2003 component Door speakers

[chadecoen]

Hi guys and gals,
I am starting to make a list for my stereo install. I am considering door speakers. My goal with doors or mid bass speakers is to have enough rich sound as to not need a sub at all. I have done some door speakers in my last '04 expy and I lost considerable bottom end from the OE speakers. I am pretty pleased over all with the oem set up but want it louder and richer.

So, my front speakers are what look like a 4" woofer and tweeter in a sealed case and my rear door speakers are just the standard 5x7 looking speaker in an open type enclosure. So, the front are in a sealed enclosure and rears are not, what would sound best with aftermarket speakers? Should I build little enclosures around the mid woofer or leave them open? Why the difference in the front door and rear door oem speakers? Any advice?

Thanks,
Chad

 

[GAINMOB]

you shouldve had 5x7's in both front/rear doors...typically 5.25 components (mid bass/tweet) will go in...6.5 components will fit but will need short mounting depth...in either case you will need speaker adapters for either size unless you go with 5x7 component which should bolt right up with no probs

i have 6.5 Massive Audio components and didnt pay attention to mounting depth so i had to use spacers to not have the door hitting the speaker...normally the spacer goes under the speaker...i put it on top

if you do an enclosure...it should only be fiberglass enclosure for the doors....no need to enclose them other wise and depending on response hz will dictate how much base u get out of them as well...

 

[bricekin]

So, my front speakers are what look like a 4" woofer and tweeter in a sealed case and my rear door speakers are just the standard 5x7 looking speaker in an open type enclosure.

It is possible that someone had gotten a set of the older JBL style speakers and put them in the front. They use to be of that kind of design. In any case, you should be able to remove the whole assembly and have a 5x7/6x8 hole to mount a standard style speaker into.

In my last 3 Ford builds, I've manufactured thick steel adapter plates and used higher end 5.25" component sets. But, when doing those setups, a sub was in the plans at one point or another. At the moment, I'm using JL Audio ZR series 5.25" and have surprising amounts of bass from those after ALOT of fine tuning.

JL Audio has 5x7 component sets in the C3 and C5 categories. Both of which, when installed properly with pretty well sealed and deadened doors, will offer very good bass performance.

 

[chadecoen]

I'm not sure about that. It does look like the old style but I was at the junk yard the other day and several lincoln navigators had them in front and rear doors. My truck is a Bauer with 6 disk and factory sub, if it matters? Weird. Anyway, next problem is my rear door speaker wires do not match any wires in the dash. All OEM wiring. Both rear doors pair wires are brown/yellow and brown/white. I only have 1 brown/yellow in the harness in the dash. I do have the center console out of the truck so maybe that has something to do with no rear sound. I will know more later when I put it back in (I installed the front amp under it).

So I moved forward and hooked up speakers, reinstalled door panels, and finished the install. and sure enough I have no rear sound.

However, I did the total door panel treatment with deadener, thinsulate, and dampner and everything. HOLY SHIT my front doors sound badd ass!!!!!!

You guys preaching "do the door panels" are sooooooo right!. I can't even believe I am in the same truck. Un F' ing believable. I am absolutely blown away with the difference. And I am just using an old JBL amp and some 5x7 mtx coax speakers. Crazy difference. Thanks for y'alls help everyone. What a joy it will be to drive my truck again.

Chad

 

[bricekin]

So I moved forward and hooked up speakers, reinstalled door panels, and finished the install. and sure enough I have no rear sound.

So, do you still not have rear sound or did that come back with the installation of the console? If your truck has the RSE (rear seat entertainment) and the controls are on the back of the console, that would definitely affect your rear speakers as the stock wiring goes from the radio into the RSE system and back out to the speakers.

Otherwise, off the top of my head, I can't think of any reason you'd be having a problem. When I did my install, I just ran new wire into all of the doors. Got rid of the pesky issues with the RSE killing my rear speakers whenever I turned it on.

 

[chadecoen]

Update......I reinstalled the center console and have rear sound again. Although, it is at a way lower volume than the fronts. I wish I would have just run speaker wire while I had the interior apart, duh. Oh well, maybe next time. I was able to tune most of the volume difference out with the gain on the amp. So all is well after all. Sounds incredible and thank you again for all the forum people that talked me in to wrapping my doors!

 

[bricekin]

You may be able to track down a wiring guide for the wiring going into the console, and bypass whatever the audio may be traveling through right there and save the headache of running new wire into the doors.

 

[chadecoen]

I like the way you think man. That is exactly what I was considering. Next time I have that console out I am going to track down the offending wires and bypass the whole rear controls thing. I know what color they are at the door and at the dash so finding them in the middle shouldn't be too difficult. Thanks.

Chad

 

[bricekin]

Any update on this?

 

[chadecoen]

Hey man,
No changes as of yet. I was able to get the rear speakers working again by re-installing the console and matched the front volume by turning the gain up on the rear channel. Not planning on taking anything apart again for a while. Although I may have to to get ipod wire in to the center console. Not sure yet. It sounds so good to me I may never change a damn thing. Well, I may ad some more sub but doors sound great.

