How does this setup look for weight distribution...anyone able to get no sag on rear?

[Rosko]

Hi all. I spent the better part of the afternoon transferring my Equalizer 4 point sway/dist hitch from my 3/4 ton Yukon to my 2017 expedition EL.

I never felt like I was able to reduce the squat on the back enough...if I setup the WDH to put more weight to the front of the Expy, it would just lower the front end too much and the rear wouldn't raise up. I ended up settling on about 1/2" to 3/4" squat in the rear, and the front remained about the same height as unloaded.

I'm guessing the IRS is just going to be setup this way...and I probably won't be able to get the rear to have zero squat (without passengers).

 

[shane_th_ee]

If I setup the WDH to put more weight to the front of the Expy, it would just lower the front end too much and the rear wouldn't raise up...
I'm guessing the IRS is just going to be setup this way...and I probably won't be able to get the rear to have zero squat (without passengers).

Are you expecting the rear of the expedition not to settle at all when you attach the trailer to it? Or am I reading something incorrectly? And do you have the auto-leveling suspension in yours?

 

[coolzzy]

That looks correct to me. My expy squats the same amount in the rear with my wdh setup correctly and has no change in height at the front wheels. The IRS is a bit squirly in windy situations on the highway compared to a solid rear axle. I'll be looking at a firmer sidewall tire for next season, the oem tires are very soft in the sidewalls even when running max inflation pressure.

 

[Rosko]

Are you expecting the rear of the expedition not to settle at all when you attach the trailer to it? Or am I reading something incorrectly? And do you have the auto-leveling suspension in yours?

Hi Shane. Yes, while I was basically unloaded in the Expedition I was hoping to just get it corrected to not squat at all with the WDH setup, then when I load my family in there it'll squat some.

I think it'll just have to do the way it is, I have the limited without the auto leveling shocks. I could get some air support but I'm not sure it's really worth it yet.

 

[Rosko]

That looks correct to me. My expy squats the same amount in the rear with my wdh setup correctly and has no change in height at the front wheels. The IRS is a bit squirly in windy situations on the highway compared to a solid rear axle. I'll be looking at a firmer sidewall tire for next season, the oem tires are very soft in the sidewalls even when running max inflation pressure.

Yeah compared to my old 2004 3/4 ton Yukon XL, the expedition wiggles a lot more in my testing on the interstate.....but it's so much more comfortable/powerful/better braking I think I can live with it (time will tell).

My old Yukon is a beast though, I've taken this trailer to Yellowstone through Wyoming winds, passing big rigs at 65mph with insane winds and it never budged....was so solid. I'll just have to get used to the wiggle again (I had a Sequoia at one point with the IRS wiggle).

 

[shane_th_ee]

Hi Shane. Yes, while I was basically unloaded in the Expedition I was hoping to just get it corrected to not squat at all with the WDH setup, then when I load my family in there it'll squat some.

I think it'll just have to do the way it is, I have the limited without the auto leveling shocks. I could get some air support but I'm not sure it's really worth it yet.

Aren't you adding many hundreds of pounds to the truck when you hitch up the trailer (aka, the tongue weight)? Sure, the WDH will move some weight back to the trailer and some to the front axle, but the "goal" of the WDH is to split the tongue weight between the steering and drive axles. Which means you'll have added a significant weight to the rear axle (1/3-1/2 of the trailer's tongue weight). Maybe that wasn't enough to compress the 3/4 ton suspension on your old Yukon, but it's going to compress your new 1/2 ton suspension. My recommendation would be doing a 3-pass weigh of your rig on your way out of town when you go camping the next time...

 

[Rosko]

Aren't you adding many hundreds of pounds to the truck when you hitch up the trailer (aka, the tongue weight)? Sure, the WDH will move some weight back to the trailer and some to the front axle, but the "goal" of the WDH is to split the tongue weight between the steering and drive axles. Which means you'll have added a significant weight to the rear axle (1/3-1/2 of the trailer's tongue weight). Maybe that wasn't enough to compress the 3/4 ton suspension on your old Yukon, but it's going to compress your new 1/2 ton suspension. My recommendation would be doing a 3-pass weigh of your rig on your way out of town when you go camping the next time...

Thanks Shane. I'm assuming by 3 pass you mean....weighing my expedition with gas/kids/cargo by itself, then weighing the trailer uncoupled and loaded, then weighing them both together on the cat scale to get how it distributes weights on the 3 sets of axles? That is my plan, though I'm not sure when I'll get around to it with school almost starting here for the kids.

The Yukon actually squatted an inch or two unloaded too...but it starts out so high it was a different animal. It helps to have 5 heavy duty leaf springs in the back over a straight axle . I think the cargo limit on the Yukon is 1000lbs more than the Expedition, and the axles can handle a bit more weight too (obviously)....but it rides like a box of rocks compared to the expedition LOL.

 

[shane_th_ee]

Thanks Shane. I'm assuming by 3 pass you mean....weighing my expedition with gas/kids/cargo by itself, then weighing the trailer uncoupled and loaded, then weighing them both together on the cat scale to get how it distributes weights on the 3 sets of axles?

