HELP! Aftermarket Amps/Speakers in 2017 Exp with 6 Speaker Sync

[charles davis]

First let me say I have looked all over. I have the basic Sync, small display, 6 speaker system in my 2017 Exp XLT. Sonic only has an interface for the Sony system and Crutchfield has nothing really for this year model.

I want to put my aftermarket speakers/amp and sub amp/subwoofer from my previous car in my Exp. My Double din unit won't seem to work so just amps and speakers. I have all Alpine Type R speakers (a set of component speakers and a set of coaxial 2 ways) and a couple Alpine amps (sub and 4 channel)

I'm not spending $2k plus on an aftermarket head unit (There are really no other choices for our vehicles that I have found) so I'm going to install with factory head unit unless one of you have better information.

I don't think I have an amp in this factory unit. Can anyone confirm this?

I also want to keep it clean sounding and I've read that some of the PAC components introduce "noise" to the signal.

Can someone please provide me with some guidance and experience?

Thanks

 

[MBohn]

Im not entirely sure if your model has an amp or not. I have a 2015 XLT, but it has MyTouch. Easy to find out though. Open the rear hatch. On the drivers side there is a tray right behind the cupholders for the 3rd row. That tray will pop out if you pull up on it. Mine has an amplifier right under the tray.

 

[Aspen03]

I dont believe the system has an amp. I've yet to work on this particular year and configuration but aside from a factory sub having its amp that should be it.

As far as getting signal to the amps with summing and correct the eq roll off from that factory system look into the AudioControl LC7i.

 

[charles davis]

After much research, there is no Amp with the stock Sync 6 speaker system and I have completed my upgrade. Here is what I installed and some info on what I found.

Stock head unit (Very few options for aftermarket, none under $1k)
AudioControl LC7i
Alpine MRV-F300 4-Channel Amp
Alpine MRV-M500 Mono Amp
Alpine R-Series 6 x 8 Inch 2 way Speakers - Front Doors
Alpine R-Series 6 x 8 Inch 2 way Speakers - Rear Doors
Alpine SWR-12D2 Type-R 12" Sub

First I simply replaced all the speakers. With no Amp, there was not enough power to drive these speakers so it didn't sound great. Better than stock but not by much. It was obvious they were under-powered.

So the install began. I opted for a new challenge and decided to do this myself since the installers close to me were quoting $700 - $950 and the 2 places I tried both canceled my appointments in 1 week. Impatience made this become a weekend project for me.

The 4 Gauge Amp Kit was easy to install. I was able to run the battery cable from the engine bay, down the wheel well (Passenger/Battery side) and use wire covers and zip ties to secure it safely under the frame and up through a plug at the passenger rear door under the interior door molding. Below are some images.

My location options were limited for the LC7i and 2 amps since mt 3rd row seat is always down and very often the back seats are down for carrying bicycles and racing gear around the country and I didn't want them out in the open. What I found was, the 2 Amps fit perfect and had clearance under the center back seat and the LC7i and power distribution blocks went under the drivers side back seat keeping the components all close to each other and the wiring nice and clean.

Now it sounds way better.

 

[Adieu]

I sense beaucoup confusion in this thread

 

[1955moose]

I'm not sure what Alpine R 6x8's you installed, theirs 3 different levels. But most alpines are lower sensitivity, around 88 decibels for 1 watt of power, which is great if your powering them with at least 50 watts per channel. But unfortunately the head units on even the best Ford units from 2000 till now have only about 15 clean watts per channel at best. The 25-35 wpc advertised is not clean power. Your best bet is to find a head unit that will allow for an external amp like Jl audio, or any quality unit of 40 watts x4 or more to power your Alpines. That or pluck out and return them for something more efficient like 91 db or higher speakers, who told you the Alpines would rock out with low power? Their a very nice speaker, but you'll need to soup them up a bit to sound like they should. High current amplifiers sound best, but are a bit pricey. You'll have to decide what works for you. I've done a ton of speaker/amplifier swaps over the years, most were great, some ehh!

