2018 Navigator getting 6th set of Cam Phasers.

[Deadman]

I want to throw this question out there to all the folks having these internal engine issues....what is the oil change interval, what filters are used and oil type? Is the engine brought up to operating temperature before driven? Is the engine allowed to idle for a few minutes to cool down and let the twin turbos spool down before shutting off the engine? I think I can guess some of the answers...

This has had 6 oil changes with the 6 cam phaser replacements, so in 20,000 miles I think thats plenty In itself! lmao.

Lately its been getting an oil change every tank of fuel because thats how long these new cam phasers are lasting.

 

[lv2drive]

This has had 6 oil changes with the 6 cam phaser replacements, so in 20,000 miles I think thats plenty In itself! lmao.

Lately its been getting an oil change every tank of fuel because thats how long these new cam phasers are lasting.

ouch.

mic drop.

 

[scottdm]

Just made an appointment with my dealer for cold start rattle at 32,000 miles on my 2018... Not looking forward to this. Can anyone confirm if the cam phaser parts have been redesigned to address a known flaw, or are the same faulty parts being installed as replacements?

 

[cfldad]

I believe more than one person has had recurring issues. Kind of implies the real issue doesn’t always get resolved.

 

[lv2drive]

dunno about the parts being better yet - and god knows if they are having trouble sourcing the “improved” parts & reverting to the old “available” ones just to get it done (for now.)

lean hard on them & insist on water pump replacement if at all possible - they can “find a slight drip” a lot easier if you are constantly nagging about it.

also make sure to eyeball the fuel downspout post op, to see that it’s actually there, because it’s evidently simple for that to catch on the body when dropping it into final position post-op. i learned that the hard way at fill up when the NJ gas attendant didn’t notice he was actually dumping a few gallons of premium on my left rear wheel right before picking up my kid at school. i will say it could have been worse - glad he wasn’t smoking!

oh and check your front bumpers too, my left side panel along the wheel well is awkwardly bumped out from “something” not lining up right from the body drop as well.

fun times. at least i’ve only had to do it once so far.

 

[John I]

dunno about the parts being better yet - and god knows if they are having trouble sourcing the “improved” parts & reverting to the old “available” ones just to get it done (for now.)

lean hard on them & insist on water pump replacement if at all possible - they can “find a slight drip” a lot easier if you are constantly nagging about it.

also make sure to eyeball the fuel downspout post op, to see that it’s actually there, because it’s evidently simple for that to catch on the body when dropping it into final position post-op. i learned that the hard way at fill up when the NJ gas attendant didn’t notice he was actually dumping a few gallons of premium on my left rear wheel right before picking up my kid at school. i will say it could have been worse - glad he wasn’t smoking!

oh and check your front bumpers too, my left side panel along the wheel well is awkwardly bumped out from “something” not lining up right from the body drop as well.

fun times. at least i’ve only had to do it once so far.

Man, I am really NOT looking forward to the dealer tackling this job next week on my 2019 w/ 15K miles.

 

[5280tunage]

Man, I am really NOT looking forward to the dealer tackling this job next week on my 2019 w/ 15K miles.

I wasn't either at 14k miles. Mine took all of 5 days just for this service, they didn't separate the body/frame in mine though, but I know many shops do resort to that. But based on what my techs said, it's better to take extra time to ensure everything is clean and all of the gaskets and sealants set properly.

I know Deadmans have been warranty, but 6 times, I'd be done after 2 maybe 3. And I know Deadman loves his ford/lincolns, but I don't think I'd buy another unless I know everything is new/different.

 

[Deadman]

I wasn't either at 14k miles. Mine took all of 5 days just for this service, they didn't separate the body/frame in mine though, but I know many shops do resort to that. But based on what my techs said, it's better to take extra time to ensure everything is clean and all of the gaskets and sealants set properly.

I know Deadmans have been warranty, but 6 times, I'd be done after 2 maybe 3. And I know Deadman loves his ford/lincolns, but I don't think I'd buy another unless I know everything is new/different.

They don't separate body-frame. My dealer said even to swap this engine it goes out the front. They said if you pull the body you just make more problems.

 

[lv2drive]

man i wish i had your dealer

all 8 of my local ones said they would do body off. so i rolled the dice with the most promising one. meh

 

[Deadman]

man i wish i had your dealer

all 8 of my local ones said they would do body off. so i rolled the dice with the most promising one. meh

They did say the front clip stuff comes off so they can go out the front, so the front is disassembled to some extent as well..... Hopefully yours is good!

 

[Deadman]

I jUST got the call. Dealer found the cam shafts scored and the oils full of metal. Ford FINALLY agreed to pay for an engine replacement in it. I can't believe it took this long, but they are swapping it, so I'm happy in the end! Its been at the dealer 6 weeks and counting right now. Probably be a few more weeks with this and the needed parts....

