'20 rattling waste gate?

[bushpilot]

Anyone else have a '20 and had the rattling waste gate?

Ive got 10,100 miles - sounds like a loose skid plate on start up (its not phasers).
Sounds like its coming from under the drivers side/door area.

 

[5280tunage]

Mine isn't a 20 but I've posted several times about it. mine has been in the shop several times already for this issue. Ford told the dealer that they couldn't do any service on the turbos, they had to do the phaser repair first. So after a week in the shop for that, still had the rattle, the second time around they attempted to replace the wastegate actuators, and that still didn't fix it. so now I'm waiting for an appointment to go hopefully get the turbos replaced. My noise is happening on both driver and passenger side. not only does it happen when you start the vehicle, but it can happen after 10 hours of driving. Pretty annoying.

But as an FYI, Ford actually distributed a dealer service bulletin to all of their dealers, stating that rattles like this are normal and that under normal circumstances they won't hurt anything, therefore they don't tend to fix them. many people have different experiences at their local dealers but my guess is it'll get harder and harder to get this thing fixed.

It still kills me that an $80k msrp vehicle sounds like a geo metro in a drive thru.

 

[Vipersinu2]

My 19 navigator got a new driver turbo around 12k miles b/c of the waste gate rattle, I now have 16k and it is now starting to rattle again.

100k truck and it sounds like a diesel vw jetta.

****** me.off

 

[aggiegrad05]

Anyone else have a '20 and had the rattling waste gate?

Ive got 10,100 miles - sounds like a loose skid plate on start up (its not phasers).
Sounds like its coming from under the drivers side/door area.

Well known issue ‘round these parts. Just do a search and you’ll be able to find several threads about it.

Here’s a good one which includes a YouTube about it:

https://www.expeditionforum.com/threads/cold-start-rattle-in-the-turbo.44603/

 

[Expedition Dave]

20 hear. I get noise on startup, almost since the beginning but it does go away. I will note it with Ford, and when they don't do anything recall they were made aware of it and did nothing if something bigger goes wrong. With the list of things growing, Toyota may get my $$$ after all.

 

[5280tunage]

So my '19 has had it basically since I bought the rig. It's been in the shop 5 times for it, and each time they try things but they've never replaced the turbo's. This week its been in the shop for 3 days and will be likely there over the weekend. This time I was able to completely reproduce the noise by holding the throttle down between 1500 and 2k RPM's. Both turbos will pretty constantly rattle if I keep the engine at that speed. So that's good. The bad news is Ford so far has been trying to say it's "normal" which luckily, I think the dealership is pushing back hard. Even the service writer called me and said his F150 has the same issue and he kept trying to fix/troubleshoot heat shields, but now knows it's totally different. So he's invested in figuring out what it is. My issue is, that if it's normal, every vehicle should essentially do it. The '20 expy I'm driving as a loaner doesn't have it. It's whisper quiet, even at cold start.

So we'll see. Super frustrating and ****** me off that a mfr will publish a doc saying something is "normal" just so they don't have to replace a ****** design.

 

[DWs-TTEB]

So my '19 has had it basically since I bought the rig. It's been in the shop 5 times for it, and each time they try things but they've never replaced the turbo's. This week its been in the shop for 3 days and will be likely there over the weekend. This time I was able to completely reproduce the noise by holding the throttle down between 1500 and 2k RPM's. Both turbos will pretty constantly rattle if I keep the engine at that speed. So that's good. The bad news is Ford so far has been trying to say it's "normal" which luckily, I think the dealership is pushing back hard. Even the service writer called me and said his F150 has the same issue and he kept trying to fix/troubleshoot heat shields, but now knows it's totally different. So he's invested in figuring out what it is. My issue is, that if it's normal, every vehicle should essentially do it. The '20 expy I'm driving as a loaner doesn't have it. It's whisper quiet, even at cold start.

So we'll see. Super frustrating and ****** me off that a mfr will publish a doc saying something is "normal" just so they don't have to replace a ****** design.

