Bedrck47
Full Access Members
I'll let the teacher explain that one
Power windows won't work
- Thread starter joeytforrest
- Start date
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stamp11127
Full Access Members
Continuity is mainly used for checking the integrity of circuit wiring that has low resistance. Your meters specs should give you the threshold for when it tones and when it doesn't.
The reading on the scale is what matters - as long as it isn't "OL" you have some form of continuity.
Real world application: Your fat, laying on your back, your belly is in the way while you are working up under the dash of a schoolbus looking for a broken wire. Since the meter is in a place you can't see (on your belly), that tone comes in handy once you have made connection at each end of a wire. Other times I just watch the display.
The reading on the scale is what matters - as long as it isn't "OL" you have some form of continuity.
Real world application: Your fat, laying on your back, your belly is in the way while you are working up under the dash of a schoolbus looking for a broken wire. Since the meter is in a place you can't see (on your belly), that tone comes in handy once you have made connection at each end of a wire. Other times I just watch the display.
joeytforrest
Active Member
Other than the school bus, your description sounds awfully familiar!
Okay - My woefully uneducated analysis is that I have power interruption between the relay and the 30A circuit breaker. Again from a novice perspective, this could be due to either the ground part of the circuit or the power. I don't really get this because when we jumped 30 to 87, all systems were go.
Am I way off base? Do I need to now visually inspect the circuit board?
Okay - My woefully uneducated analysis is that I have power interruption between the relay and the 30A circuit breaker. Again from a novice perspective, this could be due to either the ground part of the circuit or the power. I don't really get this because when we jumped 30 to 87, all systems were go.
Am I way off base? Do I need to now visually inspect the circuit board?
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Bedrck47
Full Access Members
joeytforrest
Active Member
Thank you for the diagram, Bedrck. Google had nothing and service department at Ford wasn't helpful either.
**I failed to identify this earlier. When I jump 30 to 87, master switch in driver's door and power moon roof operates normally BUT all other door power window switches remain apparently powerless.
**I failed to identify this earlier. When I jump 30 to 87, master switch in driver's door and power moon roof operates normally BUT all other door power window switches remain apparently powerless.
stamp11127
Full Access Members
The interruption is on the ground side of the circuit, you have proven that there is power to the relay on both the control circuit(86) and the load circuit(30).
Unfortunately the ground is controlled by a microprocessor located in the smart junction box(sjb). It has some electrical "intelligence" and will shut down a circuit if faults are detected. The smart junction box is also on the medium speed controller network so the local Joe really can't do anything since it takes a high end scanner to retrieve the DTC's for that sjb and determine what has happened to cause the shutdown.
Before attempting a work around, look at all the bells and buzzers on the Expy and see if anything else has failed or not working:
Keypad Illumination
Brake Shift Interlock
3rd Row Seat Enable
Tire Pressure Monitor System
Front Turn Lamps
Rear Turn Lamps
Stop Lamps
High and Low beams
Interior Lighting
Floor Lamp
Puddle Lamps
White Light
Backlighting LED
Door Lock Relay
Lift Gate Relay
Fog Lamp Relay
Park Lamp Relay
Horn Relay
Battery Saver Relay (check glove box light - should come on & go out after a set time @5-10 minutes)
A work a round will require removing, opening the sjb and inspecting for obvious failures and posting high resolution pics of both sides of the board. If you are not adventurous enough to do this then it is off to the dealer.
Unfortunately the ground is controlled by a microprocessor located in the smart junction box(sjb). It has some electrical "intelligence" and will shut down a circuit if faults are detected. The smart junction box is also on the medium speed controller network so the local Joe really can't do anything since it takes a high end scanner to retrieve the DTC's for that sjb and determine what has happened to cause the shutdown.
Before attempting a work around, look at all the bells and buzzers on the Expy and see if anything else has failed or not working:
Keypad Illumination
Brake Shift Interlock
3rd Row Seat Enable
Tire Pressure Monitor System
Front Turn Lamps
Rear Turn Lamps
Stop Lamps
High and Low beams
Interior Lighting
Floor Lamp
Puddle Lamps
White Light
Backlighting LED
Door Lock Relay
Lift Gate Relay
Fog Lamp Relay
Park Lamp Relay
Horn Relay
Battery Saver Relay (check glove box light - should come on & go out after a set time @5-10 minutes)
A work a round will require removing, opening the sjb and inspecting for obvious failures and posting high resolution pics of both sides of the board. If you are not adventurous enough to do this then it is off to the dealer.
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stamp11127
Full Access Members
When jumped, the master switch will power all the windows?
Also check the lockout setting on the master switch.
Service departments are in business to make money remember...
Also check the lockout setting on the master switch.
Service departments are in business to make money remember...
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joeytforrest
Active Member
A most excellent response, Stamp, and I really thank you for your thoroughness... Bedrck too!
Disregard my comment about only master switch working... i had the power window lock enabled.. oops!
I will take a second look at the list. I know just from working on this the past week that most of the items you listed work but I'll confirm.
Not sure if I'm adventurous enough but I will think about it. I've already removed the sjb once but didn't take it apart.
I'll confirm the items are working and then post whether I'll continue to troubleshoot.
Thanks again to both of you...
Disregard my comment about only master switch working... i had the power window lock enabled.. oops!
I will take a second look at the list. I know just from working on this the past week that most of the items you listed work but I'll confirm.
Not sure if I'm adventurous enough but I will think about it. I've already removed the sjb once but didn't take it apart.
I'll confirm the items are working and then post whether I'll continue to troubleshoot.
Thanks again to both of you...
Bedrck47
Full Access Members
If you do take it to the dealer I would let them know all that you have done. At least that will give them the impression that you at least know something and maybe stop them from giving you a line of BULL But see if stamp agrees with this
No mater what you do please take the time to give some feedback when the problem is solved
No mater what you do please take the time to give some feedback when the problem is solved
stamp11127
Full Access Members
I'll give you some motivation, try $500+ to diagnose, install and program a new sjb.
Depending on how tight it is inside the sjb the modification can be easily done or if it is very tight a royal pia. That is why we would need to see the layout of the printed circuit board on both sides. Quoting Dirty Hairy "do you feel lucky today?"
You can make the modification as simple as adding a switch to control the ground or adding a relay that turns the ground on when the ignition is in run or acc.
I'm hoping you will open it up so we can have images of the board(s) to work with in the future.
Depending on how tight it is inside the sjb the modification can be easily done or if it is very tight a royal pia. That is why we would need to see the layout of the printed circuit board on both sides. Quoting Dirty Hairy "do you feel lucky today?"
You can make the modification as simple as adding a switch to control the ground or adding a relay that turns the ground on when the ignition is in run or acc.
I'm hoping you will open it up so we can have images of the board(s) to work with in the future.
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