Has anyone tried to steal your vehicle?

[762mm]

Here in New York State you can shoot intruders if they pose a threat to you or your families immediate safety according to the attorney general. You have to be able to prove they intended harm and the advice is to if you shoot, make sure you finish the job so they can’t sue you. You cannot pull a gun without a threat to life here as far as I know. In some states you can simply pull a gun to defend property, here it’s pull a gun to defend life only. That being said there was a more recent case where a man shot two burglars in his home. They found him innocent and not guilty of any wrong doing as breaking into his home at night meant the intruders could have threatened his families life.

In short if you break in or steal, be prepared for the consequences. Because often the law states in one way or another you can be legally done in by vigilante justice lol.

In that case, NY's system is the same as Canada's... Although a few years ago, when we had a Conservative government running things, they did add to our criminal code that citizens can use "reasonable force" to defend property as well.

Reasonable means whatever is necessary to control a given situation, all the way up to lethal force (if justified) .

 

[JExpedition07]

In that case, NY's system is the same as Canada's... Although a few years ago, when we had a Conservative government running things, they did add to our criminal code that citizens can use "reasonable force" to defend property as well.

Reasonable means whatever is necessary to control a given situation.

I did some more research, while it looks like you cannot pull a gun to defend general property you can pull a gun to defend your home itself according to NY State Law. It’s called “castle law”. This is why this recent case the man was found innocent. Two legal grounds for gun defense here are both threat to safety and castle law.

 

[Plati]

I had a buddy who always hoped someone would break into his house so he could shoot them. He joked (I thought it was a joke) that in NYS you have to make sure they don't make it outside in order to avoid charges.

He kept his loaded pistol in the drawer by his bed. Soon after getting married, his wife startled him partially awake when she was returning from the bathroom in the middle of the night. He pulled the gun out and almost shot her.

You can't make this stuff up.

 

[JExpedition07]

I had a buddy who always hoped someone would break into his house so he could shoot them. He joked (I thought it was a joke) that in NYS you have to make sure they don't make it outside in order to avoid charges.

He kept his loaded pistol in the drawer by his bed. Soon after getting married, his wife startled him partially awake when she was returning from the bathroom in the middle of the night. He pulled the gun out and almost shot her.

You can't make this stuff up.

He sounds like a moron. Why would you shoot someone if they are running away? At that point they don’t pose a threat to you or your property. If he was coming at your buddies house with a flamethrower or intending harm then he could shoot the guy legally lol.

 

[762mm]

I had a buddy who always hoped someone would break into his house so he could shoot them. He joked (I thought it was a joke) that in NYS you have to make sure they don't make it outside in order to avoid charges.

He kept his loaded pistol in the drawer by his bed. Soon after getting married, his wife startled him partially awake when she was returning from the bathroom in the middle of the night. He pulled the gun out and almost shot her.

You can't make this stuff up.

That's when proper "gun control" comes into play: if you own a gun and will use it for self-defense, you need to know how to properly control the friggin thing and be aware of your target and beyond! (muzzle control is especially important!)

If your ex-friend chooses to live by his convictions, it's his business. To each their own. Just make sure not to break into his house and you'll be safe, that's all.

 

[Boostedbus]

I had a buddy who always hoped someone would break into his house so he could shoot them. He joked (I thought it was a joke) that in NYS you have to make sure they don't make it outside in order to avoid charges.

He kept his loaded pistol in the drawer by his bed. Soon after getting married, his wife startled him partially awake when she was returning from the bathroom in the middle of the night. He pulled the gun out and almost shot her.

You can't make this stuff up.

When I go out of town and leave the wife at home alone, she wants a loaded 12ga.by the bed. I have 5 shells in it starting with no.8 bird shot , then no.6 ,then no.4, then buck shot, then finally a deer slug. I told her if she starts shooting and they are getting away she’ll keep getting longer range shells as she pumps another round in. Sorry.... no sympathy for intruders in this house. Plus a woman will get more sympathy from a jury for fearing for her life in a home invasion situation. I don’t think she’ll need more than one round at close range ....but just in case! She could lob a slug at the getaway car trying to get the F*** out of Dodge! I gotta make sure I call first if I come home early. Lol

 

[jeff kushner]

G. Gordon Libby used to host a radio show. To me, the guy was a lot of crap.....BUT he used to make a good point. He said: " If someone breaks into your house, and you let him live there are two stories, yours and his....your job is to make sure there is only your story".....

Good point!

I do not keep a loaded gun in my home,my choice. Too many GF's in years past and too many chances of getting shot with my own weapons.

If someone is foolish enough to come into my home however, they will not leave of their own accord, period.

They get to make the choice to enter but I'm the one that gets to choose if they leave.


Just like that 14 y/o's weapon that he chose to point at me....I own his 32 auto now.....(sounds like Braaaaap as it empties the clip)


NEVER seek violence, never....but if it comes upon you, end it as fast as possible, by any means. Just what we were taught.

jeff

FWIW: Practice, practice, practice if you ever expect to hit a target while being fired upon or under severe stress like a break-in. Police officers typically will miss over 90% of time when returning fire.......the guys who carry guns for a living miss over 90% of time.....what do you think your chances are?

My sister did security for a while after she retired from the Navy years ago. She fires 4,000 rounds a week....yeah, I know but she enjoys it. She was forced into taking someones life on the job. There were two "assailants", she fired two shots, one dead and one ran away.

Afterwards I asked her about it all. She said she had reasoned that in any likely scenario, the bad guys would have the drop on her so she had practiced knowing that she might only get one shot. I still have a sister because of her accuracy.

