Rear Sway bar?

[Alwaysthinkin]

Well, I finally installed the front sway bar with Energy End Links today. Really glad I did the rear bar first, front was a little more intimidating to me for some reason. As I was doing it I was amazed at those of you who were able to do the change without lifting the front end for access. Used my new Rhino Ramps to raise the front end, 4L worked great, just drove right up. Next, I was also amazed at those who could hold that bar up and connect the frame mount bushings! Finally, decided I had to find another way and got out a couple of more jack stands and was able to put the bar on those stands. Raised them as high as I could and voila, worked like a charm. Installed the Energy Suspension End Links and realize I had no idea how tight to go on those. Hoping someone can help me with that. I looked at @5280tunage picture of his install on this thread and believe I may have mine just a couple of turns too tight. My bushings are a little more deformed than his.
Anyway, short drive over bumps and several tight circles later I'm home and calling it quits tonight. Based on feedback on end links I'll wrap it tomorrow. Also, I can see where the frame mount bushings on the front might be a problem. No where near as solid a feel as the mounts on the rear. Curious to hear what @NukeLife hears from Hellwig......

 

[DWs-TTEB]

I torqued my energy suspension front end links to 35 flbs. Have checked them twice since install and they are fine no noise at all from the suspension period.

 

[Alwaysthinkin]

I torqued my energy suspension front end links to 35 flbs. Have checked them twice since install and they are fine no noise at all from the suspension period.

Thank you @DWs-TTEB ! I will torque them to that spec tomorrow.

 

[Chio4]

I have Moog end links front and rear. One of the rear ones need retorquing after my first trail ride. No worries since then. Any new suspension components need a thorough re-check 10 days after installing as they settle in.
The clunking over bumps has started on my front sway bar. Been installed about 3 weeks. I have off-roadbed it twice now.
I had 4WParts check it out and it is definitely the frame mount bushings. I’m disappointed in that. I will see what Hellwig has to say about it.

Yup had the same with my bushings. Totally sucks

 

[NukeLife]

Depending on what Hellwig says, I may try to modify the existing bushing. But the constant rattling is not gonna fly.

 

[techdude99]

The rear bar has been on for a bit and I just put over 100 miles on the front. No rattling so far. If there was rattling, it would drive me nuts, too.

For anyone doing this for the first time, there is no need to put the truck up on ramps to mount the bars. The front bar is heavy and can be awkward to maneuver so just put two large empty laundry containers under it for support. They will crush in a little bit, but that will stabilized the bar.

The OEM end-links looked fine, so they were re-used along with the grease included by Hellwig. I had to turn the wheels from lock to lock to get the torque wrench on the top nuts. There is plenty of grease left over to re-lube the bushings when the noises typically begin after 10-15k miles or sooner depending on surface conditions.

All the bolts were stepped (not required) and torqued (required) to the OEM specs provided by @2019ExpeditionMax

So far, everything is completely quiet.

 

[DWs-TTEB]

Bump

 

[WESIII]

I installed Sumo helpers and both front and rear Hellwig bars, using the stock endlinks. Since then I've driven 4500 miles, including 2500 miles of towing approximately 6500 lbs of travel trailer. I'm glad I did it and highly recommend, especially for anyone who will be towing. The Expy was completely planted and never got pushed around by the trailer. I'd never towed before and the Hellwigs and Sumo helpers made me look like a seasoned camper. Thanks to all the contributors of this thread that lead me to perform this mod!

Towing thread

Can we talk HD Tow one more time?

Holy $#!^^...... :-/

www.expeditionforum.com

 

[buckwheat-phd]

Hey guys, I made a comment on the "Things I'd like to see on the new Expeditions [sic]" thread regarding the inside rear end coming off the ground during an accelerating turn. Geez I hate to add sway bars as it may cause other issues, or maybe defeat engineering efforts already in place for that problem. I don't tow, and mostly use it around town and highway. The war department (in pax seat) yelped the first time it happened.

Post:
Swaybars: I've notice that accelerating around a corner will lift the inside rear almost off the ground. First time it happened I about sh*$#@. I really thought that 1) independent suspension and 2) magnetic shocks/CCD would have fixed that. Maybe it has to be in "sport" mode to make it workable. Hate to sound ignorant, but does the KR have swaybars as standard? I'm too lazy to just go look lol.

 

[Blue87GT]

Looks like Summit might have picked up on the demand...I bought a rear away bar via their website (they had two in stock), and it shipped out today with a delivery date of Saturday!

