Help drive on bumpy roads

[VBreithaupt]

I felt a huge difference in ride quality going from my OE tires to Michelin Defenders.

 

[Moeman]

We just bought a 22 Expedition for my wife. We also could not believe how jittery the ride was. The road can look perfectly fine, but it feels like you're hitting small bumps/cracks in the pavement. I think what you're likely complaining about is a resonance problem in the frame. Years ago when they were C-channel in the back, normal mode was very low, and hence not terribly offensive. It just felt like a little bit of float in the boat. Now they've stiffened the crap out of the frame which pushes the frequency higher. So any impact sets the frame into resonance and it takes a second or so to dampen itself out. We've thus far changed wheels and tires - went from stock 20/55 to 20/60 Sumitomo Encounter (cheap and very good reviews). I wouldn't call it night/day, but I do think the ride is slightly better. We're also considering Bilstein's, mostly to lift the front slightly. It's possible that it could transmit less impact to the frame if they have some compliance in the high speed compression. But, I'm also not holding my breath. If they have a rear spring sized to be able to handle a few thousand extra pounds, it's going to be stiff and there's only so much you can do with a shock. Think Super Duty. They don't start to smooth out until you have a half ton in the bed.

 

[techdude99]

Do you have the model number for the sumo springs?

I purchased mine here: https://www.etrailer.com/search/sumosprings

 

[azfitch]

Thanks for the info. Dealer says my struts are fine. Visually no oil and they aren’t locked up. Going to get them checked out again next time in for an oil change. Thinking about trying out some new Michelin after reading comments on this thread and looking at at other threads

 

[dlcorbett]

I put this in the nav forum as someone is having issues with their trucks ride. Unfortunately, this is with ccd, not base springs. When I had my limited expy, some days, the ride was luxury car smooth, and some days, it felt like a shopping cart. My nav doesn't have such wide disparities in ride, but it still has those differences. Hopefully you or someone can get some use out of the post without spending hundreds of dollars.

There is something I do when I feel my truck is riding less than optimally. It may seem counter intuitive but it works for me atleast.

As I stated before, there are times when the ride is worse than normal, the dampers feel too stiff but the springs arent adjusted accordingly(i know the spring rates dont change, but somehow the springs do react to the damper changes in each specific mode to help body motion), so every bump causes pitchy motions. When it does this, I like to change the dampers to sport mode. I change the modes pretty often on my truck already. Personally, I like eco (comfort) on highways as the rocking sensation isnt noticed as much but the bump absorption is better, normal on byways as its not as floaty as eco on pavement changes, and sport (excite) on city streets and wavy pavement for the body control. What I noticed however, is that in sport, the dampers actually resist the pitchy movements more effectively than any other mode and the firmness on top of the weight gives the truck better dampening on small pockmarked roads. Also, it seems to me that the bushings add to the jitteriness, as eco mode makes the truck jiggle more than the others on bumps though its more compliant. In sport, only the repeated broken pavement and deep holes shakes the body. Also, sonce the rear ends is tightened, it doesnt seem like the rear of the body clanks on the frame as much. By driving in this mode for a good amount of time before cycling and switching back to eco or normal, the dampers retain the pitch resistance and slowly loosens up, almost like a soft reset. As a result, it feels more compliant without the shakiness, but it also doesn't feel rocky or pitchy. And hell, if it's already riding like shit, might as well take the handling benefit in sport mode then.

Your mileage may vary, as your trucks are newer, and iirc, the 22s I drove were firmer but more compliant than what I have. Hopefully, You're able get it fixed or get it to your liking. Only other advice I can give is to go 20s for the wheels. My wife and I test drove many truck based suvs, including a grand wagoneer this weekend, she said our 20 nav felt better on the road to her. On city roads, admittedly, her 22 cx9 is a bit better as it doesnt shake and crash over potholes as much, but on the hwy, we'd take the nav 9 times outta 10 (not to mention they avg the same gas mileage on the highway), its just so much nicer when it wants to be.

 

[azfitch]

Thanks for the info. Dealer says my struts are fine. Visually no oil and they aren’t locked up. Going to get them checked out again next time in for an oil change. Thinking about trying out some new Michelin after reading comments on this thread and looking at at other threads

Update on my Expy max 22” no CCD. Swapped out the Pirelli’s for LTX and made slight improvement. While the tires were off could tell both driver side struts were leaking. Took into dealer and they had to order all 4 corners (4 week backorder). Finally got em installed and back on the road. Still a very stiff ride. Wish would’ve tried the Billsteins, but wanted to try OEM since mine were shot.