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[Black]

@1955moose There is no aftermarket Headunit that can be used in place of the factory system for the 15+ models at the moment.
The issue being Ford was kind enough to integrate the HVAC controls into the audio system.
While the F150 system has been cracked by aftermarket factory integration companies the Expedition has not.
I have spoken with multiple companies and while they get it to work kind of, they loose the ability to control the rear climate control anymore. They don’t have much interest so no one is really throwing any resources at it.

I am going to do a piggy back system to start using an Android Head unit then better speakers an amp and bypass the factory system.
https://www.expeditionforum.com/thr...dashpod-for-an-android-head-unit.38069/page-3

 

[Adieu]

You could still mount a parallel system of some sort for your audio needs

 

[1955moose]

We'll that sucks. I guess you'll need to find the highest efficient speakers, say 93 db and go from there. This is what happens when manufactures do the thinking for us, when designing a vehicle. You might be able to do like we did back in the 70's and put an amp on the speaker wires themselves. Back then most head units didn't have pre out Rca Jack's to run a separate amp. It does unfortunately give you a bit of boomy sound, due to piggybacking on top of the head units built in amp. Do your homework and come up with an answer, it's out there. I'm going to check with some of shops here in San Francisco, see what they say.

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[Black]

Line converters have come a very long way.

 

[charles davis]

Yep, the AudioControl LC7i is an amazing piece of technology. Speaker in/RCA out, Separates the signal for my Sub Amp channel, line level controls for all channels and the speaker wire signal remote turn on feature with remote out to signal my Amps was really cool. No searching for a remote wire fuse box tap to signal everything on. It made life much easier.

Line converters have come a very long way.

 

[Yupster Dog]

Yep, the AudioControl LC7i is an amazing piece of technology. Speaker in/RCA out, Separates the signal for my Sub Amp channel, line level controls for all channels and the speaker wire signal remote turn on feature with remote out to signal my Amps was really cool. No searching for a remote wire fuse box tap to signal everything on. It made life much easier.

I 3rd that I have the same one Charles and it is crystal clear. Just don't anyone buy the cheap LOC you will be disappointed.

 

[hallin222]

I’m working on a similar project for my wife’s truck which sounds nearly identical to yours. Base model short wheelbase 2017 XLT with factory 4” head unit, no amp, no sub, no nav.

I’ve already ordered 4 new Pioneer 6x8s for the doors and agree that we’ll probably need a mini under dash amp like the 4x45 Alpine to drive them, but I’m struggling with what to do about a sub.

My wife isn’t willing to sacrifice cargo area space with a large cubic or wedge box, so I’m thinking of either of the two options:

1: 8” Kicker HideAway under the front driver’s and/or passenger seat(s). I’m open to running two.

2: acquire an OEM sub enclosure for the left rear wheel well area behind the interior panel and populate it with a higher quality aftermarket 8” sub and 150-250W amp.

The 10” JL stealthbox would be a great option, but at $700 (not including amp) it’s hard to justify.

Thoughts?

 

[Yupster Dog]

I’m working on a similar project for my wife’s truck which sounds nearly identical to yours. Base model short wheelbase 2017 XLT with factory 4” head unit, no amp, no sub, no nav.

I’ve already ordered 4 new Pioneer 6x8s for the doors and agree that we’ll probably need a mini under dash amp like the 4x45 Alpine to drive them, but I’m struggling with what to do about a sub.

My wife isn’t willing to sacrifice cargo area space with a large cubic or wedge box, so I’m thinking of either of the two options:

1: 8” Kicker HideAway under the front driver’s and/or passenger seat(s). I’m open to running two.

2: acquire an OEM sub enclosure for the left rear wheel well area behind the interior panel and populate it with a higher quality aftermarket 8” sub and 150-250W amp.

The 10” JL stealthbox would be a great option, but at $700 (not including amp) it’s hard to justify.

Thoughts?

