6 month review, 18 Navigator VS 18 Expedition.

[Deadman]

Headrests...dumb question as you guys seem to know your vehicles well but you
are aware that the headrests not only go up and down but forward and back too right?


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Absolutely. They just push my head too far forward even when they are retracted all the way. The ONLY way I can tolerate them is if I take the section below the headrest and jam that section ALL the way forward and then jam the headrest all the way back. I can survive at that, but I am not comfortable at all. No joke if this was my daily, I couldn't handle it, I'd have to get rid of it. I have a long torso, so that could be it. My wife has a short torso and the headrest is great for her. Its just something with my body size vs the seat. I'm 5'11 185lbs, so I'm not too crazy shaped, but I do have a longer torso and shorter legs. I'm sure that all plays into how I fit each seat. The adjustability of the seat is amazing, but the headrests just don't work for me at all. Again, great seats and all, just don't fit "me".

 

[Deadman]

So the limiteds get the active noise cancellation too? Thought that was a platinum thing.

302A limiteds get it is what we concurred.

 

[Deadman]

I’m convinced my Navis noise canceling doesn’t work. I wish there was a way to turn it off and on to confirm.


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Dealer called my wife today and said they found a way to adjust the amplifier for this noise canceling system and they want the vehicle, so they can play with the amplifier settings. She's going to ask them to shut it completely off if she can.
Right now if you drive it down the highway, it reminds me of a mud truck rolling down the freeway with worn bogger tires on it. It has the nastiest hum/drone that goes up and down in volume once a second. Its literally HHHHHHHHmmmmmmmmmmmmmm, HHHHHHHHHHHHHHmmmmmmmmmmmm, HHHHHHHHHHHHHmmmmmmmmm. Soo annoying. Its not the tires, its not the muffler, its some artificial BS piped into the cabin.

Be glad yours is OFF, its ridiculously annoying. She had a set of shooting muffs in the armrest and on long trips she often puts them on because otherwise it gives her a migraine.

 

[Deadman]

Good grief that looks bigger than my navis lol


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I would think the Expo's is larger. The Navi's is wasted with some of that storage and such on it. I LOVE the second set of cup holders on the rear of the Expeditions console tho. Wifes even jealous. Works great for the kids waters and spare waters or whatever.

 

[carymccarr]

Absolutely. They just push my head too far forward even when they are retracted all the way. The ONLY way I can tolerate them is if I take the section below the headrest and jam that section ALL the way forward and then jam the headrest all the way back. I can survive at that, but I am not comfortable at all. No joke if this was my daily, I couldn't handle it, I'd have to get rid of it. I have a long torso, so that could be it. My wife has a short torso and the headrest is great for her. Its just something with my body size vs the seat. I'm 5'11 185lbs, so I'm not too crazy shaped, but I do have a longer torso and shorter legs. I'm sure that all plays into how I fit each seat. The adjustability of the seat is amazing, but the headrests just don't work for me at all. Again, great seats and all, just don't fit "me".

Gotcha. I’m similar height/weight. I actually wish the top cushion came out further.

 

[Deadman]

Another notable thing is the Exhaust on the Lincoln is literally 5X as loud as the Expedition. I'm sure its the dual exhaust set up on it, but good lord its annoying. It wakes the kids up if my wife leaves early for work and the kids bedrooms are on the other end of the house. We took it to a Lincoln dealer 2 weeks ago and compared it to a brand new Lincoln and they BOTH roared like nuts. The service advisor lady said, she never paid close attention but these are the loudest vehicles she remembers. Nice for a "Luxury" Brand.......

 

[carymccarr]

Another notable thing is the Exhaust on the Lincoln is literally 5X as loud as the Expedition. I'm sure its the dual exhaust set up on it, but good lord its annoying. It wakes the kids up if my wife leaves early for work and the kids bedrooms are on the other end of the house. We took it to a Lincoln dealer 2 weeks ago and compared it to a brand new Lincoln and they BOTH roared like nuts. The service advisor lady said, she never paid close attention but these are the loudest vehicles she remembers. Nice for a "Luxury" Brand.......

Wow. We are so not aligned lol.

One of the things I hate about the Navi is how weak and quiet the exhaust is compared to the rumble and burble of denali and esky.

I looked at the X7 before I landed on the nav and loved the exhaust.

 

[carymccarr]

Reconfirmed dual transfer case/ 4H/L this am on the Navi


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[Mac Attack]

Thanks @carymccarr for asking about the headrest adjustability, but I have the seats adjusted like @Deadman and it's still annoying. For longer drives I have a blue beanbag neck pillow for plane trips that I can wrap below the headrest. It cushions my neck and I figure it won't impact the headrest function in the event of a collision.

Funny you mention about the exhaust. It's only loud the first minute after startup, but I can see how that wouldn't allow you to leave the home discreetly. I think on the Raptor forum they are talking about using the quieter Lincoln center muffler to tame their exhaust noise down. Yes, it's another curious choice Lincoln engineers made for a luxury vehicle, but I'm sure it has to do with cold start emissions yet keeping a free flow design for that power... and other cost/design constraints.

 

[carymccarr]

Thanks @carymccarr for asking about the headrest adjustability, but I have the seats adjusted like @Deadman and it's still annoying. For longer drives I have a blue beanbag neck pillow for plane trips that I can wrap below the headrest. It cushions my neck and I figure it won't impact the headrest function in the event of a collision.

Funny you mention about the exhaust. It's only loud the first minute after startup, but I can see how that wouldn't allow you to leave the home discreetly. I think on the Raptor forum they are talking about using the quieter Lincoln center muffler to tame their exhaust noise down. Yes, it's another curious choice Lincoln engineers made for a luxury vehicle, but I'm sure it has to do with cold start emissions yet keeping a free flow design for that power... and other cost/design constraints.