 

[MHay]

Depending on what Hellwig says, I may try to modify the existing bushing. But the constant rattling is not gonna fly.

I contacted Hellwig about my bushing issue and they sent me a new pair. I’m hoping things work out better this time. I’ll report back after I install them this weekend.

 

[Chio4]

I contacted Hellwig about my bushing issue and they sent me a new pair. I’m hoping things work out better this time. I’ll report back after I install them this weekend.

So far mine are couple months in and doing fine.

 

[Blue87GT]

Looks like Summit might have picked up on the demand...I bought a rear away bar via their website (they had two in stock), and it shipped out today with a delivery date of Saturday!

BTW, it showed up at my house in three days-box in tact!

 

[Going_Going_Gone]

Blue87GT
Ya gotta rub it in, don't ya? Yours is the exact opposite of my experience with Summit and I'm still waiting for my sway bars from a much smaller vendor.

 

[buckwheat-phd]

I wonder about this. Only driving my expi for a few short months, I've come to notice it's just sprung WAY to tightly. Assuming it's inherited the F150s suspension, which would explain why inside rear lifts off ground during slow speed tight turns. True, a sway bar may keep both rears on the ground. But not only are springs too stiff, it's basically an unbalanced vehicle with a front loaded distribution anyway like most cars.

I was always hoping the magnetic suspension would catch a lot of this over extension but so much for that. So if the ccs doesn't have the authority, and it was missed/ignored in engineering, I'm basically screwed with this driving flaw. Wouldn't it be easier to correct (via magnetics) a heavy load vs an oversprung normal light load?

I could always add about 700lbs of dead weight in the rear

 

[mwl001]

I wonder about this. Only driving my expi for a few short months, I've come to notice it's just sprung WAY to tightly. Assuming it's inherited the F150s suspension, which would explain why inside rear lifts off ground during slow speed tight turns. True, a sway bar may keep both rears on the ground. But not only are springs too stiff, it's basically an unbalanced vehicle with a front loaded distribution anyway like most cars.

I was always hoping the magnetic suspension would catch a lot of this over extension but so much for that. So if the ccs doesn't have the authority, and it was missed/ignored in engineering, I'm basically screwed with this driving flaw. Wouldn't it be easier to correct (via magnetics) a heavy load vs an oversprung normal light load?

I could always add about 700lbs of dead weight in the rear

Have you been to a scale? Empty Expedition should be close to 50/50 F/R.

 

[buckwheat-phd]

Have you been to a scale? Empty Expedition should be close to 50/50 F/R. View attachment 69716

This is excellent news, and disputes what a mechanic told me at the shop. But he may have been right about the heavy springs used in the expy/F150, causing it to bounce during light loads (fully extended struts). If he's right, I wonder why the ccs can't keep it stable?

 

[Deadman]

This is excellent news, and disputes what a mechanic told me at the shop. But he may have been right about the heavy springs used in the expy/F150, causing it to bounce during light loads (fully extended struts). If he's right, I wonder why the ccs can't keep it stable?

Its not from heavy springs, its from poor shock rebound valving. The shocks control the vehicles motion after a bump. The spring is,ply supports the weight of the vehicle. These vehicles squat a LOT with any trailer weight added to the rear, so I believe the factory springs are butter soft in my opinion. Thats also why it allows it to bobble so much, there's no support from the soft springs. A stiffer sway bar stiffens the overall spring rate because it allows the springs to borrow spring rate from the other side.

 

[buckwheat-phd]

Have you been to a scale? Empty Expedition should be close to 50/50 F/R. View attachment 69716

MW - is that table the total allowable weights for towing, or maybe recommended balance? Is the Expy really a 6200lb truck empty?

 

[buckwheat-phd]

Its not from heavy springs, its from poor shock rebound valving. The shocks control the vehicles motion after a bump. The spring is,ply supports the weight of the vehicle. These vehicles squat a LOT with any trailer weight added to the rear, so I believe the factory springs are butter soft in my opinion. Thats also why it allows it to bobble so much, there's no support from the soft springs. A stiffer sway bar stiffens the overall spring rate because it allows the springs to borrow spring rate from the other side.

Whoa - great info DM. Can the CCS repair any of the valve timing's misgivings through magnetics? When Chevy introduced the whole magnetic suspension concept (it was Chevy wasn't it?), I recall a whole lot of bragging and chest pounding about how easy it was for the real-time computers to correct about any drivability problems that may creep up during a visit to the grocery store. Especially off-road.