 

[Plati]

When I go out of town and leave the wife at home alone, she wants a loaded 12ga.by the bed. I have 5 shells in it starting with no.8 bird shot , then no.6 ,then no.4, then buck shot, then finally a deer slug. I told her if she starts shooting and they are getting away she’ll keep getting longer range shells as she pumps another round in. Sorry.... no sympathy for intruders in this house. Plus a woman will get more sympathy from a jury for fearing for her life in a home invasion situation. I don’t think she’ll need more than one round at close range ....but just in case! She could lob a slug at the getaway car trying to get the F*** out of Dodge! I gotta make sure I call first if I come home early. Lol

What you describe is pretty much state law in Montana.

 

[Boostedbus]

I believe if you’re gonna use lethal force, then make sure the thug doesn’t live. If you shoot and just wound an assailant you always have to worry will he be back when he gets out of jail in 6 months and seek revenge. I had a friend back in the mid 80’s who got married at age 18 to his high school sweetheart. She was a very pretty blonde and he was a big bulky weightlifter who was in the best shape of his life. They rented their first apartment (which is about 6 mi. from me) and moved in as newlyweds. They were in only weeks before they had a thug break in while they were both home. He held his wife at gunpoint and shut my friend in the bathroom and ***** his wife while he waited in the bathroom. He told my friend that he would kill her if he came out of the bathroom. I’m sure they were targeted prey because of being young and naïve and not armed. But I cannot imagine any worse nightmare happening to some innocent newlyweds , or the helplessness he must of felt. It doesn’t matter how big and bad you are if someone has a gun to your wife’s head.Their marriage didn’t make it through all the trauma caused by the incident. So having seen first hand what can happen to friends, family, and loved ones, I have zero sympathy or tolerance for anyone entering my house uninvited. I have to expect the worse a extinguish the threat asap! Besides if you let them live they just become a tax burden on society to feed them in jail.

 

[762mm]

I believe if you’re gonna use lethal force, then make sure the thug doesn’t live. If you shoot and just wound an assailant you always have to worry will he be back when he gets out of jail in 6 months and seek revenge. I had a friend back in the mid 80’s who got married at age 18 to his high school sweetheart. She was a very pretty blonde and he was a big bulky weightlifter who was in the best shape of his life. They rented their first apartment (which is about 6 mi. from me) and moved in as newlyweds. They were in only weeks before they had a thug break in while they were both home. He held his wife at gunpoint and shut my friend in the bathroom and ***** his wife while he waited in the bathroom. He told my friend that he would kill her if he came out of the bathroom. I’m sure they were targeted prey because of being young and naïve and not armed. But I cannot imagine any worse nightmare happening to some innocent newlyweds , or the helplessness he must of felt. It doesn’t matter how big and bad you are if someone has a gun to your wife’s head.Their marriage didn’t make it through all the trauma caused by the incident. So having seen first hand what can happen to friends, family, and loved ones, I have zero sympathy or tolerance for anyone entering my house uninvited. I have to expect the worse a extinguish the threat asap! Besides if you let them live they just become a tax burden on society to feed them in jail.

From a legal standpoint, if you intentionally "let them live", that means lethal force was not justified in a self-defense scenario (note: laws may differ in a home invasion situation, but generally this is how it is in most jurisdictions I'm aware of).

Basically, the way courts look at it is that lethal force is only for extreme situations which do call for the most extreme level of force, such as someone pointing a knife or a gun at you or at another person.

If in a given situation you choose to "shoot them in the leg", then it can be easily argued that it was not necessary to use lethal force to begin with - a kick or a baton to the knee (less than lethal) would've sufficed, perhaps? That's how the judge or jury will see it. The use of a firearm is always considered "lethal force", no matter where you hit (or miss).

This is the real reason behind why law enforcement and self-defense experts will tell you to make sure the job is done 100% if you choose to go that route... because anything less done intentionally can put you in the hot seat! Lethal force is either justified or it isn't; there is no "middle ground", legally speaking.


Keep in mind that the use of force against a fellow citizen, and especially the use of lethal force, is the greatest right a government can grant its' citizenry. This is why so many Leftist dictatorships around the world have a severe allergy towards self-defense and civilian gun ownership : because they prefer to maintain a government monopoly on the use of force.

 

[Boostedbus]

From a legal standpoint, if you intentionally "let them live", that means lethal force was not justified in a self-defense scenario (note: laws may differ in a home invasion situation, but generally this is how it is in most jurisdictions I'm aware of).

Basically, the way courts look at it is that lethal force is only for extreme situations which do call for the most extreme level of force, such as someone pointing a knife or a gun at you or at another person.

If in a given situation you choose to "shoot them in the leg", then it can be easily argued that it was not necessary to use lethal force to begin with - a kick or a baton to the knee (less than lethal) would've sufficed, perhaps? That's how the judge or jury will see it. The use of a firearm is always considered "lethal force", no matter where you hit (or miss).

This is the real reason behind why law enforcement and self-defense experts will tell you to make sure the job is done 100% if you choose to go that route... because anything less done intentionally can put you in the hot seat! Lethal force is either justified or it isn't; there is no "middle ground", legally speaking.


Keep in mind that the use of force against a fellow citizen, and especially the use of lethal force, is the greatest right a government can grant its' citizenry. This is why so many Leftist dictatorships around the world have a severe allergy towards self-defense and civilian gun ownership : because they prefer to maintain a government monopoly on the use of force.

I’d rather take my chances in a courtroom with my life than in my own home. If I’m in court over a home invasion situation, then that’s because I’m still alive and hopefully so is my family. Let’s hope none of us are put in that situation but if we are then we have the strength to eliminate the threat before something escalates. It’s tough to overcome the element of surprise which gives the intruder the first advantage.

 

[DrExpo]

Great thread. Very informative.