Pulled my oil pan -- found a surprise ! *** PICS ****

[MakDad]

So after about 5 hrs of dinking around with the front axle, finally yanked the oil pan off the XLT 4WD.

This is what I found. Another case of busted chain tensioners ? Also, check out the crud blocking off the pickup tube.




The question is , where are the other pieces ? I'm pretty sure there's more hiding somewhere.?!

 

[Whack]

Holy Crap...

Is that fluff or ground plastic on the pick up? Can't tell from the pictures...

Could have blown a filter some time ago and got some filter media in the oil... Or it could be from the chain guides. The sludge looks ok...

That second piece looks like something critical... My first guess is a chain guide:

http://www.justanswer.com/uploads/lostrider/2008-08-24_190709_9.gif

Normally they are plastic and have that ribbed design.

Looks like you may want to pull the front chain cover.

Good luck.

 

[Experez]

How many miles do you have ?? Man that looks bad!?

 

[MakDad]

How many miles do you have ?? Man that looks bad!?

155,000 on the engine. Had the car since it only had 14,000 on it. Never game me ANY trouble. Only oil changes, brakes, and tires.

Is that fluff or ground plastic on the pick up? Can't tell from the pictures...

Feels like small plastic matter, but I'm not 100% sure. It's so finely ground up it's hard to tell. All I know is that it would definitely block the pickup tube. That was my problem in the first place. Pressure would drop to zero.

I'm thinking the bits and pieces of the chain guides would also block the oil supply.

At this point, just gathering info on how to pull the timing chain cover off. Debating to pull the whole engine or do it in-frame..

 

[toms89]

Photo from my build.



Has to be chain tensioner or guide. No other plastic that size that could find its way to the oilpan. If you pull timing cover and replace them I would also consider replacing the oil pump. The parts that the screen did not catch may possibly have damaged to the oil pump before getting trapped in the oil filter.

The timing cover can be removed fairly easy while motor is in vehicle if you have already dropped the oil pan. Otherwise it is sandwiched between the oil pan and valve covers. Valve cover gaskets can be a PITA where they mate with the timing cover during reinstallation.

 

[toms89]

2v or 3v motor? Was assuming 2v.

 

[MakDad]

2v or 3v motor? Was assuming 2v.

I do not know. Just the basic 4.6L in the 2003 XLT. I believe 2v.

So you are saying the valve covers can stay on as long as the oil pan is off to get the timing cover off ?

Seems like just a whole bunch of unbolting from the front, doesn't look all that bad except maybe a bit time-consuming.

 

[toms89]

I do not know. Just the basic 4.6L in the 2003 XLT. I believe 2v.

So you are saying the valve covers can stay on as long as the oil pan is off to get the timing cover off ?

Seems like just a whole bunch of unbolting from the front, doesn't look all that bad except maybe a bit time-consuming.

Yes. You will have to remove the bolts in the valve covers that go into the timing cover of course. The difficult part would be putting the timing cover back on and getting the valve cover gaskets to stay in place. Its a rubber type gasket that when the valve covers are new it would stay in place. But with the older plastic valve covers the gap opens up to the point it no longer holds the gasket.

 

[MakDad]

quick update

UPDATE ******

So I went ahead and pulled the front timing cover off. Wasn't too difficult, just a pain in the behind. All those rusted bolts didn't help much, either.

This is what it looked like inside ! Can you see what's wrong with this picture ?!

This is the wear that was caused by the slack in the chain. Another 20K miles or so and it would probably be a hole.

Oh yeah, and the remaining piece that I found in the bottom of the timing chain cover. Don't ask me where the rest went, as I know there's more. Might be all in the oil filter by now. (I'm gonna cut it tomorrow and post some pics for the pro's to comment on).

 

[Whack]

Wow...

So what is the game plan now? New timing set?

If your filter looks bad enough do you think you might have blown some plastic bits via the bypass valve into the clean side of the oiling system?

 

[MakDad]

Wow...

So what is the game plan now? New timing set?

If your filter looks bad enough do you think you might have blown some plastic bits via the bypass valve into the clean side of the oiling system?

Yes, new timing set, minus the chains and gears. The chains definitely feel solid, especially on the driver side where everything held up.

