What was Ford thinking by adding back in the tailgate?

[LanceExp2025]

The dash is a major departure from convention and was my only hesitation about getting one. After the first drive my reservations were gone. It's in a much more natural position, it's much more in your field of view while not obstructing your line of sight. It's a better solution than a windshield HUD in my opinion. However I'm not thrilled with the limited info that's up there and the lack of customization. I'm old school and would like to see more/better gauges, or at least the option for them.

Thanks 1badhabit:

I am glad that you like the basics of the 2025 Digital Dash & Screen. As much as I disliked it in the Ford sales videos, I think we could have gotten used to it. My wife even struggled with the many digital NEW things on our 2024 even though it has many manual knobs still. She's getting used to all of that now and we both love our new car! Thanks for your response, Lance

 

[fordperfaddict]

for us dog owners the tailgate will be a problem. the curent tailgate and bumper act as a step when the dogs jump up.

 

[DieselMonk]

Still the eLSD is one of the best features in the 4th as in the 5th gen Expedition.

 

[dlcorbett]

for us dog owners the tailgate will be a problem. the curent tailgate and bumper act as a step when the dogs jump up.

Would they not be able to get in through the back door and get into the cargo bay?

 

[ROBERT BONNER]

Also, there is an e-locker for the rear.

Sorry, the '25 Order guide shows that the ELSD is only offered on the Tremor which is SWB only. No MAX ELSD on either the Expedition or the Navigator, it is no longer part of the trailer tow. It's a big miss by the Product Planners. As for height, my wife was not comfortable with the reaches and nixed the babygate. Full disclosure, my wife is 64 and used to be 5', she's probably a little shorter now.

Since it's just the 2 of us, we never put groceries or small rollable items in the rear, it's easier to just put them on the 2nd row floor and access through the 2nd row doors. We're normally only put luggage, dog kennels, etc. through the hatch on trips, except during hunting season when the gun vault is mounted with kennels on top using the hatch for access, so we just have no use for the babygate.

From a Product Planning perspective, since the product seems to be perpetually capacity constrained, someone thought they could get enough more revenue to cover the cost of an additional closure with a significant ROI and ROS. It's been 20 years since I was in charge of estimating such things; but, I would guess the investment at ~$5M and the VC at at least $200. At 400% ROI (typical for capacity constrained non quality projects) would work out to at least a $400 upcharge to breakeven. Which most people would pay if they perceived it as an upgrade.

 

[tangbang]

Local dealer has a King Ranch MAX which they graciously let my family test drive, even knowing we have a Platinum SPP on order elsewhere. First time seeing a '25 in person and they handed us the keys and said, "Have fun." My kids LOVE the car (we have been in Sienna for 7 years).

As for the tailgate, I love it. I have no idea why some people who haven't experienced one IRL are feeling so strongly negative about it. It seems extremely functional to me. I love how I can open just the top, or the top and bottom together. My wife is 5'4" and not even a little concerned about reaching in. Can she touch the back of the third row seat? No, of course not. Does she need to? No. We love that feature. The kids were all excited about sitting on the tailgate (we camp).

My biggest "issue" is the squircle steering wheel but that will be a non factor after 1-2 days. My wife was concerned she would hate the glossy black tailgate but even that is not an issue for either of us. I may get it wrapped, I may not bother. Glad we ordered a 2025.

 

[sanman28]

Range Rover has had great success with split tailgate for many years.

 

[fordperfaddict]

Would they not be able to get in through the back door and get into the cargo bay?

good point. they are just hairy as can be and like to avoid the seating areas at all costs

 

[lv2drive]

for us dog owners the tailgate will be a problem. the curent tailgate and bumper act as a step when the dogs jump up.

^^^ this. i guess nobody on the surveys has dogs that need to jump in the back anymore.

both my dogs would look at me like i was crazy if i tried to get them to jump in the back of a '25 - & if they tried they would only manage to get their front half on that lower tailgate.

on top of that, the window hatch on the g4 is literally their favorite thing in the world...

 

[Danm355]

What year was your navigator. I was a bit u sure when i bought a used 09 with 100k miles, the air suspension Surprisingly held up well for the 75k miles i drove on it.

Mine was a 2009 Navigator

 

[John Auer]

I grew up in a family where our primary vehicle was a station wagon and being a GM family, we did not have one with the Ford Dual Gate Tailgate where you could open the tailgate as a door for easy loading and unloading or a tailgate for, well, sitting on (tailgating).

I have 3 full size SUVs and one of the things I like most about them over pickups (besides the cargo staying dry and warm), is they are super easy to load, unload and access cargo as there is not a "gate" keeping you away from the cargo area. With the 2025 Expedition, Ford is now going back 50 years by re-adding a tailgate, albeit a smaller one.

Do you think they did this to provide a small sitting area for "tailgating" (we all now have inexpensive folding chairs for that) or did they do it to shorten the length the rear hatch door so it could fully open in low height garages? This was accomplished with the Excursion using split lower doors. Add one convenience, remove another more important one, at least to me.

And don't get me started on "You can have your lower tailgate any color, as long as you choose black" - on a $90K vehicle.

Ford made a huge mistake with this tailgate. It adds zero functionality and is ugly to boot.

 

[John Auer]

Local dealer has a King Ranch MAX which they graciously let my family test drive, even knowing we have a Platinum SPP on order elsewhere. First time seeing a '25 in person and they handed us the keys and said, "Have fun." My kids LOVE the car (we have been in Sienna for 7 years).

