2018 Expedition vs. 2017 Navigator

[cobalt_boater]

Hello everyone. I am new to the forum and this is my first thread. I am currently shopping for a full-size SUV for my growing family, and we have narrowed it down to a 2018 Expedition or a 2017 Navigator. We will have 3 kids in car seats and we also have a 25' Cobalt boat with a dry weight of 4,500 lbs. (not including fluids or trailer). The vehicle will be my wife's family hauler with occasional towing use, including some longer trips. Below are my requirements and nice-to-haves.

Requirements
Leather seats (or Active-X)
2nd Row Captain's Chairs
HD Tow Package
Sunroof

Nice-to-Have
"Max" or "L" model for extra cargo room
Rear seat entertainment

I am just looking for your feedback when comparing these two models. Finding an 18+ Expedition with the Captains Chairs and Tow Package has not been easy, especially if I want a Max. And to get the Expedition I want I am looking at $48-50k.

My wife and I are not crazy about the last gen Expedition (feel it looks outdated), but we actually both like the last gen Navigator. I know that it is essentially the same vehicle as the Expy, but the different front and rear ends combined with the upgraded features have us considering it as well. I believe all Navi's have the HD Tow Package, and the L's come with a 4.10 rear standard. Plus I have been able to find quite a few for sale with Captains Chairs and no center counsel. And depending on miles I am looking at $35-45k.

I really want to stay under $50k. Getting a 17 Navigator L that checks all of my boxes for around $40k is enticing. But we really like the 18+ Expedition as well. What do you think??

 

[Deadman]

The 4th gen starts in 2018. I prefer the updates over the 2017+.

 

[cobalt_boater]

Yes, I know I am comparing a Gen 3 Navigator to a Gen 4 Expedition. All things equal we would get the Expedition. But given the lower price point of the Navigator and the fact that it seems easier to find one that meets all of my requirements than an Expedition, we are considering the older Navigator. Hoping to get some more feedback comparing the two, or maybe hear from someone who made a similar decision. Thanks

 

[cobalt_boater]

I am currently looking at this Expedition. 2018 Limited with 301A, Special Edition, and HD Tow Packages. 1-owner trade-in with just under 60k miles for about $48k. What do you guys think? Is the 60k mile service a major maintenance milestone?

Can anyone tell me if this one has CCD? And also what exactly is CCD and how does it impact towing and everyday driving?

 

[JasonH]

I haven't done this exact comparison for myself, but some considerations are below:

If you have three kids, you'll definitely want the longer wheelbase. It helps with luggage as well as stability while towing.
Payload can be an issue with higher level trims, and you'll definitely want max tow (as you noted).
Some people don't want the hassle of using a WDH with a boat, but you may max out tongue weight without a WDH.
The 2018 Expedition has many desirable upgrades over the 2017 Navigator, including the 10 speed, tilt and slide seats, dynamic cruise, 10 more hp, and a few others. Brochures are online for each year, so you can see which options are available.
An extended warranty is highly recommended, as major repairs on these Ecoboost engines can be expensive.
CCD is adaptive damping for 22" wheels.

 

[Deadman]

Thats NOT CCD and that's ALOT of money for a half for out vehicle.

 

[cobalt_boater]

Thanks Jason! All very good feedback. The longer wheelbase is definitely my preference, but I'm finding it very difficult to find one with captains chairs and tow package.

And Deadman, I agree with you. Unfortunately this is one of the best deals I have found in this crazy market. Again it has me considering a 3rd Gen Navigator L for $10k less...

 

[dlcorbett]

After owning a pre refresh 3rd gen navi, driven 2017 nav with ccd and without and owning a 2018 expy, here's what I can tell you:

-The 10 sp is a huge improvement over the 6sp. It keeps the truck in its PowerBand better and helps it get better fe.

-the driver assist tech on the 18 does help with long distance cruising such as adaptive cruise, lane keep and pre collision.

-the nav will have "softer" seats, but the expy will have more "comfy" seats

-the sec and third row space in the 18 blows away the 2nd row space, which def helps with car seats.

- the expy will have better handling. As far as ride goes, I felt the 17 nav l w/o ccd has the best overall balance btw plush and control. My expy didn't have ccd(it was like the one you posted) and the ride was great but a tad inconsistent, one day it's extremely absorbent, the next day you feel every crack in the road. The 17 nav with ccd was also good, but did wander a bit too much for my liking. The ccd in the new nav doesn't wander as much and I'd assume that the expy ccd feels somewhat similar.

- watch 18s for a lot of the little quirks they had at first build. Overall though, outside of cams phasers and shocks leaking (non ccd), you should be ok.

 

[Emilner]

One thing I have to question- with 3 kids why are you considering 2nd row captains chairs? We have 3 kids and a second row bench is mandatory- otherwise you have to always have the third row partially up whenever you go somewhere with the fam. There is so much shoulder room in the second row that they all have plenty of space 3 across and I almost never have to leave a 3rd row seat up.

