Project 2nd Gen Expy - NOPE, I’m boned

[Al Steel]

I picked up this 2nd Gen XLT, 150K miles, starts but doesn't run b/c of bad fuel pump. It hasn't driven more than 12 miles in 2 years. Interior is in great shape, exterior.. don't really care b/c I gotz plans but it has no accidents, just a little rust on the rockers and wheel wells.

Went to drop the tank to change the fuel pump (b/c Ford ) and well, I'll let the pics speak for themselves..

Drivers Rear frame facing forward



Passenger rear frame facing forward




And... ZOMG! Inside of rear frame, driver side..


Lastly.. passenger inside rear frame.

Pic of exterior that will be totally repainted something not red and gold(?).




So whaddya think? Salvageable or a total loss, destined to be picked clean by eBay vultures?

 

[riphip]

JUST A little RUST

Probably be a great deal as long as you don't drive it. Someone in your family drive a rollback? Keep that # for ICE

Outside looks real good

 

[Al Steel]

Yeah, just a little rust... so fixable or sell it for parts?? Going to see if I can get a welder to look at it. Anyone have experience with a repair of this kind of issue?

 

[riphip]

Frame is about gone for me. Nothing to weld to. Just my observation. You may find some of the same when parts start coming off.

 

[Plati]

lots of parts all over the place fail continuously when it looks FUGLY like that
waste of money to attempt mitigation
plan on unreliable and constant repair
YMMV

how do i know?


however, i fix a lot of easy things myself (or disable and forget) and it keeps running so i'm milking it for all she's worth. Engine and tranny and brakes and tires and steering are GREAT!!

 

[Hamfisted]

That wouldn't even pass state safety inspections anyway, would it ? I don't know if you can get a shop to weld some plate steel to that. That looks like a job for "backyard welder man" LOL ....

 

[sjwelds]

I don't think I'd touch it if it came to my welding shop...

 

[Al Steel]

lots of parts all over the place fail continuously when it looks FUGLY like that
waste of money to attempt mitigation.. plan on unreliable and constant repair.. YMMV

however, i fix a lot of easy things myself (or disable and forget) and it keeps running so i'm milking it for all she's worth. Engine and tranny and brakes and tires and steering are GREAT!!

Wow! That's rough. I think you got it a little worse than mine. Fuel pump goes in today so I'll know what shape the drive and power train are in. If they are good I'll have to weigh my options at that point.​

That wouldn't even pass state safety inspections anyway, would it ? I don't know if you can get a shop to weld some plate steel to that. That looks like a job for "backyard welder man" LOL ....

No, the quarter sized hole in first pic would be enough to fail a VA State safety inspection.. they don't play around here. I got failed for no DOT stamp on a pair of side marker lights once... seriously. However, I'm not as concerned about failing inspection as I am about it actually being safe to drive. The frame looks and feels WEAK in those spots.. right where the rear suspension connects to it. Don't want to be cruising down the road at 70, hit an uneven bridge seam and BLAM! the whole rear end lets go sending me into a Ford Exploreresque roll.

Once I find out if it runs/shifts good I will go to work on the frame with a hammer and an angle grinder to see just how bad things are. If it's too far gone... well I'm not out much money and can probably recoup on the parts. Maybe I can find a donor vehicle that has a good frame but blown engine, etc. I have been calling around but nobody will do rusty frame repairs anymore. A sign of our overly litigious / lack of skilled trades society. I'll have to dust off the old welder if I can't get a shop to do it, then see if I can cut out enough of the cancer and still have enough frame left to weld to. Not sure... doesn't look good from where I'm sitting though.

I don't think I'd touch it if it came to my welding shop...

That's my experience so far. I have only found about 2 shops that will even take my calls on it. The rest won't touch rusty auto frames either. I'm sure a quote to have that mess fixed by anyone that would want to guarantee their work wouldn't go near it. BUUUT... I'm not looking for that.. I just need it to be good enough to pass inspection AND be relatively safe to drive on.

 

[Plati]

My rear frame looks great compared to yours. No holes at all. Look at where the radiator mounts too. I heard that commonly rusts out. I've never figured out exactly where since it seems buried and I cant see it but this might be where it rusts out. Looks pretty bad on mine. What is this thing? What does this do? Anybody know?