I have a 1st gen EB expy and I also did not want to loose cargo space. the original sub box is plastic and the speaker bolts to the back. the aftermarket box that goes in the stock box position is outrageously priced.
I ended up using Pioneer TS-SWX2502 10 inch Shallow-Mount Pre-Loaded Enclosure.(that and cheap boss amp for $150)
The LOC ​

AudioControl LC2i 2 Channel Line Out Converter with Accubass and Subwoofer Control
(another $100)and the amp I put behind the passengers side panel (where the stock amp was) and ran monster speaker cable out from under the panel. the sub box fits great behind third row and in fact behind the third row is packed with the sub at the bottom and it sounds great.

If I need the space to put big cargo in I just move it. (the monster speaker cable is about 5 foot long)
Way more bass than needed in fact all the gains are below half.​

 

[charles davis]

Yep, sounds exactly like mine.

I understand completely. I use the cargo space all the time hauling bike stuff around the country for races so the cargo space is a commodity on weekends. I ended up using a 12" enclosure that I can take out when I need the space over base. The system I put in sounds decent enough without the sub. I just take it out when I need the extra space then put it back in when I unload bike stuff.

What I found was, under the center back seat (not the 3rd row) is where there is the most protected space for equipment when all the seats are down. The space under the 2 outside seats goes away when they are down.

Front seats - There is limited room but enough to fit one amp
Middle row seats - See above
3rd row seats - No usable space under them

For a Sub you will definitely need a Line Out Converter LC7i and I am really happy with that choice. There is enough room behind the screen in the dash to velcro or zip tie it down there but it might be a little tight. I put mine under the driver side middle row seat since it's so slim and I wanted it close to my Amps under the middle row center seat.

Doors - 6x8s bolt right in. Super easy but you will need to think about what you want to do with the tweeters in the front doors. The crossover for those is on the lower door speakers so they are wired together and if you don't consider this you will lose those like I did. I'm planning to add small crossovers and new tweeters later. You may also want to consider speaker baffles for the doors since that space is open to the inside of the door panel. I used the foam insert type and just trimmed them down to fit.

The biggest PITA was the door panels. I watched a couple YouTube videos and that helped but still a pain.

Wiring up the Line Out Converter was the most time consuming but the whole project took me about 6 hours. I took my time and stopped/started a couple times to watch videos, read manuals.

Also, if you do an Amp/Sub I would recommend a Sub volume control knob for extra control. I put mine right above where my right leg is when I'm driving.

Hope this helps and good luck

I’m working on a similar project for my wife’s truck which sounds nearly identical to yours. Base model short wheelbase 2017 XLT with factory 4” head unit, no amp, no sub, no nav.

I’ve already ordered 4 new Pioneer 6x8s for the doors and agree that we’ll probably need a mini under dash amp like the 4x45 Alpine to drive them, but I’m struggling with what to do about a sub.

My wife isn’t willing to sacrifice cargo area space with a large cubic or wedge box, so I’m thinking of either of the two options:

1: 8” Kicker HideAway under the front driver’s and/or passenger seat(s). I’m open to running two.

2: acquire an OEM sub enclosure for the left rear wheel well area behind the interior panel and populate it with a higher quality aftermarket 8” sub and 150-250W amp.

The 10” JL stealthbox would be a great option, but at $700 (not including amp) it’s hard to justify.

Thoughts?

 

[hallin222]

Charles, I see you’re in Houston. We’re over in Austin also used to race the TMBRA circuit, and other bike & occasional multi sport events before kids. Life’s too busy these days.

Our trucks seriously are nearly identical. Ours is ‘Magnetic’ color, but also has the 3/2 lift, roof basket, 34” rubber (17” Fuel rims), etc. It’s completely transformed it from the common grocery getter.

Thanks for the advice on component placement. That’ll be helpful. There’s really not much space (under seats, etc) for such a big vehicle. I’ve found factory sub enclosures on eBay for about $100 or so, I’m keeping that option open while I converse with my wife about her preferences.

