Hellwig 7696 is installed on 2024 Expedition
- Thread starter Hellwig
- Start date
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zak99b5
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Just ordered a Hellwig rear bar for my Max, as we experience the wobble and want it gone. I won’t do a front bar, because stiffening up the front will increase under steer.
Are upgraded links for the rear bar a necessity? If so, are there any links with heim joints? Wouldn’t be terribly hard to assemble one's own.
Are upgraded links for the rear bar a necessity? If so, are there any links with heim joints? Wouldn’t be terribly hard to assemble one's own.
Hellwig
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My factory links on the rear still work fine for three thousand miles after replacement. Front hellwig bar makes the vehicle flat when I make sharp turns, and it may reduce the wobble feeling, to some extent. You may feel the difference with it, but perhaps you wouldn't care much about it.
5280tunage
Full Access Members
Hey all. Wanted to quickly post some feedback on this topic. I finally found the perfect combination of energy suspension parts for the hellwig front sway bar on these. This is my third attempt at this, but I finally got it. So for anyone out there that knows what this is like, the Hellwig sway bars are massive upgrades, but they are so much more rigid that the stock bars that on mine, I had two factory end links popping in just a few weeks after install. I tried different end links from multiple brands, including Moog, and many others. The moogs failed in a week. I've been using some universal energy suspension ones for a couple years but the bushings tend to wear out pretty fast. So I cobbled together a few different parts and wanted to post this so others don't have to do the trial and error thing I've had to.
The parts I bought were the following:
Energy suspension bushings (these are larger and a little beefier than the ones that come in the kit) - 9.8103G x2
Energy suspension universal end link kit - 9.8149G
I cut the spacers in the kit to 3.5" exactly. the bolts are long enough that I was able to easily get both sides on loosely before I cranked them down. this was a challenge with previous kits as the bolts weren't long enough to get through all of the bushings etc. Feels and looks much better now.
The parts I bought were the following:
Energy suspension bushings (these are larger and a little beefier than the ones that come in the kit) - 9.8103G x2
Energy suspension universal end link kit - 9.8149G
I cut the spacers in the kit to 3.5" exactly. the bolts are long enough that I was able to easily get both sides on loosely before I cranked them down. this was a challenge with previous kits as the bolts weren't long enough to get through all of the bushings etc. Feels and looks much better now.
Attachments
JimmyM
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Thanks for the info and part numbers.
Have you replaced the front and rear roll bars?
Do the rear links need any special attention when using the Hellwig 7688 bar?
Have you replaced the front and rear roll bars?
Do the rear links need any special attention when using the Hellwig 7688 bar?
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JimmyM
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The full parts list...
Front:
Hellwig 7696 bar
Energy Suspension end links 9.8149G (Cut down to 3.5")
Energy Suspension end link bushing 9.8103G
Energy Suspension bar mount bushings 9.5175G
Rear:
Hellwig 7688 bar (22mm)
Energy suspension bar mounts 9.5158G
Looks like the stock end links are sufficient. Correct?
Front:
Hellwig 7696 bar
Energy Suspension end links 9.8149G (Cut down to 3.5")
Energy Suspension end link bushing 9.8103G
Energy Suspension bar mount bushings 9.5175G
Rear:
Hellwig 7688 bar (22mm)
Energy suspension bar mounts 9.5158G
Looks like the stock end links are sufficient. Correct?
JimmyM
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It looks like stiffening only the front bar can lead to understeer, but I'm hoping stiffening both will keep the over/under steer balance in check. I'd love to flatten this thing out in the corners
ROBERT BONNER
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Nice work, you should send the recipe to Hellwig. Maybe they can supply with the bar?!
Deadman
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My Hellwig SWAYBAR'S have 55,000 miles on them and the factory end links are still working fine and they are quiet. I'm not sure why you guys are going thru them so quickly. I actually bought a spare set of 4 and took them on my cross country trips just in case, but now I threw them in the garage. I HAVE replaced the front sway bar bushings, because the Hellwig ones wear out quickly and get sloppy. The end links need to be installed with the weight on the vehicle and so they aren't over extended at big angles.
