2004 5.4L - Have I ruined my transmission?

[amish_electrician]

I have a 2004 5.4L Eddie Bauer. About a month ago, my wife was driving and lost 3rd and 4th gears. I did some research and thought that I had narrowed the issue to a problem in the valve body. So... about 3 weeks ago, I dropped the pan, drained the fluid and removed the valve body for inspection. Everything checked out, so I did some more research and now I believe that I'm dealing with a broken direct clutch drum. So the transmission has to come out. With this is mind, I left the valve body on my work bench and reinstalled the pan/gasket, holding it loosely in place with three screws. That brings me to my question...

A co-worker and I were discussing the situation and he informed me that I've essentially ruined my transmission. His reasoning went like this... Since I drained all the fluid and only re-secured the pan loosely, I've exposed the internals to the atmosphere. He claims that air will leak around the gasket and into the transmission and moisture in that air will condense on the parts and cause rust. The fact that it's been 3 weeks with no fluid to protect the parts, he asserts that I'd have to replace everything due to the rust/oxidation.

I've never worked on a transmission before this one, so I'm not sure if he's right or not. Does anyone have any experience or input that they can share?

 

[stamp11127]

Ask him this, since the transmission operates between hot and cold cycles with atmospheric air inside of it, what happens to the condensation inside when it cools off?

Water on exposed parts - just like in your case. Also they are vented to the atmosphere to allow for fluid expansion without blowing seals and gaskets. When they are cooling off moisture is pulled into the internals. So why doesn't it rust under normal conditions?

FYI - you'll need a good torque wrench when tighening the valve body bolts. It only takes a few inch/lbs of error to distort the vb and lock spool valves if they are used.

 

[Trainmaster]

No, you didn't ruin anything. But it does sound that thst unit has to come out.

 

[1955moose]

Sounds like you've got to stop listening to co-workers. If I listened to all the bad info I received over the years, I wouldn't have done half the repair work I've done. The worst is from Dealerships mechanics. Their good at what they do, but are like horse's with blinders on, they only look straight ahead, never left/right. If asked advice about a different make or vehicle, they don't know. Next time you need advice, ask here, not there! Our guys work on the same vehicles, day in, day out, does your co-worker?

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[TobyU]

I have a 2004 5.4L Eddie Bauer. About a month ago, my wife was driving and lost 3rd and 4th gears. I did some research and thought that I had narrowed the issue to a problem in the valve body. So... about 3 weeks ago, I dropped the pan, drained the fluid and removed the valve body for inspection. Everything checked out, so I did some more research and now I believe that I'm dealing with a broken direct clutch drum. So the transmission has to come out. With this is mind, I left the valve body on my work bench and reinstalled the pan/gasket, holding it loosely in place with three screws. That brings me to my question...

A co-worker and I were discussing the situation and he informed me that I've essentially ruined my transmission. His reasoning went like this... Since I drained all the fluid and only re-secured the pan loosely, I've exposed the internals to the atmosphere. He claims that air will leak around the gasket and into the transmission and moisture in that air will condense on the parts and cause rust. The fact that it's been 3 weeks with no fluid to protect the parts, he asserts that I'd have to replace everything due to the rust/oxidation.

I've never worked on a transmission before this one, so I'm not sure if he's right or not. Does anyone have any experience or input that they can share?

He's full of crap.

 

[TobyU]

Sounds like you've got to stop listening to co-workers. If I listened to all the bad info I received over the years, I wouldn't have done half the repair work I've done. The worst is from Dealerships mechanics. Their good at what they do, but are like horse's with blinders on, they only look straight ahead, never left/right. If asked advice about a different make or vehicle, they don't know. Next time you need advice, ask here, not there! Our guys work on the same vehicles, day in, day out, does your co-worker?

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This is so true about dealers. I am just a backyard mechanic who's never worked for a garage in my life and I used to have a GM Tech who could rebuild the internals of GM automatic transmissions call me for a drivability issue on a Ford.
I also never let the chance go by to remind people who want to take their vehicles to the dealers that the work performed is only as good as the monkey working there that week.

 

[amish_electrician]

Thanks for the responses! I figured he was full of it... but wanted to confirm. Going to order a rebuild kit and start pulling everything apart next weekend.