As for the tailgate, I love it. I have no idea why some people who haven't experienced one IRL are feeling so strongly negative about it. It seems extremely functional to me. I love how I can open just the top, or the top and bottom together. My wife is 5'4" and not even a little concerned about reaching in. Can she touch the back of the third row seat? No, of course not. Does she need to? No. We love that feature. The kids were all excited about sitting on the tailgate (we camp).

My biggest "issue" is the squircle steering wheel but that will be a non factor after 1-2 days. My wife was concerned she would hate the glossy black tailgate but even that is not an issue for either of us. I may get it wrapped, I may not bother. Glad we ordered a 2025.

I’m glad you and your kids are enjoying the new tailgate. We don’t have any kids at home anymore, so the tailgate doesn’t fit our lifestyle. We constantly load and unload golf clubs and the occasional run to Costco. I wish Ford had made the new tailgate optional.

 

[dlcorbett]

Its weird ppl say the tailgate makes loading harder, but if you go grocery shopping and put your stuff in a cart, hows that no more harder?

 

[sanman28]

Ford made a huge mistake with this tailgate. It adds zero functionality and is ugly to boot.

Wrong. It’s great and adds a complete new level of function. At least 50% of the time you are not pushing stuff in along the floor, rather you are lifting it in. And having the tailgate doesn’t interfere with that and provides some security to keep it from rolling out. And if you want to push stuff in along the floor, just hit the button! And you have more floor length and a place to sit. Your only legitimate gripe is the black placard. I get it. That’s why my expy is black (although not a complete match).

 

[Calidad]

I met a design engineer years ago when I had a Land Cruiser. It also had a tailgate. Guess what? A tailgate on a wagon body style is a structural element in the strength of the rear part of the body. A floating rear hatch over a giant gaping hole is not a structural element!!!

Take a box cut off two of the flaps close one flap and tape it to the sides of the box. The box is more ridged.

A hatch by itself! Floats over the opening it offers zero structural support to the back of the vehicle.

Soo
Why did Ford add it? Most likely for structural rigidity. Are there secondary advantages? Heck yes!!! My stuff doesn’t dump out on the ground when I open the hatch on a hill. I have a seat to sit on to put on ski boots, hiking boots while my dog crate takes up floor space behind me.

The tailgate also serves as a great tool bench.

I get that a whole lot of people buy these vehicles when a Mini van would be a better fit. But a true full sized SUV should have a tailgate. It also should have structural elements that make it stronger so it can do Utility jobs without having structural issues.

I tow a heavy boat with mine. Yes that tailgate will no doubt add strength to the vehicle and reduce squeaks and flexing under heavy loads.

 

[sanman28]

I met a design engineer years ago when I had a Land Cruiser. It also had a tailgate. Guess what? A tailgate on a wagon body style is a structural element in the strength of the rear part of the body. A floating rear hatch over a giant gaping hole is not a structural element!!!

Take a box cut off two of the flaps close one flap and tape it to the sides of the box. The box is more ridged.

A hatch by itself! Floats over the opening it offers zero structural support to the back of the vehicle.

Soo
Why did Ford add it? Most likely for structural rigidity. Are there secondary advantages? Heck yes!!! My stuff doesn’t dump out on the ground when I open the hatch on a hill. I have a seat to sit on to put on ski boots, hiking boots while my dog crate takes up floor space behind me.

The tailgate also serves as a great tool bench.

I get that a whole lot of people buy these vehicles when a Mini van would be a better fit. But a true full sized SUV should have a tailgate. It also should have structural elements that make it stronger so it can do Utility jobs without having structural issues.

I tow a heavy boat with mine. Yes that tailgate will no doubt add strength to the vehicle and reduce squeaks and flexing under heavy loads.

Indeed. Although I don’t think adding more rigidity via a tailgate was probably a top 5 goal. Rather, I bet ford wanted a real change to differentiate themselves from gm/jeep/toyota/nissan. Range Rover is the only other SUV to offer one I think. Just a theory!

 

[tangbang]

we picked up our '25 Expy Plat Max SPP a few days ago and love the tailgate.

 

[dags1207]

We are looking forwards to having the tailgate, specially since we have young kids in sports. Worst case scenario, I'll get a his and hers matching set of these hahaha (since we are both considered short)

 

[GlennSullivan]

we picked up our '25 Expy Plat Max SPP a few days ago and love the tailgate.

My problems with the new design are as follows:
1) The non circular steering wheel. This is the answer to a question no one ever asked, and maybe could create dangerous driving situations. All to be able to see a long low LED screen that maybe shouldn't be where it is?
2) The almost complete lack of hard buttons - several of our current vehicles have controls via central touch screen, but also have hard buttons for key items.
3) The bar across the width of the floor dividing the full flat floor? We regularly use the full flat floor and want to slide long objects in and out.
4) The fact that the tailgate pushes our reach in further away from the cargo area. We are past the point in our lives where anyone would sit on a tailgate.

We will wait and see if they got the reliability fixed, if so, may be able to look past the other things.

 

[GlennSullivan]

We are looking forwards to having the tailgate, specially since we have young kids in sports. Worst case scenario, I'll get a his and hers matching set of these hahaha (since we are both considered short)

View attachment 85587

Yeah No Shit**, We are not short, but also not 6'2". Yesterday I was unloading some things from our '17 Expy and could barely reach the items up against the back of the 2nd row seat from the rear. So adding what appears to be 15" would make that more difficult. Could I go to the side door and fold down the 2nd row to reach stuff, sure. But isn't that a little ridiculous?