 

[Trainmaster]

You can probably drive it locally for quite awhile before something lets go, but when it does, it's junk. Or unload it now, get a few bucks if you need something safer and better.

 

[Al Steel]

UPDATE: Dropped in a fuel pump today and got to get real up close and personal with her undercarriage (heh heh!). It was bad, but nit as bad as I thought. I was able to grind some areas around the tank well down to bare metal, prime and undercoat. I did this because I’ll be DAMNED if I’ll ever do that job again! Ford engineers really get the Blue Falcon award for that fuel pump location and how you have to install a new one. I will not be repeating that task.

Anywho, I finished up the install, primed the system for about 10 sec and she started up on the second try! Woo hoo! It’s alive! Buuuut my joy soon turned to bitter disappointment because all of the vehicles ills were laid bare. I’ll spare the horrid details but bottom line, it’s a parts vehicle.

Allow me to elaborate.
- Exhaust leak, pre cat. Puffing noise, could be a exhaust manifold gasket or hole.
- Brakes - this is the worst. Feels like at least one caliper is dragging and brake warning light is on. When under the truck I noticed a hacked job on the left rear brake line. Instead of purchasing a proper fabricated replacement, Joe Backyard made a homebuild line and routed it terribly. Plus the repair was leaking near the rear brake. Alo, he left the old line still on the truck!
- Slight low end knock - it quieted down a bit after it warmed up but it was still there.
- Rough idle after warmUp - could be bad gas, clogged injectors from sitting, could be a bad plug. Not sure but wluld be a pita to run down.
- and don’t forget the rear frame being a mess.

add all this up and it Just isn’t financially viable so it’s probably going to be a parts car. Very disappointed right now.

 

[RichardH]

Thanks for the update. You didn't mention how much you picked it up for $$ wise but mentioned interior was great.

I really like my 2003 EB 2wd 5.4. I paid $4k for it. Add in at least $3K in repairs and preventive maintenance. I have another $400 or so to go but I would be comfortable driving this across the country if I needed to (now). I gave it a lot of thought about buying a newer one for more $$, but as with any used car you can buy someone else's problems. I also liked the fact that it has 9.75" rear diff and mechanical limited slip - not electronic. This truck is killer exterior and interior. In 2019 it had only 144K miles. Engine/drivetrain fine, just some electrical 'niggles'.

Here is an exterior pic:



Anyhow, I'm sure you can find a deal on a mechanically sound one for not too much.

If I had the space I would consider picking up a donor 2003 EB 2wd for parts - that's a no-go currently.

I guess there are 3 options:

1. keep it as donor truck for your next XLT,
2. start pulling parts and selling on evilbay or craigslist, or
3. flip it to someone and disclose the condition of the truck.

Number 3 could be the quickest and fetch the 2nd place in $$. Number 1 could be useful for the interior parts and save a few $$ on spiffing up another XLT. Number 2 sounds like one option that can fetch the most bang for the buck but it will take time and effort.

I guess a fourth option is to pull some parts (Interior, fuse box/relay junction box, parts of the harness/battery cables - some NLA, the 'brains' of the truck, radio, etc) and sell to a scrap yard.

Good luck. Let us know what you decide to do. I'm sort of curious in case I am ever in the same boat down the road.

 

[Al Steel]

Well I guess I can't complain too much because the purchase price was $1000.00 when you add in towing, a new fuel pump, and other incidentals. The thing that it is really upsetting is that the seller said that it was checked out by a "mechanic friend" and it was in good condition, "just needs a fuel pump". So I'm not keen on being lied to. I'm going to call the seller out on it today. I KNOW... I should have known that a cheap Expy would have had some undisclosed/unknown issues but at least I thought it would be somewhat usable. Spending $4K+ in repairs just to get this on the road is not possible. It's is a giant white elephant sitting in front my house now.

If anyone in the DC area needs a donor '03 it's all yours for a very low price. I'm going to post it up in BST and hopefully someone needs the parts.

Full disclosure, here's my abbreviated list of what I can see is wrong with it, there could be more!:

Engine/Powertrain
- Starts easily, runs at high idle fine, but when it warms up it idles rough. Will hold idle but doesn't recover well, acts like it want to cut off. Plugs?
- Very audible exhaust leak noise on drivers side, pre-cat. could be manifold, exhaust gasket, or connecting pipe break or rust through. "Chuffs" loudly when you press on the gas.
- Reduced power on acceleration, could be the exhaust leak robbing power or a sticking brake caliper.
- What sounds like rod knock on the lower driver's side but could be the exhaust leak if it's bad enough. Not sure, but the rough idle after warm up is leading me to worn rods, which could mean the engine is almost shot.

