Power Difference

[kodigray2015]

Ok, I’m sure somewhere in this forum this has been addressed, but I can’t find anything on it.

How does the Navigator have 75 hp more than the Expedition? Is it just computer programming?


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[byathread]

How does the Navigator have 75 hp more than the Expedition? Is it just computer programming?

Platinum expeditions come with same tuning as the navigators... So, yes, it is programming.

 

[kodigray2015]

Platinum expeditions come with same tuning as the navigators... So, yes, it is programming.

My understanding is the XLT has 375hp, the platinum has 400hp, and the navigator has 450hp. Is that wrong?


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[KJ-Idaho]

My understanding is the XLT has 375hp, the platinum has 400hp, and the navigator has 450hp. Is that wrong?


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You are correct. Supposedly, the Navi gets Raptor tuning, and possibly some hardened bits to support the 450 hp and increased torque. Aftermarket Tuning for expeditions yield in excess of 450 hp. But, there might be increased Hardware risk. Most tuners and Even dealers discount the risk to hardware.

 

[LokiWolf]

Let’s clarify a few things...

ALL Expeditions have the same motor. The Platinum is merely tuning differences from the factory. A limited and a Platinum when aftermarket tuned have the same power potential.

The Navi is a slightly different Motor. It is the HO 3.5 2nd Gen found in the Raptor, and the F150 Limited. Different pistons, runs lower compression, with more boost. It is capable of more power with just tuning than the non-HO motor found in the Expedition.



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[LokiWolf]

Platinum expeditions come with same tuning as the navigators... So, yes, it is programming.

Nope.


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[LokiWolf]

My understanding is the XLT has 375hp, the platinum has 400hp, and the navigator has 450hp. Is that wrong?


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Correct. XLT, Limited - 375. Platinum - 400. Navi - 450.


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[JasonH]

Check part numbers for the turbochargers in the catalog. I suspect the Navigator has larger turbos and some other special bits.

 

[LokiWolf]

Check part numbers for the turbochargers in the catalog. I suspect the Navigator has larger turbos and some other special bits.

HO Motor has the exact same size turbo, the material is different though for the turbine. It can handle higher heat.

Like was mentioned above only internal difference is the Pistons and lower compression. Supposedly the exhaust manifold has some slight differences, but I have never been able to clarify. Never seen them side by side.


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[Gumby]

I would imagine these figures are based upon 93 octane fuel?

 

[LokiWolf]

I would imagine these figures are based upon 93 octane fuel?

About 91 actually based on the new industry standard...I could go into the Chemistry...but yeah.


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[Gumby]

Yeah, I typo'd that. I was thinking 94 in my mind (and backed off one since I don't think you can get 94 at pumps in the US? idk) as we have pumps here that offer that (with Petro Canada) but yes, Premium is 91 octane typically.

 

[byathread]

Nope.

Thanks for setting me straight AND subsequent explanation. You are a class act, @LokiWolf! My bad, was thinking platinum expy/navi/raptor were the same... HO, good to know![emoji106]

 

[LokiWolf]

About 91 actually based on the new industry standard...I could go into the Chemistry...but yeah.


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Most of the US is 93 for Premium. There are exceptions like higher altitude areas like Colorado.

They actually don’t actually use Pump gas. I did some research on it a while back. It is a repeatable standard, so it makes Power and MPG numbers more consistent across Brands.


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[LokiWolf]

Thanks for setting me straight AND subsequent explanation. You are a class act, @LokiWolf! My bad, was thinking platinum expy/navi/raptor were the same... HO, good to know![emoji106]

No Problem. I try! I know I come across blunt sometimes... They had to do something to really set the Navi apart. That Motor is a beast. The Platinum is just marketing...if you aren’t going to tune, it is a nice bump though!


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[JasonH]

HO Motor has the exact same size turbo, the material is different though for the turbine. It can handle higher heat.

Like was mentioned above only internal difference is the Pistons and lower compression. Supposedly the exhaust manifold has some slight differences, but I have never been able to clarify. Never seen them side by side.


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Confirmed part numbers are the same (6K682), so both Expedition and Navigator would be an BW K03 with no internal differences. That suggests the Expedition has substantial headroom, which I guess is why the tuners are getting so much more power out of them. I haven't looked at a compressor map, but apparently the K03 has a lot more in it. I just found an E85/E15 pump at the Murphy's down the road...might have to give one of these ethanol tunes a try. Too bad my model year doesn't support flex fuel. I don't relish the prospect of swapping tunes every time I tow.

 

[LokiWolf]

Confirmed part numbers are the same (6K682), so both Expedition and Navigator would be an IHI K03 with no internal differences. That suggests the Expedition has substantial headroom, which I guess is why the tuners are getting so much more power out of them. I haven't looked at a compressor map, but apparently the K03 has a lot more in it. I just found an E85/E15 pump at the Murphy's down the road...might have to give one of these ethanol tunes a try. Too bad my model year doesn't support flex fuel. I don't relish the prospect of swapping tunes every time I tow.

Not true. The HO motor has a different Turbo. The size and flow are the same but the internals can handle more heat. Ford Part numbers are misconceiving.


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[JasonH]

Not true. The HO motor has a different Turbo. The size and flow are the same but the internals can handle more heat. Ford Part numbers are misconceiving.


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How would one spec a replacement part for the turbo without a part number specific to the vehicle? Do you have a source for the position that the HO motor turbos can handle more heat?

 

[Anerbe]

How would one spec a replacement part for the turbo without a part number specific to the vehicle? Do you have a source for the position that the HO motor turbos can handle more heat?

Ford's PN's are complex enough to track both different part numbers and succession parts (updates). However, you need the full 10/11 digit P/N to verify the exact part / variant

XXXX-YYYY-ZZ
XXXX-YYYY-ZZZ

Just compare these between the two turbos

 

[wakeboarder]

Turbo part numbers:

Parts.lakelandford.com
Expedition
Right: JL3Z-6K682-D
Left: JL3Z-6K682-C

fordpartsgiant.com
Navigator
Right: JL7Z-6K682-B
Left: JL7Z-6K682-A