I was in my Navi this am and had to almost painfully crane my neck backwards to even touch the headrest. Must just be how we all have the seats setup differently.

The x7’s headrest seems really far forward to me by comparison.



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[Mac Attack]

To get my ~6300 lb vehicle to do the 1/4 mile in 12.5 seconds, it's got to be around 550+ crank HP. I'm good with the balance of power and exhaust noise the engineers did. It's extremely difficult to make a turbo v6 sound pleasing in my opinion and the best you can do is just muffle it and still flow well.

Some company makes an exhaust cutout for the Raptor that goes between the v6 bank exhaust pipes upstream of the muffler if you're looking for more noise.

 

[carymccarr]

To get my ~6300 lb vehicle to do the 1/4 mile in 12.5 seconds, it's got to be around 550+ crank HP. I'm good with the balance of power and exhaust noise the engineers did. It's extremely difficult to make a turbo v6 sound pleasing in my opinion and the best you can do is just muffle it and still flow well.

Some company makes an exhaust cutout for the Raptor that goes between the v6 bank exhaust pipes upstream of the muffler if you're looking for more noise.

Agreed. It’s why I live with the quiet and haven’t gone aftermarket exhaust. Accentuating a turbo 6 doesn’t create an ideal sound IMO


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[Mac Attack]

Agreed. It’s why I live with the quiet and haven’t gone aftermarket exhaust. Accentuating a turbo 6 doesn’t create an ideal sound IMO


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Videos may not be completely realistic, but here is an option if interested
https://www.fordraptorforum.com/threads/velocity-ap-valvetronic-exhaust.76095/

I haven't compared the exhaust layouts between the two,, but it might ve adaptable for the Lincoln.. Interesting to note he thought there was a loss of power with it open. Probably needs a custom tune for that scenario to take advantage of the cutout.

Sorry for going off-topic.....

 

[NyackRob79]

Get a tune for the expy and then you can smoke the navigator

And in doing so, void your powertrain and drivetrain warranty for those few seconds of extra thrill. Great advice.

 

[TheDoug]

And in doing so, void your powertrain and drivetrain warranty for those few seconds of extra thrill. Great advice.

The factory warranty issue is a concern... the voiding of it has been debated endlessly so I will not get into that but it's also why I purchased an additional warranty with my tune.

 

[Mac Attack]

I do use some Expedition parts on my Navigator....

There's no mudflaps available, and the running boards and rocker panels were getting beat up, so I modified Weathertech flaps to fit.

The fronts just took some minor grinding with a dremel, while the rears were a bit more involved. I think I drilled some holes in the felt-like wheel liners and used some bolts for additional reinforcement. Also, you can see from the rear of the mudflaps that there is a recess for the Expedition bodywork that the Navigator doesn't have. 99% of folks probably wouldn't notice it until you point it out. I also trimmed about 1.5 inches off the rear mudflaps to match the front height. There was a lot of dremeling done to the rears too, but I don't exactly remember - It was a year ago....

 

[dlcorbett]

Thanks. Interesting comparison @Deadman


I was curious about how the Ford B&O stereo compared to the Revel, as I think the Revel lacks low bass. Otherwise, volume, clarity and imaging is awesome for the Revel.

I never got to test a nav with the revel2 set up. The base revel has great clarity, but I actually liked the b&o more in the expy because the revel 1 has no power lacks bass as well. Turning it to 20 was less than 13 on the expy. But I still think the expy b&o is one of the better sound systems I've heard so what do I know lol.

 

[Deadman]

Thanks @carymccarr for asking about the headrest adjustability, but I have the seats adjusted like @Deadman and it's still annoying. For longer drives I have a blue beanbag neck pillow for plane trips that I can wrap below the headrest. It cushions my neck and I figure it won't impact the headrest function in the event of a collision.

Funny you mention about the exhaust. It's only loud the first minute after startup, but I can see how that wouldn't allow you to leave the home discreetly. I think on the Raptor forum they are talking about using the quieter Lincoln center muffler to tame their exhaust noise down. Yes, it's another curious choice Lincoln engineers made for a luxury vehicle, but I'm sure it has to do with cold start emissions yet keeping a free flow design for that power... and other cost/design constraints.

Exactly, on start up, it barks. I'm not a V6 guy, so hearing ANY of that barf sound makes me angry! lol. I've got the muffler s hacked off most all of my other V8's, but I sure hate the gross sound that ecoboost makes. I just want it silent and not advertise that its a baby V6! lol. Its still at least 5X louder than my expedition on start up. My expedition starts up quietly, this thing just snarls. Not the end of the world, but when you sit in the back seat, you can actually hear the racket from the main muffler thru the floor when you are on the pedal. I'm used to hearing the noise from the tailpipe, not thru the muffler casing itself into the cabin.

 

[Deadman]

I was in my Navi this am and had to almost painfully crane my neck backwards to even touch the headrest. Must just be how we all have the seats setup differently.

The x7’s headrest seems really far forward to me by comparison.



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For what its worth, I have a long neck..... Might affect the headrest situation as well.

 

[Deadman]

I never got to test a nav with the revel2 set up. The base revel has great clarity, but I actually liked the b&o more in the expy because the revel 1 has no power lacks bass as well. Turning it to 20 was less than 13 on the expy. But I still think the expy b&o is one of the better sound systems I've heard so what do I know lol.

I am used to the B&O in my Expedition, so I don't notice any real sound difference going to the Lincoln, but It's very possibly better and I didn't really pay attention......