Capless Gas Tank logic

[NyackRob79]

Can someone explain to me what intern at the FoMoCo was given the task of designing the capless gas tank, and the ingenious end result it produced?

I'm unable to dispense anything into it without spilling it over. Tried adding octane booster today (I'm tuned), and the bottle got lodged inside while the contents fully spilled out. Same goes for any other fuel additive. Be prepared to get it all over your leg and side of your truck, because there is some sort of a flap.

My second issue is with wintertime driving. When I get a car wash (or water otherwise gets trapped behind the gas tank cover), it freezes the gas flap, making it difficult to open from the outside. Nothing short of banging on it at the pump will get it unstuck.

Sorry guys, just venting at the utter idiocy employed by FoMoCo at some of their "features".

Why fix a good old gas cap when it was never broken?

 

[KDisMe]

The capless gas tank works pretty well for fueling. I think it's much better than having to hang the cap somewhere or slide it in a receptacle on the fuel door to prevent gas from dripping off it and landing on my paint.
There's a funnel by your spare tire that will let you do what you're trying to do with the additive. I know it's not the most convenient place but it's there and it works. Maybe leave it out if you're having to add octane boost regularly for the tune?

 

[NyackRob79]

Hmm, interesting. Thanks for that tip. The spare is hanging off the underbody. Will look into manual to see where it's located exactly.

 

[duneslider]

I think he meant the funnel is inside under the floor by the jack and that stuff. Yellow funnel. Most car companies don't want you using additives, so I suspect they aren't trying to design the filler opening around using additives. I haven't read that in the expedition manual but it has said it in my dodge and jeep manuals.

I have had lots of different fuel doors get stuck...will have to see what happens when it gets cold on the expedition. Haven't had freezing temps yet.

 

[CHRIS JAMES]

yeah, just use the funnel. it's in the back where the jack is.

 

[16plati]

Owners manual states don’t add an additives to the fuel. Doesn’t mater if you’re tuned or not. Either run the highest octane at your pump or mix ethanol. Problem solved

 

[Adieu]

Great for clean and fuss-free fueling, doesn't frequently produce check engine light events like a cap

Also makes putting random additives in a PITA (and recquires some rudimentary research to figure out), which is probably a welcome bonus as far as the warranty service accountants are concerned.

 

[Deadman]

I have a spare funnel in my garage. I often can't find "good" fuel locally, so I often end up buying 6 gallon cans of it out of town when I go somewhere and then I dump it in later on. Works flawless with Ford's funnel!

 

[Flexpedition]

GM, Honda, Toyota, Chrysler and others are evidently looking to annoy 0.006% of their customers as well.

 

[Wayne Decker]

I don't know why the gas filler cover doesn't lock. Other than it's flimsy plastic and easy to break open.

 

[Gumby]

If you are going to the car wash in the winter, take an extra 5 minutes and use the high pressure air spray to blow out the excess water from the door seals and gas cap area. I also use it on the side view mirrors. I always a wand wash. Unless you are using an automatic car wash then...meh

 

[lobsenza]

I don't know why the gas filler cover doesn't lock. Other than it's flimsy plastic and easy to break open.

The door on my Navigator locks with the door locks. If your vehicle is locked, the fuel door is locked.

 

[Neil T Casey]

@gordonf238

You should actually get a kick out of this....

When I was a co-op working on designing/testing capless fillernecks...

We had to add all kinds of valves, roll over, grade vent, fill vent, spill canisters, sender unit shut offs, etc etc to the filler neck and in tank for safety regulations that removing the cap was a logical step for reducing weight of a system that just got 7-10 lbs of new parts added to it. Ford also spun it as a cleanliness improvement so you didn't have to get your hands dirty and save time.

And yes one of the annoyances is you cant add gas with a gas can or additives without using a long neck funnel/fill tool but that most likely is the exception today.

 

[Shutterbug57]

The door on my Navigator locks with the door locks. If your vehicle is locked, the fuel door is locked.

Not on my ‘19 Limited.

 

[Bill Schell]

Weight savings = >mpg (LOL). I suspect many makes/models will go the way of gas-capless. Bad news for the gas cap factories. Honestly, it is kind if convenient not having to remember replacing the cap. The frozen fuel access door sounds like a real issue and a PITA. Rather than just a spring push open/close latch, I'd have preferred an inside the truck release lever... but that's more weight and weight is bad.

If/when gas prices soar again, and gas siphoning theft becomes all the rage, the new design appears to be very vulnerable. Maybe that intern was once a gas thief?

 

[HawkX66]

If/when gas prices soar again, and gas siphoning theft becomes all the rage, the new design appears to be very vulnerable. Maybe that intern was once a gas thief?

I bet you'd have a hell of a time trying to syphon the gas out of a newer Expy. The pukes punch holes in the bottom of the tank and drain it now...
I like it being capless. Unless you're driving a diesel, fuel additives are for fixing something that's not broken or is the result of something else that's broken usually...

 

[Flexpedition]

@gordonf238

You should actually get a kick out of this....

When I was a co-op working on designing/testing capless fillernecks...

Thats pretty cool. Do you work with Dupont or Martinrea Industries?
https://www.dupont.com/industries/automotive/fuel-systems/case-studies/capless-fuel-filler.html

Link highlights the benefits already discussed here, but also implies it'll keep a diesel nozzle out.

The same link says Ford installed it in 2008 vehicles, including Expedition? Huh?

 

[Wayne Decker]

Not on my ‘19 Limited.

Nor on my '19 Platinum

 

[Neil T Casey]

@Flexpedition

No we were a company that ended up selling the fuels business to Eaton around 2007 if I remember correctly. Well diesel nozzles are a different diameter I believe which already kept them out and if I remember correctly even filler necks with caps had a little flapper that the nozzle had to push through which would reduce the ability to really get the nozzle down in the filler neck. But again im just going off memory I haven't really looked at those much lately.

I know they started rolling them out around 2008 but I dont know or remember what the timing was for every vehicle, we worked with the mustang, escape, ford 500/Taurus and freestyle/Taurus x that I was around for. We did some prototypes for the viper but sadly never got the business for it.

We also were doing a lot of testing with plastic gas tanks vs traditional metal. They were for weight savings and leak/rust improvement in crashes and over the life of the vehicle. We were trying to reduce the fuel loss from having the sender unit on one side of the hump and gas stuck on the other side for the mustang in heavy acceleration/cornering scenarios once all these valves were added. It was pretty cool stuff. At that time we were prototyping a bunch of things and I was able to hand build brackets for these trial tanks and valves and stuff. That was for the first models of the 2005?ish retro stangs which as a college kid was a really cool program to be working on.

One of the changes from old systems to the new ones were that they had spill/vent canisters which were basically vents off of the fill neck. It pretty much rendered giving the tank more fuel after the first click useless because all of that fuel would go into these canisters to evaporate off vs spilling onto the ground. Because they were lower on the fill neck, they were just above where the gas would be to make the nozzle shut off. Which meant all the "extra" gas to top it off is just being wasted in those evap canisters.

https://www.eaton.com/Eaton/OurCompany/NewsEvents/NewsReleases/CT_123945

https://www.eaton.com/Eaton/Product...ons-Control/fuel-vapor-vales/index.htm#tabs-3

 

[cosauto]

Wow! I think the cap less fuel tank is great. READ your owners manual! Use the funnel provided , Its works great.
I've never had a gas filler cap freeze. but then I don't run my cars through the car wash when its below freezing. Duh!
Matter of fact I hand wash them. Above freezing