 

[scottdm]

Any idea if the cam shafts were scored on the prior replacements? Metal in the oil certainly would cause lots of trouble/wear issues. Glad they finally agreed to swap in a new engine!

 

[Deadman]

Any idea if the cam shafts were scored on the prior replacements? Metal in the oil certainly would cause lots of trouble/wear issues. Glad they finally agreed to swap in a new engine!

No way to know.
They disassembled it much farther this time inspecting it and looking for damage. I'm not sure how far they pull it apart just for Phaser replacement.

 

[Paul M]

Congrats on finally getting a resolution. I’ve been following this post and wondering if I need to sign you up for the “bourbon of the month club” or some ptsd drugs...

 

[Deadman]

Congrats on finally getting a resolution. I’ve been following this post and wondering if I need to sign you up for the “bourbon of the month club” or some ptsd drugs...

yes please!

 

[lv2drive]

I jUST got the call. Dealer found the cam shafts scored and the oils full of metal. Ford FINALLY agreed to pay for an engine replacement in it. I can't believe it took this long, but they are swapping it, so I'm happy in the end! Its been at the dealer 6 weeks and counting right now. Probably be a few more weeks with this and the needed parts....

hallelujah!

on the heels of this wonderful news for you -

my cam phasers were just done as some may know - purred like a lion for a few weeks...

now there is this NEW sound. only for a few minutes or so after startup. seems different sound IMO from what i had before. NOT happy, obviously concerned especially with some of the tech’s oversights that i dealt with. gonna insist on checking for metal also. there’s no way in hell i’m gonna let ford do this job 5 more times to get it right, i’ll tell ya that.

but hey @Deadman at least i made it 2 tanks of gas! FFS

if it’s surgery again, i’ve completely lost confidence & i fear that i might just dump her now while resale prices are so good & do a coilover conversion to my 2001 allroad to get it road ready again, because i literally have more confidence in that 20yr old 240k mile beast.

listen to the video for yourselves. and caution to all for the suspected fix that appears to not stick (for some of us.) really makes me question the parts they’re using, & the problem has to be bigger than the parts as well.

 

[DWs-TTEB]

hallelujah!

on the heels of this wonderful news for you -

my cam phasers were just done as some may know - purred like a lion for a few weeks...

now there is this NEW sound. only for a few minutes or so after startup. seems different sound IMO from what i had before. NOT happy, obviously concerned especially with some of the tech’s oversights that i dealt with. gonna insist on checking for metal also. there’s no way in hell i’m gonna let ford do this job 5 more times to get it right, i’ll tell ya that.

but hey @Deadman at least i made it 2 tanks of gas! FFS

if it’s surgery again, i’ve completely lost confidence & i fear that i might just dump her now while resale prices are so good & do a coilover conversion to my 2001 allroad to get it road ready again, because i literally have more confidence in that 20yr old 240k mile beast.

listen to the video for yourselves. and caution to all for the suspected fix that appears to not stick (for some of us.) really makes me question the parts they’re using, & the problem has to be bigger than the parts as well.

That sounds really bad! It’s stops after it warms up? Sounds like engine knock. Doesn’t sound like the cam phaser issue most have. I wouldn’t drive it like that if possible and get it in ASAP. Use that warranty. Be ready for that COVID parts on back order excuse. POST 15 months of COVID it’s insane we are still dealing with supply issues. What a weakness we have. Let’s hope companies learn from this. Rant done

 

[cfldad]

<sigh> would not have purchased if i saw this thread, even if chances are 1% for these sorts of issues. Time to deal with taking it in alone has a price associated. Good luck guys!

 

[lv2drive]

That sounds really bad! It’s stops after it warms up? Sounds like engine knock. Doesn’t sound like the cam phaser issue most have. I wouldn’t drive it like that if possible and get it in ASAP. Use that warranty. Be ready for that COVID parts on back order excuse. POST 15 months of COVID it’s insane we are still dealing with supply issues. What a weakness we have. Let’s hope companies learn from this. Rant done

Yeah definitely doesn’t sound like the same cam phaser noise as earlier problem was. My concern is that they screwed something up or triggered something else during surgery. Or maybe something else just failed conveniently. It seems to go away after a few minutes, but no matter how recently the car is been driven or how warm everything is, it will still do it at start up every time.

I am now repossessing the wife’s Touareg Diesel and for the first time in a long time I am thankful about having this machine in comparison to the XP, Even with all the BS I had to deal with on the VW side and watch it get castrated - The build is so much better it’s painfully obvious

 

[Deadman]

That noise does not sound like the phaser noise this had...... Who knows what they did in there.