LegalBrief
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Dude…. Your brackets (end links) are snapping because you installed the sway bar upside down. Easy to do (I did it) and directions are weak. If your end links are snapping I guarantee it’s the Helwig installed upside down.
5280tunage
Full Access Members
I double checked that and even sent them pictures. They said it was installed properly. The bar is substantially stronger than stock, so the stock end links and crappy rubber absorbers don't handle it well. It's the old adage of replace the week link only to create another.
If you notice in the one close up of the end links installed I sent, the mounting position on the bar is pretty parallel with the control arm. If I flip the bar, it will point more upwards and won't be parallel actually causing much worse, I actually did it the wrong way to begin with two years ago. Maybe using the term snapped was the issue, they have never broken into two pieces, but I get the infamous popping sounds. Same as I used to on my straight axle and IFS jeeps. The end links often have week components inside that crack, causing excess play in them which causes the pop. This is exactly what happened to one of the Moogs, I opened it up and found a cracked metal socket the ball fits in.
On my jeeps, one of the first things I always did was upgrade the bars and convert from standard ball and socket end links to billet/spherical style end links, solved everything. I just can't find anything that HD for these.
The stationary ones I've been using from Energy suspension work much better, they just need new bushings about once a year.
If you notice in the one close up of the end links installed I sent, the mounting position on the bar is pretty parallel with the control arm. If I flip the bar, it will point more upwards and won't be parallel actually causing much worse, I actually did it the wrong way to begin with two years ago. Maybe using the term snapped was the issue, they have never broken into two pieces, but I get the infamous popping sounds. Same as I used to on my straight axle and IFS jeeps. The end links often have week components inside that crack, causing excess play in them which causes the pop. This is exactly what happened to one of the Moogs, I opened it up and found a cracked metal socket the ball fits in.
On my jeeps, one of the first things I always did was upgrade the bars and convert from standard ball and socket end links to billet/spherical style end links, solved everything. I just can't find anything that HD for these.
The stationary ones I've been using from Energy suspension work much better, they just need new bushings about once a year.
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Defyant
Active Member
Great info here. Thanks for sharing. I’ll be installing Hellwigs front and rears this week.
I did the rear sway bar several months ago and the difference was night and day. I recommend everyone do it. However, I swapped out the front bar and links a few weeks ago and I'm not certain it's an improvement. I used the same setup as the guy on page 3 but my my links were a part 9.8121R so my spacer is 4in instead of 3.5 (It shouldn't make a difference because the bar pivots so all that matters is its position relative to the other end of the bar). I'm getting a lot of bump steer. If I hit a bump with one wheel the steering wheel will bounce left and right a good 10-15 degrees. I also swapped out my ccd shocks at the same time, and most likely messed the alignment up a bit because I didn't realize the lower control arm mounting points were slotted, but that shouldn't make this much of a difference in handling.
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I’ve got one scheduled for Tuesday. Hopefully it clears some things up.
@Hellwig this may be the better thread to ask: the energy suspension brackets are smaller than the stock hellwigs. Any ideas if it’s ok to crank them down (seemed to work ok) or if you need a shim to make them the same z-height as the stock hellwigs?
(Using the energy suspension bushings to get an easy grease port)
Deadman
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My front Hellwig sway bar is rusting like absolutely crazy. It must have horrible paint on it. Theres little to no rust on my expedition, but man that front sway bar is flaking off in layers of rust. I sprayed it down in oil hoping to slow it down.
Hellwig
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Sorry, I have no idea about your question. Honestly, I am not affiliated with Hellwig business by all means. I just chose this username randomly.
5280tunage
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That's nutso - I haven't noticed any rusting on either of my bars. But then again most of my front bar is covered by the skid plates so it may get a lot less debris on it. do you spend a lot of time on dirt road where it might get peppered by pebbles? I actually thought the powder coating on it seemed pretty thick. Wonder if you send pics to Hellwig and see if they'll do anything, seems like they should.
Deadman
Full Access Members
I only noticed it during an oil change because I had to take that diaper off. The coating flaked off in a big thick layer. I'm sure this rust is what is destroying my sway bar bushings. It lives in road salt in Wisconsin.
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