I would also seriously consider an 18 over the 17. The newest gen is a substantial jump forward over the last series.

 

[shane_th_ee]

For what it’s worth, the ‘17 Navigator L only came with an open differential, while the 18 Expedition with HD tow package has an eLSD with locking mode. Note that 2018 Expeditions with the HD tow package were not built in high numbers as Ford had issues producing said fancy rear axle in volume, so I’m not surprised that they’re hard to find used. They were hard to find new.

 

[BMW2FORD]

I was in the same position a few months ago comparing the same two models. I ended up with a 2018 limited Max 4wd with the 302a package and 22 inch wheels, rear entertainment and captain chairs. It was hard to find but we drove a few States away to get it. I have three kids and two big dogs so captain chairs were on our list since the kids can walk right to the back row without folding a seat and dogs can lay on the floor with no problems. Once you get the 22 inch wheels, the CCD (continuous controlled dampening) is standard. The shocks basically self adjust to road conditions for comfort and control. They also stiffen in Sport mode and are noticeably different. My main reasons to go to the 2018 4th Gen over the 3rd Gen Navigator was 1) 10 speed auto really helps with drive ability and performance and economy, 2) the Gen 2 eco boost engine that’s in the 4th Gen has double injection (port and direct) and eliminated the engine intake valve carbon problem on earlier models 3) ride, control and comfort of the 4th Gen is very improved, 4) body of 4th Gen is aluminum so rusted rockers and doors are not a problem and lastly, insurance is in some cases much lower on the newer models with crash detection systems so something to ask your insurance company by giving them a vin number of a 3rd and 4th gen to see if there is a difference. I did all the services my self. Transmission, transfer case and brake fluid, spark plugs and filters should be done around 60k. Ford says 100k but that’s pretty stretched out. Next on my list is the front and rear diff fluids. Make sure to use Ford specified fluids since they are very specific to the trans, transfer case and diffs and they do not cost much from the dealer. Hope that helps!

 

[cobalt_boater]

Thanks for all the really good feedback so far. Emilner, we want the Captains Chairs for the reason BMW2FORD described. We really like having that open walkway to access the 3rd row.

However, is the middle seat removable on the bench? Maybe I don't have to be so dead set on Captain's chairs if that's the case.

 

[cobalt_boater]

And BMW2FORD really helpful to hear your thoughts on this. The majority is voting in favor of a long wheelbase Gen 4, which has always been my preference. Now I just need to find a Max XLT or Limited with the Two Package...

 

[BMW2FORD]

I couldn’t find one with a tow package but from what I can see, if you add the trailer brake controller and have the dealer program it, that’s one big part of that option. The parts system also shows a more higher efficient radiator and electric cooling fan set up. I live in the North and thought I’d add the trailer brake controller first if I got a trailer with electric brakes then the radiator and fans if it ran hot when towing. Just a thought in case you want to add the tow package later and can’t get one with it but I’m also not 100% sure if that’s all that is needed but thinking from what I can see that’s the bulk of it. If anyone else knows more please let us know (it’s a common request to add the tow option and might be worth a whole new post).

 

[Jettix2]

I’ve read that you can remove the center portion of the split bench to make “captains chairs” without the armrests, which should make your search easier.

Just bought a 2018 Expedition Max Platinum with 60k miles. CPO, and we added extended warranty to 140k miles. The 2018++ is a HUGE step forward and I would highly recommend it.

 

[cobalt_boater]

I am seeing a few MAX XLTs with the Tow Package for sale online. Almost all of them have the 2nd row bench. Can anyone confirm that the middle seat can be removed? I'm not concerned about armrests, both seats will be occupied by car seats.

My ideal choice would be a MAX Limited with Tow Package. The upgraded seats and interior trim, speakers, wheels and headlights with LED DRLs would all be nice to have. The search continues!

 

[FlyBry]

Yes, you can remove the center section of the middle row bench seat. Several have done it already. You may find it in Search with Child seats

 

[cobalt_boater]

Thanks FlyBry, I will do some more digging to see if I can find any more info about removing the middle seat.

I have been tempted to settle for a couple different Limited MAX's that checked all the boxes, but the HD Tow Package. The 6,000 lb. limit of the standard model should handle towing my boat short distances and launching it in and out. But I think it's best to hold out for the Tow Package so we can take the boat on longer trips, or even handle a bigger boat in the future.

 

[cobalt_boater]

Found this '18 MAX Platinum with captains seats and the Tow Package. $55k for 66k miles. Meets all the requirements (except price), plus adds the extra features of the Platinum. What are the biggest upgrades on the Platinum vs. a Limited?

 

[FlyBry]

Used 2018 Ford Expedition MAX Platinum Specs & Features

Engine
Horsepower	400 hp @ 5000 rpm
Torque	480 lb-ft @ 3250 rpm
Valve timing	Variable
Valves	24