4 time Tahoe owner (all with the magnetic ride) so just used to the floating ride. This was my First Expy. Will know next time to get ccd or 18” wheels

 

[Dice Roll]

I like the floaty ride of the ccd. I do think the sport setting feels real good, just can’t take the trans shifting. I test drove a standard suspension one and it was quite a bit firmer in the ride, less bouncy after a pothole. It’s like the ccd lets the bumps shake out longer so not as harsh, but some don’t like how that feels. Preference is what it boils down to.

bilsteins are a nice product. I’ve had them on an f350. I plan to go to them on my hobby car next.

these are the worst oem tires I’ve ever dealt with. They flat spot easy, and I can feel them getting worse as they age through vibrations in the steering wheel. I was particularly bummed this summer when a trailer blew a tire in front of me and I got a bolt in a tire. Best option was a new hankrook at the dealer. It made the wheel vibrate noticeably less. I can’t wait to change these. I had a skid on a road I’ve been on a bunch of times in the second year when it was light raining. Never had that happen before. They ride funny at times, depends on the weather. They feel like they have low traction in the rain period. They struggle when towing, have to air way up. Have to watch the psi gain as they get hot, they get greasy feeling when they go over 50, which can Happen as the day gets hotter.

 

[Left Coast Geek]

Note 39 psi is the recommended pressure for 22" wheels and the stock /45 tires..... 35 psi for 18" wheels with the stock 285/65R18 tires. 22's without CCD rides awful, 22 with CCD is much better, I swapped mine to 18's and it's even better..

 

[Mr Big]

I like the floaty ride of the ccd. I do think the sport setting feels real good, just can’t take the trans shifting. I test drove a standard suspension one and it was quite a bit firmer in the ride, less bouncy after a pothole. It’s like the ccd lets the bumps shake out longer so not as harsh, but some don’t like how that feels. Preference is what it boils down to.

bilsteins are a nice product. I’ve had them on an f350. I plan to go to them on my hobby car next.

these are the worst oem tires I’ve ever dealt with. They flat spot easy, and I can feel them getting worse as they age through vibrations in the steering wheel. I was particularly bummed this summer when a trailer blew a tire in front of me and I got a bolt in a tire. Best option was a new hankrook at the dealer. It made the wheel vibrate noticeably less. I can’t wait to change these. I had a skid on a road I’ve been on a bunch of times in the second year when it was light raining. Never had that happen before. They ride funny at times, depends on the weather. They feel like they have low traction in the rain period. They struggle when towing, have to air way up. Have to watch the psi gain as they get hot, they get greasy feeling when they go over 50, which can Happen as the day gets hotter.

My Michelin Defender 22" tires are smooth as glass with CCD and stock shocks. The ride on smooth, bumpy, pretty much any road is flawless.
Regarding Trans shifting, reset your PCM so everything learns again. I did mine, because I bought it used, and it was jumping gears going from 2 to 5 or 6, jerking when slowing down. Now my Expedition shifts flawlessly and learned my driving habits.
This is especially important if there ae multiple drivers. I mostly do slow takeoffs, coast to traffic lights and use cruise control highway and local.
It's been months now since the reset and mine is still shifting smooth.

 

[dlcorbett]

My Michelin Defender 22" tires are smooth as glass with CCD and stock shocks. The ride on smooth, bumpy, pretty much any road is flawless.
Regarding Trans shifting, reset your PCM so everything learns again. I did mine, because I bought it used, and it was jumping gears going from 2 to 5 or 6, jerking when slowing down. Now my Expedition shifts flawlessly and learned my driving habits.
This is especially important if there ae multiple drivers. I mostly do slow takeoffs, coast to traffic lights and use cruise control highway and local.
It's been months now since the reset and mine is still shifting smooth.

I concur. The base shocks hit harder on most bumps and seams, but are more comfortable on city streets becuz the ccd allows too much tire slap and motion in any mode but sport. Its worlds better on the hwy though. The air springs work beautifully in the pre refresh 3rd gens, idk why ford did away with them, especially since the 4th gens are notorious for eatin up shocks anyway so the air spring maintenance in a mute point. My 4th gen nav rides better than my 3rd gen holistically, but the 3rd gen handled bumps better esp repeated bumps.