I'm also leaning towards a new oil pump. If the bits went thru the bypass valve, is the engine done for ? I was thinking about doing several short-interval oil changes to clean it out. Will this work ?!

 

[Whack]

Yes, new timing set, minus the chains and gears. The chains definitely feel solid, especially on the driver side where everything held up.

I'm also leaning towards a new oil pump. If the bits went thru the bypass valve, is the engine done for ? I was thinking about doing several short-interval oil changes to clean it out. Will this work ?!

This took some thinking...

Post Oil Filter it is:

Main Bearings
Cam Bearings
Lash Adjusters
Block/Head Passages
Tensioners
(Lucky you... it is a 2 valve... no VCT stuff)

Since you are replacing the Tensioners, they can be marked off the list... look of the oil feed hole on the back... it's matching hole on the block should be checked and cleaned.

The block and head passages should be big enough even with a little added sludge and varnish.

Lash adjusters should be pretty good, the passages leading to them are good sized and they are only using oil pressure to push up on one side of the rocker arms and spray oil on the rocker arm. The spray hole aims oil at the wheel on that arm... It it looks oiled, you should be good.

The bearings are another story...

http://www.rockauto.com/getimage/ge....rockauto.com/info/SealedPower/7292MA_ANG.jpg
(source RockAuto.com)

If you notice the 4.6 main bearings have the small oil passage to lube the bearing... my paranoid fear is that it could get clogged and reduce oil flow... which is bad for bearings...

I'd check this way:

Oil goes -> pan -> pick up -> pump -> filter -> oily bits (bearings, lifters)

Ford ZETEC Oil Flow - YouTube

Look at the center section of the oil filter for debris, if the bypass was active and spewed plastic bits there could be some there...

Since the front cover is off the chain, pull the valve covers (read a manual)... if plastic type debris is there in the valleys it made it to the lifters and bearings.

If you don't see any plastic, some happy sludge cleaning can take place.

Was there any top end noise from near the valve covers? or just all on the engine front?

Let me know what you find.

 

[MakDad]

Was there any top end noise from near the valve covers? or just all on the engine front?

Let me know what you find.

No noise from the top end at all !! The only noise was (what I believe) was the chain slapping the cover as it wasn't a rhythmic tick-tick-tick, but a random noise like a chain slapping the cover, LOL.

The SUV didn't pull any different, seemed like the power was all there. It was driving great, minus the oil pressure drop.

At this point, I'm leaning towards a new pump anyways. 150K+ on the motor, wouldn't hurt. Plus, someone recommended flushing the motor with either SeaFoam or 1qt of tranny fluid.

I'll cut the oil filter in the morning and report back. Thanks for the great tips, info.

 

[toms89]

No noise from the top end at all !! The only noise was (what I believe) was the chain slapping the cover as it wasn't a rhythmic tick-tick-tick, but a random noise like a chain slapping the cover, LOL.

The SUV didn't pull any different, seemed like the power was all there. It was driving great, minus the oil pressure drop.

At this point, I'm leaning towards a new pump anyways. 150K+ on the motor, wouldn't hurt. Plus, someone recommended flushing the motor with either SeaFoam or 1qt of tranny fluid.

I'll cut the oil filter in the morning and report back. Thanks for the great tips, info.

I would replace the oil pump because any debree that made it past the pickup screen went thru it and it wasnt really designed as a grinder so... I would hope the filter caught any remaining debree or else you may have issues.

 

[Whack]

toms89 has a good point... the oil pump is not a plastic grinder.

If it looks like your filter caught it all, I'd suggest looking toward buttoning everything back up and working up a little cocktail for the engine.

Seafoam or a product called Kreen (Engine Cleaners) in the oil should help clean out the engine. Kreen is a bit more heavy on the solvents then Seafoam, but Seafoam is everywhere.

The pick up maybe salvaged, but there is a lot of solvent and compressed air in its future.

Before putting things back, you have the chance to clean the front cover, oil pan, and valve train of sludge and varnish. this will at least get you a head start on the task ahead.

If you use solvents, make use you allow to dry. Don't forget to oil the **** out of everything... the chain, guides, and valve train should be dripping.

The pump will need priming and getting the pan on can be messy if the oiling up top was a bit much.

You've got to make sure the system is making oil pressure... (oil light off... back up gauge reading the right range).