I took my rig in for this, they replaced the driverside turbo. Been quiet ever since (that was Sept 10, 2020)

 

[5280tunage]

Yup, went to visit them today to get some stuff out of the car. They have hit the Ford speed bump. Ford has been insisting it's normal, but the tech is explaining it's not. So today they wanted him to do the stethoscope thing which we have actually all done (i even bought my own) and he confirmed the noise. But right now he explained it's taking Ford around 24 hours to respond on techline for updates, which is absurd. It bugs me that these guys think people are fine without their vehicles.

 

[DWs-TTEB]

Yup, went to visit them today to get some stuff out of the car. They have hit the Ford speed bump. Ford has been insisting it's normal, but the tech is explaining it's not. So today they wanted him to do the stethoscope thing which we have actually all done (i even bought my own) and he confirmed the noise. But right now he explained it's taking Ford around 24 hours to respond on techline for updates, which is absurd. It bugs me that these guys think people are fine without their vehicles.

At least you got a loaner! My Ford Service Dealership was all out of loaners during my 3 days of work.

 

[5280tunage]

True, but kind of pissed me off, from the perspective of every other time they said I had to use Enterprise and the stuck me in crap like an ecosport. Try fitting a car seat in that Fiero sized car.

But also. One thing was good timing, just as I pulled in the front camera sprayer starting barfing windshield washer fluid all over the place, so the are working on that, but parts for it were 5 days out. Shit! And they are doing both panels on the dash since they are warping already, at 13k miles. Apparently there was a tsb for the passenger side but not the drivers. Those part were 4 days out. What a cluster. Glad this is all under warranty, but again, I already feel so good knowing I got an extended ford warranty.

 

[DWs-TTEB]

Wow! I would have lost my shit!

 

[5280tunage]

Another quick update on my experience here. So it's been in the shop for 7 days. The master tech has recreated the problem multiple times for Ford, doing everything they ask (and Ford taking its sweet time responding to the tech, sometimes 24hrs or more). Ford got back to the service manager yesterday, saying they are declining the turbo replacement with some ridiculously long explanation that rattles are normal at varying RPM levels and that because the vehicle isn't logging any turbo specific codes, and that it's not hampering operation, that they aren't going to replace them. BS! The dealership is trying, so I can't fault them.

So the Service Manager told me to contact Ford directly and try it from my end. He gave me the details I needed to do so, and I got started. Called the 800 number, first agent I got tried to tell me that that's not how the process works and that I cannot create a case for the issue, that if ford is denying the warranty claim that's it, too bad. But she then hung up on me while trying to take me off mute, so I had to call back in. Got someone else, in a completely different country who I could hard understand, but this guy at least took all the information and said he'd be contacting the dealership, and trying to see what he could do. Funny how you get two very different responses within an hour. I have very little confidence that Ford is going to try and do the right thing here. And frankly it just really ****** me off that they think a rattle noise from an $80k vehicle is "normal". I don't give a rats ass if it doesn't hamper operation, when I pull up next to a 2020 Yukon, do I hear a sound that sounds like a loose heatshield coming from it. Hell, does the 2020 expedition I'm driving as a loaner do it, no... Not impressed, but I'm left feeling like a typical consumer these days, you're stuck. You either take a massive loss ($20k+ at this point) and get rid of the vehicle, or you suck it up and deal. Being a consumer in the US frankly sucks these days. Sorry, ranting now. I'll update if I hear anything back from Ford, but it's been in the shop now for a total of almost 20 days in the first year. I wish I could charge them for my time, and effectively 20/30ths of a loan payment at this point for loss of use and depreciation.

 

[mcb345]

Another quick update on my experience here. So it's been in the shop for 7 days. The master tech has recreated the problem multiple times for Ford, doing everything they ask (and Ford taking its sweet time responding to the tech, sometimes 24hrs or more). Ford got back to the service manager yesterday, saying they are declining the turbo replacement with some ridiculously long explanation that rattles are normal at varying RPM levels and that because the vehicle isn't logging any turbo specific codes, and that it's not hampering operation, that they aren't going to replace them. BS! The dealership is trying, so I can't fault them.