Drivetrain
- Rear axle driveshaft seal is leaking.
- Occasional Wobbly (?) feel in the wheels when driving. Could be flat spot in the wheels from sitting so long or could be out of balance.
Electrical
- Driver's window switch is sticky. Takes a few tries to get the button to work rolling up.
- Driver's seat won't lower. Could be switch or motor.
- Alternator looks like it's over-charging slightly... gauge reads a little above centerline which is something I've never seen before. Not sure why that's happening.

Brakes
- ** Completely unsafe to drive ** Will need a complete brake system overhaul! Possibly including new brake lines, booster, ABS. Brake pedal does not feel right.
- Non-professional repair on drivers rear brake line. Leaks BADLY. I topped off the fluid and in a short 1 mile test drive ALL the reservoir was almost empty.
- Sticking caliper(s) - Feels like the engine was fighting the brakes on the test drive. Almost like I was driving with the parking brake on.
- Brake Warning indicator light is illuminated on the dash. Probably because it's detecting loss of brake pressure.

Body
- Moderate rust thru in rear frame - see pics above - will not pass safety inspection. Will need professional welding to repair.
- Moderate rust in wheel well edges.
- Moderate rust on driver's side rocker panel.
- Paint peeling on lower plastic trim panels.
- All windshield wipers will need replacing.

The good news is that the transmission and drive train APPEAR to be in good shape.
- No noticeable issues on test drive. Shifts smoothly into all gears. No grinding or clunking

- 4WD operates. Shifts into all 4WD modes and rides smoothly, no grinding or clunking

Everything on the car works. All the electronic gadgets work, windows go up and down, locks function, and the interior is in great shape. No smell or bad stains, only the driver seat has a tear on the side.​

So that's about it, I don't plan to spend much more time on it. Look for this in BST later today, it will go as-is. If it doesn't sell as a donor car then I will likely try to find out what the salvage price will be. Has to go soon so it doesn't get a ticket. I'd part it, but it would have to sit in my driveway (won't really fit in the garage), in town, under a tarp because no unregistered/tagged vehicles are allowed on residential streets or visible on private property. Plus the wifey isn't happy about it, and.. you know... happy wife, happy life.. I like to keep it that way!

 

[Hamfisted]

I'd just call a salvage yard and see if they want it for the doors and glass ( and fuel tank...) if that's useable. Really, nobody's gonna want that thing sitting in front of their house either. A salvage yard may not even want it the way it is.

 

[Trainmaster]

Around here, they fetch $300 for scrap if they have the aluminum wheels. Mine had an external head gasket oil leak with 265,000 miles and I couldn't give it away.

 

[Brandon K]

Sell parts off it until you run out of easy $, then scrap it.

 

[RichardH]

Sell parts off it until you run out of easy $, then scrap it.

Yes. If you were local and it was EB with good interior as you mentioned I would buy parts from you. I think BrandonK's idea is a good one as I mentioned also.

I'd remove some of the parts I mentioned on a previous post and sell.

 

[Plati]

This guy would probably buy your parking brake parts ....
https://www.expeditionforum.com/threads/parking-brake-help-discontinued-part.44925/

 

[Aspen03]

Just sell it. That's a long list of things, you could buy a drivable one for half of what you'll spend in repairs.

I paid $3100 for mine in spring of '19. Almost new tires, had all service records,, and everything worked except rear pass window. Still runs great today. More miles of course but as you can see low miles means nothing in terms of overall condition.

 

[Davec_va]

That is one long list of repairs...And in Northern Virginia?!?! yeah- that'll pass inspection up there LOL!

I was looking for Expy's up there and a lot of people said many dealers buy from NJ/MA/NY - all those heavy snow states. Lots of rusted out Expy's and Navi's up there.

I've got a 2000 Navi that's got quite a bit of rust under it. Not quite as bad as yours but, not worth repairing either. I'm thinking about yanking the 5.4 DOHC and 4R100 out of it and saving them for a rainy day. (Or maybe a non-rusty Expy build...)