctor]

Andy, Unfortunately its going to happen to the 2017 within two years. Keep an eye under the hood its going to look like this, before it transitions to the paint surface on the hood.

 

[ExpeditionAndy]

Thanks, I will be keeping an eye on it. My 05 was loaded with it on the liftgate and had a little under the hood and just a couple of spots on the front edge. I bought the 8 year 100,000 mile that also increases corrosion and rust through warranty so we'll see what kind of games we'll have to play down the road.

 

[brick]

My old 2003 EB with 200,000+ miles has no corrosion. My new 2016 is - new- but I will watch for it...
brick

 

[powerboatr]

its all about keeping the steel pieces from direct contact with the alum parts. easy as pie.
contamination on the assembly line seems easy as well when a body panel prep worker used a tool that was smoothing steel and then somehow used same tool on a bare alum panel.

on past experience this is an easy thing to happen, when HUMANS fail to follow assembly protocols that address the dissimilar metal issue.

and before yall cut my head off. I was a corrosion expert for the navy and army for 21 years.
I still hold a FAA Airframe and Powerplant certificate. Preventing contact of dissimilar metals is very important item.
i have seen vehicle corrosion in the field directly caused by improper separation methods, with sealant or coatings

i have also seen HORRIBLE paint and seal jobs leaving all three major US based auto assembly lines that would cause dissimilar metal caused corrosion.

i think its more in the training of assembly folks.
and yes as an engineer i know we sometimes design and build things that simply baffle those that are expected to maintain or assemble

for me, each wash or inspection, i naturally look for metal to metal contact and ensure seals or cushions are in place.
those hoods and gates look exactly like the prep for prime and paint was not done correct, and most likely the surface tarnish was not removed prior to protective coatings applied

 

[jeff kushner]

CATHODIC PROTECTION!

Powerboaters post jogged my memory!

I wonder is a simple cathodic protection system could be installed with a sacrificial anode of Zinc plate to preserve the paint?

We use them on our boats where I live and at work in the Mechanical construction industry. A simple apparatus of a single 16ga wire interconnecting the body sections and a single 4x4" piece of zinc plate would effectively "sacrifice" the zinc. Most of you have them in your houses too and don't even know it. Water heaters use galvanic protection(same thing) to protect the tank!

Basically, to those that don't understand this....whenever two or more dissimilar metals are in contact, and electrical charge is produced.....not a huge sparking charge but a very small but consistent charge and it causes one of more of the metals to become the "sacrificial anode". If we use a substance that corrodes at a lower threshold then the metal we want to protect, it will protect the surface of the metal it is protecting by corroding first.

I'm thinking a single strand wire originating on the passenger rear quarter panel, tapping off to pick up the lift gate, right rear panel then each door, front fenders & hood all connected to a single sheet of zinc SHOULD allow the zinc to corrode long before any of the panel surfaces do! Or you could use multiple zincs to save the sheet-metal panels.

20 minutes of research showed me that FORDS position is to deny ANY claims for paint....and they are winning every case because there is no "rust thru". Go ahead for those that can't take my word, go do your own research and tell me how many cars Ford is warrantee-ing for paint.....ZERO! So this might be a good path forward or at least the beginning of a good path forward.

We've got a lot of talent in here and this should be a cinch to solve.....

Come on, we've got to have an electrical guy or two in here that can verify what I'm suggesting....

Here's a couple of sites:

https://www.newscientist.com/blog/lastword/2007/08/save-our-cars.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galvanic_anode

 

[ExpeditionAndy]

I know they do that for big Navy ships to prevent corrosion, but you have to have a power source for the system. The one poster on the second link talked about distributing systems that sent an electrical pulse through the bodies of cars to prevent them from rusting. I guess that only works once you park the car.

 

[Frank Wilson]

Since aluminum is a great sacrificial anode, I can't see how our hoods and liftgate could ever be isolated from the steel.

 

[powerboatr]

Ford and others using different metals are using a "sort of" method now.
all metal panels are supposed to be grounded/bonded to each other with alum or copper straps.
but the rub comes in at the point of contact for the grounds, once they make the metal to metal contact, they have to seal the connection from moisture. so any ground lug that is disturbed, needs to be re-sealed back to factory specs. Which in the field, we all know is not the norm.

but the principle is to have all panels in sync electrically. and use a sacrificial metal to corrode away vice the alum or other noble metal. enter zinc.
which by the way is why steel panels are galvanized with zinc.

just like we use on sea water sailing boats, ships etc. even airplanes

the base panel has to be treated before primer and paint. this could be one weak point, but i would hope ford has this worked out, due to the huge expense involved in the first point.

one would think on the edges of the alum panels that are sharp..they need to build up the sealants or paint to help prevent chips or loss of contact that allows moisture to enter and then grow little corrosion bugs.

burnishing the sharp edges would be great step forward to better adhere sealant paint and primers, but at an expense of added labor, which would add higher price per unit and affect sales, which after all is the main goal of the company.
andy and i have new vehicles, i say we really watch and document on our trucks to see what or if any breaks in the bonding straps or chips at sharp edges.

 

[ExpeditionAndy]

powerboatr,

I have already bought touch-up paint so I'm ready to touch up any paint chips.

 

[powerboatr]

i was looking at my hood undersides earlier, a few sharp edges most assuredly could lead to problems, surprised at the number of hard edges, compared to the lifgate
will do a bit of preventive this weekend myself

I am lucking as in when it snows here...traffic stops
no salts, and i rinse the bottom every washing real good.

 

[GaryH2]

I've had the corrosion pretty bad around the back window on the tailgate and under the front lip of the hood as shown in the other posts. I've had the rear hatch stripped and repainted. The hood was on the underside so I hit that with a wire wheel to get the loose paint off and then used the POR-15 prep and paint. It should be ok for a bit (prep, then i coat of POR 15 silver and 2 coats of black). So far so good on all accounts. We'll see how it holds up.

It seems this issue is pretty common nowadays. I've seen this issue on Explorers and my 06 Mustang had the same thing going on. Around these parts you can see some GM vans with next to no paint on their hoods. I haven't seen any Expys quite that bad.

 

[powerboatr]

gary
glad you caught it and treated it.

never ever ever use a steel wire wheel on alum. repeat
you can use a STAINLESS steel wire brush, and then that brush can only be used on alum thereafter.
the high carbon steel brushes leave little steel particles embedded in the alum and will cause dissimilar metal corrosion
i would add using a surface etchent like alodine will treat the bare surface and aid in primer adhesion. there are others that are less reactive , but alodine is the cats meow. but needs respect in handling
3m bristle discs work really well and are plastic
we can beat the corrosion bugs...

 

[aquariumdoctor]

Three Aluminum Panel Corrosion Technical Service Bulletins, year 2004 TSB 04-25-1, 2006 TSB 06-25-15 and 2016 TSB 16-0028

 

[powerboatr]

items called out in the tsb are first rate coatings
good to see them used