Close. You want to weigh the Expedition with wife/kids/cargo/trailer/everything just like you'd tow to go camping. And you want to use a real CAT scale so you can get all 3 axle weights (steer, drive, and trailer) at the same time. Then you want to disconnect the spring bars and weigh the whole thing again. Finally, drop the trailer and weigh just the truck with everything and everyone in it. From there you can figure out trailer weight, actual tongue weight and what the WDH is actually doing (or not doing).

 

[Rosko]

Close. You want to weigh the Expedition with wife/kids/cargo/trailer/everything just like you'd tow to go camping. And you want to use a real CAT scale so you can get all 3 axle weights (steer, drive, and trailer) at the same time. Then you want to disconnect the spring bars and weigh the whole thing again. Finally, drop the trailer and weigh just the truck with everything and everyone in it. From there you can figure out trailer weight, actual tongue weight and what the WDH is actually doing (or not doing).

Yeah it should be a fun exercise. When I just weighted our entire setup at the CAT scale last time with the Yukon, I only weighed everything together with the 3 axles. I was able to at least figure out if I was overloading the rear axle, but it would be better to know how much the bars are actually working like you mentioned....though the front axle limit is usually lower than the rear anyway.

If I had to guess, I'm not going to be able to change my bars/hitch to get it setup much better because the front end will drop with any more torquing. But it will be nice to understand how to load the trailer/where I need to pack things to make sure I'm not overloading the rear axle.

Thanks!

 

[8131full]

Hi all. I spent the better part of the afternoon transferring my Equalizer 4 point sway/dist hitch from my 3/4 ton Yukon to my 2017 expedition EL.

I never felt like I was able to reduce the squat on the back enough...if I setup the WDH to put more weight to the front of the Expy, it would just lower the front end too much and the rear wouldn't raise up. I ended up settling on about 1/2" to 3/4" squat in the rear, and the front remained about the same height as unloaded.

I'm guessing the IRS is just going to be setup this way...and I probably won't be able to get the rear to have zero squat (without passengers).

View attachment 26145 View attachment 26146

Whats that trailer weigh fully loaded (or at least how you go down the road)? Looks big!

 

[Rosko]

Whats that trailer weigh fully loaded (or at least how you go down the road)? Looks big!

It's a pretty light trailer really, only 5670 dry weight. I'll know what exactly it is fully loaded here soon, but my previous numbers were just over 14,000 including the trailer loaded, yukon XL loaded with kids/gas and everything (paddle boards, raft, generator, food....etc).

Just a ballpark I'm guessing we max out around 7000lbs loaded, maybe a little bit over. It's a longer trailer, just over 33ft. My Yukon tows it through terrible Wyoming winds just fine, but I'm guessing the expy won't do so well with the wiggle.

 

[CaptOchs]

2003 XLT 5.4 w/ 2018 Keystone SpringDale 270LE, (7000# empty / 830 lb tongue / Reese Dual Cam WD.)

I had some squat and really bad sway. I recently dropped my rig off at the RV place to readjust the WD. There was some adjustments done to my WD to correct some sway I had. Basically the head was tilted down (trailer end) to lower the bars on trailer. That put more weight towards the end of the bar where the friction to prevent sway happens. They increased my air from 32lbs to 42lbs to stiffen up the tires. He recommended inflating tires to what's on the door sticker. Both changes helped, but the ultimate fix would be a suspension upgrade. It's an older truck with over 150k so not if that will happen or not.

Aside from the squat, how is it handling?

 

[Rosko]

2003 XLT 5.4 w/ 2018 Keystone SpringDale 270LE, (7000# empty / 830 lb tongue / Reese Dual Cam WD.)

I had some squat and really bad sway. I recently dropped my rig off at the RV place to readjust the WD. There was some adjustments done to my WD to correct some sway I had. Basically the head was tilted down (trailer end) to lower the bars on trailer. That put more weight towards the end of the bar where the friction to prevent sway happens. They increased my air from 32lbs to 42lbs to stiffen up the tires. He recommended inflating tires to what's on the door sticker. Both changes helped, but the ultimate fix would be a suspension upgrade. It's an older truck with over 150k so not if that will happen or not.

Aside from the squat, how is it handling?

I took it on a drive Sunday up i-70 from just north of Denver, over i-70 and down to Silverthorne. It handled pretty well considering the IRS. It definitely didn't handle the sway nearly as well as my old 3/4 ton Yukon, but I expected that. Overall, it handled the rest of the bumps a lot better. It performed better than I expected in most categories, so I can't complain too much .

I think the head of my WDH already has about 7 washers in it, which is on the higher end. That points it down quite a bit and adds that anti-sway friction to the head and to the end of the bars. I could maybe do one more washer, we'll have to see.

 

[Jon 15el]

I just ordered super spring sumo helpers for my coil rear suspension. Ill let you know if it helps.

 

[Jon 15el]

I put these in before our last trip. