Michigan residents - registration renewal cost

[TobyU]

So, even in your meandering example, the taxes collected are nowhere near original purchase price?

And I'm not sure what fairness have to do with it? By what definition would it be fair?

I did say it was unlikely, only if a car sold a lot when new for high amounts.
My main complaint against sales tax on EVERY sale is that I feel it is unfair for two exact same original value cars to generate such vastly different amount of tax revenue.
These numbers are often VERY different.


You could say it is a fair as it all comes out in the wash or equalizes...but some are subsidizing the tax base more than others...vehicles that is.

I don't think there should be any tax on any USED possessions -even vehicles- OF course the ONLY reason this doesn't exist is the power car manufacturers have in govt.
IF only new cars were taxed (which I claim is fair because each car gives its exact "correctly determined" amount), there would be a huge disincentive to buy new cars.
The market for slightly used, almost new care would skyrocket!

If I buy a 2000 sectional for my living room and sell it in 10 years for 200, I should not be taxed on it. I decide in 2 months I don't like it and sell it for 1400...I should not be taxed on it.
Now there is sales tax ans income tax.
I don't think either should be on these examples. States vary in laws.

Another big issue...sometimes good; sometimes bad: states! While I support states' rights, I think a country should have a law of the land.
I like consistency a lot too!!
Thing you do all the time in one state could make you a criminal (at least a law breaker) across a state line.
No one could ever agree though.
I want the most lenient, least invasive, tax and fee happy state's rules imposed everywhere, but I don't see that happening and it long term would more than likely be detrimental to economy and possible other things. (as if we haven;t had enough things detrimental to economy and life etc in the past 60 or so years)

 

[Brent Harward]

The base registration fee in Texas is $50.75 + county fee = $78.50, new or used. Same price every year on our Expy. About $55 for passenger cars. $22 for inspection prior to issuing plates. (sticker)

 

[TobyU]

The base registration fee in Texas is $50.75 + county fee = $78.50, new or used. Same price every year on our Expy. About $55 for passenger cars. $22 for inspection prior to issuing plates. (sticker)

So they charge you for the inspection before you can get your plate. That's bull! I will never support any state wanting to have inspections on vehicles. We had to deal with emissions testing which they called E-Check in Ohio for 10 years but then they got rid of that. That was bad enough but an overall inspection for safety would be atrocious. We don't believe in that. We let it take care of itself. Darwinism. The cars that are a piece of crap eventually break down and if they don't get them off the side of the road quickly enough they get towed in and they're not worth paying the money to get out of impound. It all takes care of itself. Inspections are just a racket marketed in the name and the guise of safety just to extort more money out of the citizens. But unfortunately, the only option is to move.

 

[Plati]

So they charge you for the inspection before you can get your plate. That's bull! I will never support any state wanting to have inspections on vehicles. We had to deal with emissions testing which they called E-Check in Ohio for 10 years but then they got rid of that. That was bad enough but an overall inspection for safety would be atrocious. We don't believe in that. We let it take care of itself. Darwinism. The cars that are a piece of crap eventually break down and if they don't get them off the side of the road quickly enough they get towed in and they're not worth paying the money to get out of impound. It all takes care of itself. Inspections are just a racket marketed in the name and the guise of safety just to extort more money out of the citizens. But unfortunately, the only option is to move.

Yeah.. Darwinism where the Darwin candidate with bald tires hydroplanes into a family of 5 who were on their way to church. As if Church has anything to do with it. Etc. Smaaaaart thinkin. It ought to be legal to yell FIRE in a crowded theatre too, Free speech ya know.

 

[TobyU]

Yeah.. Darwinism where the Darwin candidate with bald tires hydroplanes into a family of 5 who were on their way to church. As if Church has anything to do with it. Etc. Smaaaaart thinkin. It ought to be legal to yell FIRE in a crowded theatre too, Free speech ya know.

Nope! I don't support legislating safety.
That's always the first thing someone comes up with when I say things like that. They say what if somebody in some old trap that barely has any brake slams into you? Well, that might happen. If so. I'll deal with it. People have to die everyday. Tomorrow it may be my wife or my child or myself. I will still deal with that. I don't want to be part of a society that forces everyone to do things to keep everyone else safe. I don't support laws that make kids wear bicycle helmets when they ride on the sidewalk in Suburban areas. I don't support the law saying you have to wear your seatbelt in a car.
I'm all for safety and for people doing what they feel they need to be doing for their safety but I don't feel if the government's place. At least what little dab the government should do, they always go way, way far beyond what I feel should happen.
I know I'm an odd duck. My mom told me I was anti-establishment when I was about eight years old. She was obviously right.
A lot of it is just the necessary evils that come about when you populate an area. This is why I apparently existed in the wrong time. I should have been back in one of the either ancient or way early civilizations or settlements where they were only a few handful of people in the area and everyone knew everyone else's name and we hadn't got to the point of legislating safety yet. Or deeming everything a privilege and charging a fee for it.

 

[Artie]

Nope! I don't support legislating safety.
That's always the first thing someone comes up with when I say things like that. They say what if somebody in some old trap that barely has any brake slams into you? Well, that might happen. If so. I'll deal with it. People have to die everyday. Tomorrow it may be my wife or my child or myself. I will still deal with that. I don't want to be part of a society that forces everyone to do things to keep everyone else safe. I don't support laws that make kids wear bicycle helmets when they ride on the sidewalk in Suburban areas. I don't support the law saying you have to wear your seatbelt in a car.
I'm all for safety and for people doing what they feel they need to be doing for their safety but I don't feel if the government's place. At least what little dab the government should do, they always go way, way far beyond what I feel should happen.
I know I'm an odd duck. My mom told me I was anti-establishment when I was about eight years old. She was obviously right.
A lot of it is just the necessary evils that come about when you populate an area. This is why I apparently existed in the wrong time. I should have been back in one of the either ancient or way early civilizations or settlements where they were only a few handful of people in the area and everyone knew everyone else's name and we hadn't got to the point of legislating safety yet. Or deeming everything a privilege and charging a fee for it.

Those who want to sacrifice some liberty in exchange for safety deserve neither...

 

[TobyU]

Those who want to sacrifice some liberty in exchange for safety deserve neither...

I have always loved that statement and I'm willing to live by it.
When people start legislating safety so they can keep the so-called bad people from making it unsafe for them, it is only a small step until they're legislating Aesthetics and Zoning codes like they are now. They have gotten together and decided what they want to see when they look out the window when they drive around the neighborhood.
It's the inevitable result of increase of population. It's just basically mob rule mentality.

 

[Plati]

Every discussion on this Forum should just start out Political and stay that way.
Its crazy talk to focus on Expeditions, maintenance, vehicle issues, etc.
The purpose of this Forum is Political opinions, not Ford Expeditions!!

 

[Artie]

Every discussion on this Forum should just start out Political and stay that way.
Its crazy talk to focus on Expeditions, maintenance, vehicle issues, etc.
The purpose of this Forum is Political opinions, not Ford Expeditions!!

This thread is about taxes so it did start out political.

Someone on here once said that after page 3 of any thread it completely goes off topic, often times wildly. Even though this does happen I still believe that the majority of the topics stay auto related. If they veer into obscurity you can always move to the next thread, I know I do from time to time. Thankfully this is a very active forum and there is no shortage of new threads.

 

[NukeLife]

Have lived in NY and NJ. Currently in the Charlotte area on the SC side.
Yes my “property tax” on my vehicle does seem ridiculous to some (my NY wife, for one). For the Expy it will be around $1300 this year.

Then I remind my wife that the home we currently live in would have cost basically a second monthly mortgage payment just in taxes in NY or NJ — and the price of the home, itself, would be 2-3 times what it cost here.

Big picture.

 

[TobyU]

Every discussion on this Forum should just start out Political and stay that way.
Its crazy talk to focus on Expeditions, maintenance, vehicle issues, etc.
The purpose of this Forum is Political opinions, not Ford Expeditions!!

I do not like the all-too encompassing definition of politics or political though.
It seems the definition has morphed over the years as a lot of definitions have in the past 10 or 15 years to reflect what Society feels today as opposed to how it used to be.
I think that's kind of wrong because a definition is always the same definition.
But currently people include everything in politics. Everything about your daily life or anything that affects or controls it. Well most anything. I think of Politics as much more specific as in elections and politicians mostly on a state and federal level.
I don't consider it discussing politics if we're talking about a neighborhood having an HOA or properties having CC&Rs but it seems the majority of people today do consider that political or politics.
I think of it more as just parts of everyday life and these certain parts really stink and they shouldn't exist but that's just my opinion. I feel that pretty soon simply discussing the difference of people's opinions will be considered politics.
Now, the broadest definition seems to be all aspects of governing a society including keeping things flowing and operating normally for the good of everyone.
This definition has little to do with elections or political parties which is more the specific definition I think of when I say politics or political. The parties and their individual ideas, tens, traits and tendencies that each side or group stands for.
The fact that we live in a society that has rules and we have incarceration as a punishment and people's opinion on that and for what offenses would be considered politics and I don't agree with that.
That's just discussing aspects of life. Not nearly pinpointing in on a much smaller subset of life which I think of as politics.
I've gotten into arguments with people who love to nitpick and somehow get a sense of superiority or satisfaction in catching anyone in that gotcha moment or throwing up something you said before weather related or not to somehow show you are wrong.

The problem I see is it some definitions have been changed over time. You can find a good number of examples of this.

I have decided that it's my self-appointed job to point out any and all things wrong with the world, as I see it.
Everyone else is free to do the same.
The problem is, far too many people think they are better at viewing or observing or deciding what these things are.
Then they want to somehow argue that they are right and you are wrong.
They somehow missed the last part of my mission statement-
As I see it.
Different people in different areas, and situations can see aspects of life and feel their effects completely differently or not at all.

