2003 EB stalling, 2wd, 5.4 - nightmare

[Hamfisted]

They're integral to the alternator. A new Motorcraft 130 amp one is only $145 at Rock Auto though.


https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog...411119,electrical,alternator+/+generator,2412

 

[1955moose]

2002 was the last year of a replaceable voltage regulator. Your stalling problem is not your alternator though. If it were, you'd see the charge needle drop, and you wouldn't be able to start back up so easily. I'd look into the fuel pump relay connection. If the solder is weak on the relay, it can and will cause your problem. Always kills me how Ford and other manufacturer take a great fuse box design and screw it up. The only biggie was the sealing of windshield from Ford, on the first edition. Apparently, they used a mini 10amp relay for the fuel pump, instead of a heavy 30 amp one like 97-02 did. Well as the saying goes, it's always something!

Sent from my N9131 using Tapatalk

 

[RichardH]

You guys are going to laugh and cringe at the same time. I just got off the phone with my service adviser.

He said, Rich, I'll be brutally honest with you. When they did the alternator harness rebuild the other week, they didn't tighten a nut for a connection. It came down to a loose nut. At a dealership. Alternator is fine, it came down to tightening a very simple nut. It was only hand tightened and lost connection.



This deserves 2 emojies....

Blew another $30 on Lyft for two rides.

Thank you all for the feedback on repair. I'm still going to look into the PCB as mentioned before...

 

[Hamfisted]

Really ? That's about par for a dealership repair these days ....

 

[RichardH]

Really ? That's about par for a dealership repair these days ....

No joke, but I smell something fishy maybe.

If it was a loose nut, why wasn't it ready today? They said tomorrow about 3pm. Does not compute. They must have screwed up on something else. I did gripe about the inline fuse without the cover. Maybe they are replacing that too.

I better get a free car wash and vacuum out of it.

If you think the dealer was bad, I won't bore you yet with the three stories of the other three shops I used to try and cure this. Yet.

I'll get my car out of the dealer tomorrow and report back.

Only explanation I can fathom is he did say they want to take for an extended test drive and I gave the nod, over the phone. Drive it all day. Fix it darn it.

 

[RichardH]

OK, the saga continues. Truck stalled on me several times within span of 15 minutes. Odd, CEL is on but the scan says P1000, more driving needed or something like that. CEL is on.

I have driven at least 200 miles since I got truck back from the dealer so it should be reading codes.

I'll chew them out tomorrow morning. This is getting crazy.

Third time to service for the same problem.

 

[riphip]

Feel for you, glad I've not had any of your problems. Really like my 2004EB

 

[RichardH]

Feel for you, glad I've not had any of your problems. Really like my 2004EB

Thanks.

I came up with this great idea to have them give me one of their used cars as a loaner. Service Mgr. said the GM would never go for that.

He did say they will reimburse me for my rental car. Only good thing coming from that dealer so far. And they didn't wash it the other day, lol.

I met with the Service Manger and their Master Mechanic/Foreman for about half hour describing my experience there and the symptoms of the stalling. Service Mgr. expressed he had a much better understanding of the issue now.

Let's see if they can do what a Ford Dealer service department should do - fix it right.

BTW, I also do really like my 2003 EB, 2wd, w/ LSD. It is great on the freeway. Nice 5.4 too.

They have to fix this stalling and I'll be happy as a clam under three feet of water at high tide...

 

[RichardH]

I forgot to mention that they said my truck had a mix of two variants of the this year model build. What does that have to do with it? I have no idea. They were saying there should be some fuse in the junction box (I forgot the position #), but it wasn't there - so it's a Frankenstein factory build. That's really weird. It's in between two builds.

I'm glad I went in armed with some knowledge about these trucks and these types of problems, and thanks for the input.

It's got 146k miles so it made it this far, no reason it shouldn't go further for several years.

 

[Plati]

I forgot to mention that they said my truck had a mix of two variants of the this year model build. What does that have to do with it? I have no idea. They were saying there should be some fuse in the junction box (I forgot the position #), but it wasn't there - so it's a Frankenstein factory build. That's really weird. It's in between two builds.

I'm glad I went in armed with some knowledge about these trucks and these types of problems, and thanks for the input.

It's got 146k miles so it made it this far, no reason it shouldn't go further for several years.

I think what they meant is the fuse box (or whatever its called) by passenger footwell. I'm no expert (by a longshot) but I recall reading many times that there were two different assemblies during the year and you have to get the right one. Bdrk knew but he's not around to clarify anymore. RIP

If you searched the Forum you would find the answer to this. Lots of info about that on this Forum. Unless I'm off track wrong which is possible or likely.

 

[RichardH]

I think what they meant is the fuse box (or whatever its called) by passenger footwell. I'm no expert (by a longshot) but I recall reading many times that there were two different assemblies during the year and you have to get the right one. Bdrk knew but he's not around to clarify anymore. RIP

If you searched the Forum you would find the answer to this. Lots of info about that on this Forum. Unless I'm off track wrong which is possible or likely.

Thank you MrSticker.

I was writing it exactly as the dealer described it.

I've done a ton of research on this, trying to find a cure. It's been crazy.