 

[1955moose]

Better to plunk down $500.00 or so in parts, and have a fully rebuilt Transmission. Most of what you pay for in any repair is labor. Pay yourself $1,000.00 when done, and take the wife and kids on a little vacation. You'll earn it when your done.

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[TobyU]

Better to plunk down $500.00 or so in parts, and have a fully rebuilt Transmission. Most of what you pay for in any repair is labor. Pay yourself $1,000.00 when done, and take the wife and kids on a little vacation. You'll earn it when your done.

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Yes, it's one of the biggest ripoffs there is. Body shops are also ridiculously overpriced for the amount of materials that go in. These two make actual Auto Repair dealerships look fairly cheap with just the price of the labor.
The average transmission rebuild for years can be done for 200-$300 worth of parts when it's just the most common rebuild or slipping burned up clutch packs but yet they'll charge you 1400 to 2000 and start their rationalization process.

 

[1955moose]

Back in the day when rebuild kits were available for anything on your car/truck, you could pop in a set of carbon brushes, or diodes and have your alternator or starter like new again. Clutch packs and bands are the usual go to repair on Automatics. That and pop in a new or remanned torque converter, and your done. Got to buy or borrow a few special tools, but it's not that tough. If the boneheads at the tranny shops can do it, should be a walk in the park for anyone with half a brain!

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[the bus]

Your fine,.. it was all coated in trans fluid. It was never 'dry' and degreased. Just keep plugging away.

 

[rjdelp7]

My local trans/repair shop, has a 'cut-a-way' Powerglide on display, in the waiting room. You can see the inside and has no fluid. It is not rusted. I never heard of 'do it yourself' transmission rebuilding. Most mechanics, won't even mess with them. Special tools and training/experience is needed. The rebuild kit is not cheap. The 3 options are usually Professional rebuild, buy a new one or swap with one from a donor car. There are plenty of 4r100 in Ford trucks and vans. Good luck.

 

[1955moose]

And that's why shops take advantage. A lot of our members here can tear down and rebuild a 4r100 or 6r75/80. It's just pulling apart case, replacing plates, and keeping track of where things go back. In this day and age of camera phones, and internet. It's not that tough. You'll need some snap ring pliers, and maybe a compression tool or 2. Make friends with the guy at tranny shop, he might let you borrow his. My buddy Danny does that all the time he's doing a new job. This forums all about encouraging others to jump in and do the job themselves. Most parts in a transmission only go back in one way. You do need a clean work bench, or a big cart. Other than that, a willing to do the job. Paying $2500.00 on up, here in Bay Area that number is $3500.00 on up for a crappy rebuild job, is foolish to me. But what do I know.

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[stamp11127]

Valve bodies are intimidating to most people - all those squiggly passages. Add hydraulics to the mix and they are baffled.
My second job during high school was R & R transmissions. That is where I found how relaxing parts washing can be.....

 

[BlackCoffee]

I just got finished with a tranny rebuild. No, you didn't ruin the transmission. There are some excellent videos on rebuilding the 4R70W online and if you do it yourself, you can get away with under $1000 to include a new torque converter. You need a lift and transmission jack, find a friend with a good garage. Check out the videos by transmissionbench.com. They are excellent.

 

[tibwd]

If you are doing a rebuild/refresh of your transmission, you should also look into SONNAX upgrades and parts for your job. For reasonable prices, their kits and upgrades will enhance performance and reliability over the factory or oem bits. Definitely worth checking out .... good luck

 

[1955moose]

Stamp, the hardest part for me in my transmission class in school, was not so much the taking apart/putting all back, but describing the theory of vortex flow, and all the other junk, to the teacher. For our members here that don't want to [emoji205] around with small springs and ball bearings in the valve body, they can buy that part remanned. Problem is you've got to hope the guy rebuilding it, didn't get distracted, or have a small part go ka pling across the shop.

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[stamp11127]

"All the other junk" is how I get my entertainment with the crop of millennials that sign up for my intro class. If you don't fully understand how something works you are no more than a parts ******.

Did you know you can connect a relay the wrong way and it turns into a buzzer? The look on their faces is priceless when it happens. And the great amount of help I give them is "no buzzers in this lab, find it & fix it".

 

[1955moose]

You can pretend their on a game show, your the host, and the buzzer went off because they didn't answer in the form of a question in time! You'd be like Pat Sajak. If you could get an assistant that looked like Vanna White, your class would be booked solid for 3 years straight.

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