If you have it all back in and working listen for valve train noise... if it's all good... proceed to add seafoam/kreen as per directions...

You will be looking for the oil to get dirty quickly. Short interval changes will be key... Use a synthetic or synthetic blend, as any solvent like seafoam will weaken the oil's lubricating capacity. 500 to 1000 miles should be the max you want to run the mix.

Whack

 

[Pontisteve]

The filter filters the oil before it hits the bearings and top end. I wouldn't worry too much about that. If that stuff is hurt, it's rebuilt motor time anyway. Besides, if you've ever cut a filter open, you know that not much of anything gets past the filter media.

More important is pre-filter stuff. The oil pump is a gerotor design, with two rotary gears inside. They are made of powdered metal, and can break under excess stress. They probably didn't, and they're probably fine. But pull the oil pump, disassemble it, clean everything and inspect it, and clean the hole in the block where the pump feeds from the pickup tube. Clean the pickup tube excessively, or just replace it.

Find some 4.6 racing websites like Sean Hylands, and read up on how to inspect and measure the clearances on the oil pump. Check it, and put it back together and back in. Or if you can't sleep at nite, just buy a new pump.

As stated before, the chains and gears are fine. Just clean them up with solvent. All new guides and tensioner arms are a must. And if you've got the heavy cast iron tensioners, take them apart carefully, clean them up, inspect them, and reuse them. If you've got the composite tensioners, replace them.

Some guys like to "prime" the oil pump by packing it with vaseline. It supposedly helps to prime the pump quickly, and dissolves quickly into the oil once running. I'm not sure it this is a good thing, or not. Probably 6 of one, half dozen of the other.

I would pull the fuel pump relay, remove the coil packs, pull the spark plugs, and spin the motor over quite a bit with the starter, to build up oil pressure. Then put it all back together and crank it up, and maybe do a couple 500 mile oil changes until you feel comfortable nothing else is coming out.

While you have the plugs out and coil packs off, disassemble the coil pack boots and springs, clean the coil terminal (at the spring connection), maybe even buy some new coil boots/spring kit, and a fresh set of motorcraft platinum plugs. Your motor will go for a long long time now. Just make SURE you set the cam timing up correctly. Hopefully, you took my advice and put the motor at TDC on #1 compression before disassembling the chain stuff. Or made sure somehow that the cams didn't rotate due to spring pressure.

What did you have to do to pull the oil pan off?

 

[MakDad]

*** OIL FILTER CUT UPDATE ***

Cut the oil filter today, looks promising.

Besides the regular stuff, I DID find aluminum dust particles in the paper filament. Looks like the ground dust from the chain grinding the timing cover.
Other than that, nothing else. No plastic, no metal pieces.
Might be good news after all.....

 

[MakDad]

And if you've got the heavy cast iron tensioners, take them apart carefully, clean them up, inspect them, and reuse them. If you've got the composite tensioners, replace them.

What did you have to do to pull the oil pan off?

Steve, what's inside those tensioners ? Are they spring-loaded ? I don't want to kill myself trying to take one of these apart not knowing what to do.

To pull the oil pan on the 4X4:

1. I removed the cross member ( 2 bolts on each side)
2. Removed the torsion cross bar
3. Removed 3 bolts holding up the front differential (axle) assembly (pain in the rear)
4. Removed all bolts holding the oil pan and slid it towards the rear of the vehicle and down.

 

[MakDad]

OK, so now I'm leaning towards replacing the oil pump also (just in case), but am weary of taking the chains off to do it.

IF I LEAVE THE CHAINS ON THE CAMSHAFTS GEARS AND ONLY TAKE OFF THE CRANK SIDE OF THE CHAINS, DO I RISK ANY MOTOR DAMAGE IF THE CRANK DOESN'T MOVE ??????

Please let me know as I'm planning to finish this nightmare this weekend.

 

[MakDad]

Quick update as I grab some lunch here *******

Pulled the oil pump off. Thing looks almost mint except for the junk in the little channel that goes around the pump (see pic, circled in red) No ground plastic or metal parts anywhere !!!!

Cleaned it up nicely with carb cleaner and put back together.

As I was taking the crank gears off though, the spring tension caused the cams to turn about 3 links. Good thing I marked the chains/teeth before taking them off....

Assembly time after lunch. Wish me luck..