I won't rush them. I want the truck fixed right, and they said they would pay for my rental, so let them do what they do, fix trucks. I have a Chevy Malibu as rental, it works. Nice infotainment system.

I'll also do a search as you mentioned.

Thanks

 

[stamp11127]

The box in question is called the "smart junction box". When Ford has an electrical change during a production run it is noted on the wiring diagrams as "early or late production".

A few members have repaired their sjb for about $35, others have bought a new box for about 10x that.

 

[RichardH]

The box in question is called the "smart junction box". When Ford has an electrical change during a production run it is noted on the wiring diagrams as "early or late production".

A few members have repaired their sjb for about $35, others have bought a new box for about 10x that.

You are exactly correct. He did refer to it as a smart junction box. I looked at the Ford OEM part site last night, new box, either $515, or $550 ish, two versions I have no problem with either. I just need these knuckleheads to get the dang truck running.

Lol. They are paying for my rental, so I will wait for their call, not vice versa.

 

[RichardH]

This is weird.

Picked the truck up this morning from the dealer. Nice thing is they paid for my rental. If it happens again I guarantee they will do it again.

They claim the new EGR pressure sensor I installed was faulty. From everything I read, P0401 - not as good mileage and maybe rough running - I had neither., so I never suspected EGR as the problem. I always thought it was electrical related. Dealer on first two visits never recommended changing to quell the stall, so I didn't have them repair EGR issue.

I met with the Service Director and the Shop Foreman/Master Mechanic on the 3rd visit for the same problem. Mechanic said, yes, a faulty EGR part can cause stalling. So they repaired it. Well I guess we were both correct. It seems the pressure sensor - EGR and electrical related, was causing the stalling.

I instructed them to idle it for an hour (it used to stall even when idling) and drive as long as they could.

So far so good.

 

[ray young]

Richard, did you ever get this resolved?

 

[RichardH]

Richard, did you ever get this resolved?

Yes Sir,

After changing all battery/alternator cables, dealer telling me the stalling was caused by a loose nut (prob a joke in there somewhere), it did turn out the stalling, as far as I can tell, was caused by the P0401, EGR recirculation according to them. I had a P0401 code I drove on for while with no issues in my '01, so I did not think anything of it.

I had already replaced pressure sensor with an Autozone part, but it was faulty.

So now, no more fault codes, no more stalling.

So after new COP, EGR valve, two hoses, 2nd egr pressure sensor, other likely non-related parts: neutral safety switch, (I did hit some higher water than recommended driving through during Imelda storm in TX), truck is fine.

I have no problem spending the dealer $$ for now, but wish it could have been nipped in the bud earlier on with the indy shops.

Again, I'm OK spending money at the dealer to make the truck reliable. Jeez though, almost $500 for pressure sensor - two bolts, connector and two hoses. Took me all of 6 minutes while drinking a beer to replace. I think while giving a cat call to a gal walking by.

Again, I did not realize EGR pressure sensor could cause these stalling problems, I guess it was a fatal ST, LT fuel trim issue.

Truck is running like a champ - thanks for asking.

Maybe the one out take from this is to consider Motorcraft parts but that still is not a guarantee.

Oddly, and unlikely, I used Seafoam a few weeks before this problem. Wonder if that promoted the problem. I've heard good things about the product but have suspended using it.

 

[ray young]

thanks, i have the same code but my ERG pressure sensor is newish, 6 months, dorman think its time to find a Motorcraft part

Thanks for the update

 

[RichardH]

thanks, i have the same code but my ERG pressure sensor is newish, 6 months, dorman think its time to find a Motorcraft part

Thanks for the update

Don't know your year model, but a hundred 'ish. My EGR pressure sensor was about $130, my cost at dealer. Plus labor of course.

 

[EliteFord]

Yes, when that fuel pump relay stops working, the engine dies with the loss of fuel pressure. Pull the top right relay ( PCM 203 ) and inspect it for signs of melted plastic, on the relay and on the socket itself. If you can, take a flashlight and see if you can read the part number on the actual fuel pump micro relay there buried in the middle of the fuse box. You might be able to read it through the gap there ( use your camera to take a close up picture of it, then read from the picture...). The upgraded fuel pump relay should be a Omron G8QN part number. The original fuel pump micro relays were part number F8VF and were the culprits of most of the early fuse box problems. Do you have a fuel pressure gauge kit ? If you do, take a reading of what your fuel pump is putting out at the fuel rail now. You should see 45-55 psi on a healthy fuel pump.

Hi, so what would the best order to go in?
1. replace fuel pump relay
2. replace fuel modulator
3. replace fuel pump

? thanks.

 

[RichardH]

Hi, so what would the best order to go in?
1. replace fuel pump relay
2. replace fuel modulator
3. replace fuel pump

? thanks.

I'll admit not the best advice, but I did also replace the SJB, smart junction box with a used one - kick panel on passenger side for way too much at indy shop. Could be a newer one, not sure.

I'll need to replace one day with the newer one mentioned here before if not so.

I also did hear a buzzing at the SMJ box a couple weeks, a month or so before the symptoms became worse.

I found an upgraded OEM box online for about $350. Small price to pay vs tow, inconvenience.