So the Service Manager told me to contact Ford directly and try it from my end. He gave me the details I needed to do so, and I got started. Called the 800 number, first agent I got tried to tell me that that's not how the process works and that I cannot create a case for the issue, that if ford is denying the warranty claim that's it, too bad. But she then hung up on me while trying to take me off mute, so I had to call back in. Got someone else, in a completely different country who I could hard understand, but this guy at least took all the information and said he'd be contacting the dealership, and trying to see what he could do. Funny how you get two very different responses within an hour. I have very little confidence that Ford is going to try and do the right thing here. And frankly it just really ****** me off that they think a rattle noise from an $80k vehicle is "normal". I don't give a rats ass if it doesn't hamper operation, when I pull up next to a 2020 Yukon, do I hear a sound that sounds like a loose heatshield coming from it. Hell, does the 2020 expedition I'm driving as a loaner do it, no... Not impressed, but I'm left feeling like a typical consumer these days, you're stuck. You either take a massive loss ($20k+ at this point) and get rid of the vehicle, or you suck it up and deal. Being a consumer in the US frankly sucks these days. Sorry, ranting now. I'll update if I hear anything back from Ford, but it's been in the shop now for a total of almost 20 days in the first year. I wish I could charge them for my time, and effectively 20/30ths of a loan payment at this point for loss of use and depreciation.

I feel your pain. I went in for rattle and they replaced VCT and still rattling, they said Ford will deny the turbo fix and I’ve been reading the forum and lots of denied fixes so I’m not even trying anymore. I’ve spent about 12 days in the shop for a handful of fixes and only owned it (used) for 80 days or so. Absolutely no interest in going back in there.

If something major in the powertrain craps out because of this it’s in them (extended warranty). Again, goes to show the extended warranty is worth every cent.

 

[5280tunage]

Yeah, it's mind numbing. I'm so disappointed. The guy from Ford called me back today and said so far no luck, and his initial "idea" was to take it to another dealership. I asked him why that would matter and he said there's a chance it would be a different answer. I pushed back two fold, saying basically what you said, that it's a waste of time and over 20 days in the shop in one year should be more than enough, but I also pushed back saying that it wouldn't matter. The common issue isn't the dealership, they are trying to do everything they can. Ford is the common denominator so I asked him to escalate one more time, and we'll see, but I don't have high hopes.

If anyone else has any ideas, I'm all ears. I love that the 2020 i'm driving right now is so much quieter at startup and driving. Guess my new exhaust will have to drown out the turbo...

 

[mcb345]

Ford is treading water right now with their warranty claims, biggest priority for their new CEO is getting that under control. If they can’t, their stock will plummet I’m sure and his job is at risk. Warranty claims up $2B since 2017 (not good).

I’m guessing he’s trying to deny as much as possible, get their products worked out and then return to “normal” in accepting these types of claims down the road but since they’re already in a shitstorm with the Explorer, obviously the Expedition too, they’re not doing well and burning through cash because of warranty repairs.

Ford also recently told its parts suppliers its charging back half of all warranty related repairs.

All of this will solve the immediate problem but put a sour taste in current owners thus losing long term customers. Just my opinion.

One would think they’d have the 3.5 ecoboost figured out by now even with some Gen 2 changes?!?

 

[5280tunage]

Completely understand, when I look at the financials, it's not good. Sad, feels like just 2 or 3 yrs ago it was very different. Which of course was what I was basing my purchasing decisions on.

Real trouble now for me at least, is that if the turbos Don't get replaced now, they may never for me. I was planning on putting the SPD turbo adapters and downpipes on. my guess is if I have another claim after this they'll probably deny it just because of those even with the history.

 

[mcb345]

Yea one would think many people are holding off on fun powertrain mods because of the potential for major issues while under warranty.

 

[Soliyou]

Honestly, I am not too concerned about the turbo rattles. It is a hinged system with no guides, in my mind it has to have some slack to seal correctly. If no slack is allowed it may seal crooked and leak.

I am more concerned about the cam phaser issues.

 

[Vipersinu2]

Honestly, I am not too concerned about the turbo rattles. It is a hinged system with no guides, in my mind it has to have some slack to seal correctly. If no slack is allowed it may seal crooked and leak.

I am more concerned about the cam phaser issues.

I disagree with you, my Navigator was over 100k, it sounds like shit when at the bank drivethru.

I feel ford buys cheap widgets in china, China sends the widgets to Mexico, Mexico assembles the part, Mexico send the part to the UAW to install.

Its all a shit show.

 

[JasonH]

Try small claims court.