 

[Aspen03]

The alpine power pack is a great choice for these if you aren't going crazy w the door speakers. I'm putting one in along with some kappa 6x8s and retaining the factory sub for now. Theres planety of space up front to conceal it withing having to mount things under the middle row.

From personal experience I'd not invest in the hideaway, it's not even equal to a factory sub setup imo. There are a lot of good choices for shallow mount 8, 10, 12s that would fit behind the 3rd row and if you needed cargo space you could easily remove the box in a few seconds. Install would be far less involved than trying to utilize the a factory location. They wouldn't be much more pricey than the 2 hideaways and have significantly more output and better quality both in sound and durability.

If you are definitely doing a sub and keeping power low to mid range you may want to explore some of the 5-6ch options, theres quite a few amps that would attach under the center 2nd row seat and wiring isnt any more complicated than a powerpack and a sub amp, just have to run some 9 wire which if you're doing an lc7 is basically no extra work just a little extra $.

It's a bit pricey but also consider the AudioControl LC-6.1200 amp. It has the capabilities of the LC7i essentially built in and can support all 4 doors and a sub or two, it's quite flexible and could simplify your install as well as open up a range of configurations for your current or future upgrades. Link to an excellent review of it can do is below. Its long but informative.

I'm considering this amp myself, assuming the wife agrees. She cares less on how something sounds and more how loud it is. One day.....

 

[hallin222]

I pulled the trigger on this, see photo, and am now on the hunt for a shallow (if required?) 8” sub (2ohm?) and mini mono amp, maybe like the Alpine KTA-30MW Power Pack. I’ll probably stuff it with poly fill too.

https://www.crutchfield.com/p_500KTA30MW/Alpine-KTA-30MW-Tough-Power-Pack.html?tp=35834

I’m not even sure if there is factory power and on/off signal wiring in my basic XLT, but if not, I’ll just have to treat this like a traditional amp install, powered from the battery.

I’m no expert on any of this, but I like this direction, as there will be no loss of cargo space and no need to remove/relocate the sub box for 3rd row seating needs and/or large cargo needs. This is a very important factor to my wife. More so than the need for earth shaking thump.

 

[yellow5]

@hallin222 that's a great option for housing a third party sub using the factory location! There are a number of shallow mount options available on Crutchfield and I suspect you have already made your choice!

https://www.crutchfield.com/g_446250/8-Inch-Subwoofers.html?tp=68848#&nvpair=FFTop@mount_Depth|[rank1]Less than 3"&nvpair=FFTop@mount_Depth|[rank2]3 - 3.999"

For anyone reading this thread looking for prebuilt solutions without losing cargo space, you may consider this JL Stealthbox:

http://www.jlaudio.com/product/54216.103634.2096.11075.1164177/Ford_Expedition_EL_'07-'17

It's pricey, but it provides an option with an excellent sub, the JL 10W3v3, that does not require a custom box build.

 

[TC16XLT]

I pulled the trigger on this, see photo, and am now on the hunt for a shallow (if required?) 8” sub (2ohm?) and mini mono amp, maybe like the Alpine KTA-30MW Power Pack. I’ll probably stuff it with poly fill too.

https://www.crutchfield.com/p_500KTA30MW/Alpine-KTA-30MW-Tough-Power-Pack.html?tp=35834

I’m not even sure if there is factory power and on/off signal wiring in my basic XLT, but if not, I’ll just have to treat this like a traditional amp install, powered from the battery.

I’m no expert on any of this, but I like this direction, as there will be no loss of cargo space and no need to remove/relocate the sub box for 3rd row seating needs and/or large cargo needs. This is a very important factor to my wife. More so than the need for earth shaking thump.

View attachment 30104

I did the same thing with the factory sub enclosure. I used a Kicker CWR82 8" in it, but I had to make a ring out of ABS to fit the enclosure to my liking, and to provide support for the lack of the rear bolt through factory sub.

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