Chad

 

[Mediamonkey11]

Sorry for bringing up an old thread, was wondering how you did your doors. I'm going to be replacing my front speakers here soon and wanted to deaden my doors.

 

[GAINMOB]

if ur still wanting to get more bass w/o subs...youtbe SQ build or google it...theres plent of sites for SQ builds...SQ=sound quality...and ppl are metering and winning bass comps with this setup...

 

[Mediamonkey11]

Ok cool, I'll look at that, I was just wondering what he did to his specific truck to make it sound so good! Maybe certain materials/combinations work best in Expy's

I already have a 1200W 4ch with a 2000W sub amp and a Diamond Audio sub, the door speakers are giving up the ghost though, they held up surprisingly well interestingly enough. I replaced the stock tweeter with a polk tweeter on the fronts and kept the midbass since all I had were the tweets and crossovers from previous warranty returns. Now I want to replace the midbasses with 6.5's with an adapter plate and still run the separate polks. Thought I might as well deaden while I'm at it.

 

[GAINMOB]

I think for sq u will have to go with 8s in the doors...

Holy Rollerz Christian Car Club (HRC3)

 

[chadecoen]

Hey, I just used the cheesy home depot roofing stuff for deadner and thinsulate. Didn't smell at all but does make one heck of a mess and the goo gets everywhere. I have been working in Dallas, TX and triple digit days haven't caused any issues either. Although I do think the glue gets a little slimy in hot weather.

I used a combo of 1x1 panels inside the door cavity to knock down vibration, thin egg crate foam 1x1 panels glued to the inside of the door behind the speakers, and then completely, or as completely as possible, sealed up the open areas behind the panel. I re-installed the factory plastic layer behind the panel. Then I used thinsulate on the back of the door panel and sandwitched it all back together. I think I prolly went a little over board but I don't think you can seal up the doors too much. Sounds fantastic. Very loud and crisp. I think even the oem speakers would sound crazy better in deadened doors. Aftermarket amp driven speakers sound phenomenal. There is some good reading on line about deadening your doors and rights and wrongs and science behind it all and what not. Good luck with yours man, you will not regret the time spent sealing up our doors.

 

[Mediamonkey11]

So you did 1'x1' sound deadening sheets on the door skin, then egg crate glued to the backside of the metal inner door panel (facing the window), and "thinsulate" coated the back side of the plastic door panel?

 

[chadecoen]

I should have taken photos. Lot easier to show you than describe it.

Yes and no. I used a couple of pieces on the inside of the outer door skin equaling about 1 square foot. I read somewhere that a very small percentage of material knocking down vibration works almost as well as covering the whole inside.
Then right next to the deadener on the inside of the outer skin I glued one approx 1'x1' egg crate foam to the door kind of behind where the back of the speaker is.
Then I covered the area that the plastic door panel clips too with more deadner, filling in every inch trying to make it air tight as possible. I guess it is the outside of the inner door skin? The same surface the speakers bolt too.
Then I hung thinsulate on the back of the plastic door panel and squished it all back together. Was a real pain in the arse cause I had covered up all the holes where the door panel clips on to the door. but a little trimming had it all back together.

Couple of notes though.......
Take the time to kill any rattles before closing up your doors. Trust me, it sucks removing this crap after the fact.

I sealed up the lower cladding on the doors from the inside just to make sure there were going to be no rattles. I also had rattles coming from both rear door window tracks I fixed before applying deadener. I used the soft side of sticky backed velcro to cushion and wrap door hardware and various moving parts I thought might give me trouble later on. And I cleaned and regreased all the window hardware and cables.

Good luck and let us know how it sounds!

 

[Mediamonkey11]

Awesome info! By chance is this the deadener stuff you're talking about?

Protecto Wrap, Window and Door Sealing/flashing Tape, 89720933 at The Home Depot - Mobile

 

[chadecoen]

Actuaally, now that I think about it, I got it at lowes. I think it was this stuff: Shop Peel & Seal 6-in x 300-in Aluminum Flashing at Lowes.com

But I expect home depots stuff is about the same. In a perfect world name brand deadener would be best and then next best maybe something like the depo stuff but butyl or rubber based instead of asphalt based but hey, asphalt stuff is inexpensive.

 

[oblivion]

You are very accurate in suggesting sound deadening. In more ways than one its awesome and it will help your system sound better all around but I am going to be a bit of a Debbie downer for the rest of it. I am sorry but I really wish people would stop using asphalt based "sound deadening" it is not meant to be used in enclosed spaces. It off gasses, it will peel in hot climates and it will harden in cold climates. yes it is on average nearly 1/4 the price of real sound deadening but you are using an inferior product to do a job it is not meant to do.

Save your $$ and get a butyl based deadener. I have compared both in direct A to B, and butyl based will out perform every time in every situation.