 

[scottdm]

Legislating safety in vehicles as been around for decades, so it's not really a new concept. At the federal level, vehicle manufacturers have to comply with NHTSA regulations, etc. I live in PA that has both mechanical inspections for all counties and some counties have emissions inspections as well. When I see a car with rust holes in the body panels and looking like it came from a demo derby, it usually has an Ohio license plate, so draw your own conclustions about what effects state inspection programs have.

Overall, mechanical inspections are a good idea in my opinion (ball joints, brakes, tires, lights, etc). Especially with large commercial vehicles, I'm not interested in a recap delaminating and coming through my windshield on the highway, etc. Having good brakes on a tanker truck isn't a bad idea either. I'm more on the fence about emissions inspections. Most gasoline vehicles with modern emissions equipment shouldn't require it. The hillbilly diesel pickups that like to roll coal should be able to do so at a truck/tractor pull, but I wouldn't shed a tear if they get pulled over on the road for that behavior.

To each his own....

 

[TobyU]

Legislating safety in vehicles as been around for decades, so it's not really a new concept. At the federal level, vehicle manufacturers have to comply with NHTSA regulations, etc. I live in PA that has both mechanical inspections for all counties and some counties have emissions inspections as well. When I see a car with rust holes in the body panels and looking like it came from a demo derby, it usually has an Ohio license plate, so draw your own conclustions about what effects state inspection programs have.

Overall, mechanical inspections are a good idea in my opinion (ball joints, brakes, tires, lights, etc). Especially with large commercial vehicles, I'm not interested in a recap delaminating and coming through my windshield on the highway, etc. Having good brakes on a tanker truck isn't a bad idea either. I'm more on the fence about emissions inspections. Most gasoline vehicles with modern emissions equipment shouldn't require it. The hillbilly diesel pickups that like to roll coal should be able to do so at a truck/tractor pull, but I wouldn't shed a tear if they get pulled over on the road for that behavior.

To each his own....

But it's not to each his own!! That's exactly the problem I have with it. You say you're on the fence about emissions but so many people aren't and they're already on the other side of the fence. You will probably be on the other side of the fence in 20 years also. Things like this start out as you mentioned decades ago and they slowly creep up and become more and more Regulatory and invasive and pretty soon people accept them and even support them.
Just because something's been going on for 60 or 70 years doesn't mean I supported it then or I will support it now.
We hear talk all the time on this form specifically because Fords have rockers that rust out easily. And states with inspections, most of them require you to get that fixed! There is absolutely zero structural or safety reason to have a rusted-out rocker panel replaced.
Sometimes you have to knock r roll over some of the sharp edges because you could catch a shoelace on one but that's about it.

All the inspection are is another way too... Wait for it... Here it comes, my trademarked saying...
Spin the Money Wheel!
Some can see this as a positive. But it certainly makes money change hands to fix something on a car that would probably never be fixed in over 10 to 15% of the instances in another state.
I am almost always against needless work or need this money being spent, busy work, or wasting human effort or energy.
We have people that get all up in arms about wasting or damaging the Earth. Well, I lose my shit when some company like Walmart makes their employees completely tear down and reinstall 40 ft of shelving so they can put one item in the middle somewhere. This is a waste of human effort. But because people don't see effort as as anything finite. You can always do more there's always more labor to be had. They see it is okay. I do not.
But as others have pointed out, if you don't spim the money will wheel here you will spin it in some other area. There is no perfect state to live in there are just some that are better than others and some that are vastly worse than most of the rest of them.
It's a give-and-take.
The funny part and kind of the bad part is that we are quite unaware of the major differences in simple things that are taken for granted or taken as SOP in different states.
Somebody coming from a state that cost 300 to $1,000 a year to register a car in a state that only cost them 50 would be like woohoo I'm rich. But at the end of the year they probably would have the same amount of disposable income that they had in their previous state. What the government giveth in one place, the government taketh away in another.
This is exactly what I'm talking about just being part of life that I don't consider politics.

 

[3rd Expyowner123]

My Texas registration is just under $80.00. Texas does not base fee on value of vehicle or age. State Inspection is $7.50 in our county which does not require an emission system check. Emission system checks are dependent on county.

 

[Tocapet]

Wait til you move to Colorado. When you bring in a car from out of state and register it in Colorado, they hit you with the "use tax" Basically, it's like paying the sales tax you paid in Texas when you bought your truck. Now you pay it again! It's based on the value of your truck. Then the yearly tags cost you a bit more than Texas.

 

[1970Maverick]

In Florida my 2019 registration for my '17 XLT was a little under $50/yr and in FL we don't pay any other taxes/fees every year like some states.

 

[Tocapet]

holly cow!

That's why everyone drives old beaters in Colorado

 

[joethefordguy]

why do we need government permission to drive our car?