 

[Dice Roll]

My Michelin Defender 22" tires are smooth as glass with CCD and stock shocks. The ride on smooth, bumpy, pretty much any road is flawless.
Regarding Trans shifting, reset your PCM so everything learns again. I did mine, because I bought it used, and it was jumping gears going from 2 to 5 or 6, jerking when slowing down. Now my Expedition shifts flawlessly and learned my driving habits.
This is especially important if there ae multiple drivers. I mostly do slow takeoffs, coast to traffic lights and use cruise control highway and local.
It's been months now since the reset and mine is still shifting smooth.

I’m talking about in sport mode, trans holds gears in crazy ways and I can take it for long. Only one stretch of road I use is even really worth using it for.

im basically the only driver this thing has ever seen since new.

 

[TheAngryOgre]

Bringing this to the top…
2021 Expedition XLT w/ 202 package, no CCD and 65k miles
- upgraded Hellwig bars front & back
- Bilstein 5100 shocks all around
- Michelin Defender LTX M/S on original Ford 20” wheels
- original struts all around and in good condition
- alignment and tire wear are good
- rarely tow

On smooth roads, it’s perfect. No roll in the corners and feels planted to the road. Could drive it forever.

For road bumps small and large, I feel it in my hands and teeth it’s that stiff in the front end. Especially with smaller stuff that make the front end “chatter”. Many roads have a lot of winter damage and they won’t be fixed any time soon.

Just paid the darn thing off and am going to keep it but I gotta make that front end behave better.

Options?
- Move down to 18” wheels?
- Strut replacement?
- Front shock only replacement?

On my 2000 Expy (many years ago), I ran Rancho RS9000 shocks on 17” wheels and Hellwig bars and the ride was perfect….loved that vehicle so much it made be by another one.

TIA

 

[Left Coast Geek]

i have CCD shocks and downgraded from the stock 22's to 18's, and even with the crappy stock tires (goodyear wrangler traveler at or something) from an f150 that came on the 18s, the ride is pretty good on rough roads. did 10000 miles all over Mexico last year, towing a trailer.

 

[keny01998]

I live in the city and the roads here are not to good, my 2019 expedition xlt (normal shocks) drives rough on the bumpy roads. Would the billstein 5100 help with this? Also would the hellwig rear sway bar help with the car moving side to side after riding over bumps?

The Bilstein 5100 will be rough than stocks. I'm regretting putting them on.

 

[Calidad]

Tires make a big difference. But in the end its a truck! Modifying the suspension will most definitely not improve the ride other than better quality shocks. I have the CCD system its definitely better than the standard shock regarding ride.
You didn’t say which wheel you have. The 22’s definitely can give a choppy ride especially on cheap old tires.
The 18’s with a really good quality tire can definitely give a smooth ride

 

[DieselMonk]

Bilstein 4600 = normal stock height and stock ride quality.
Bilstein 5100 = raised vehicle height and stiffer ride quality than stock.

 

[TheAngryOgre]

DM, I went to the Bilstien website and they only list the 5100's for my vehicle...no 4600 option. Definitely open to changed shocks if neeced
Calidad, I have the 20" OEM Ford black wheels that came with the new truck purchase. Seriously considering downsizing to 18" wheels if I can't improve things with a shock change or other adjustments.

 

[apex96]

@TheAngryOgre, if you can handle the price go with Icon. Height adjustable and the dampening rate is adjustable as well. They handle nicely and once loaded in a corner, feel very panted. The harshness I experienced with the 5100s is gone from the front.

I am still running 5100s in the rear but plan to swap them out this summer for the Icons.

Icon 0.75-2.25

Details: Icon Stage 1 Kit for 2014-2025 Ford Expedition 4WD, Part# K93301. Backed by Shock Surplus's hassle free Warranty program, Free Return option, Package Protection, and the best aftermarket service anywhere.

www.shocksurplus.com

 

[Left Coast Geek]

what pressure are you running in those 20s ? tire pressure, even a few PSI can make a drastic ride difference. Shop put 39 PSI in mine after a routine service (that's what it was originally with 22's, but I have 18s) and I couldn't wait to get home and drop them to 35 PSI again. I need to remember to ask that shop to put a note in my file to run 35 PSI, I'm sure they were going off the VIN, because I actually put a sticker over my tire inflation decal inside the door...

 

[TheAngryOgre]

@Left Coast Geek , running 35 psi on the tires all the way around.

@apex96 , thanks for the recommendation. Will check them out.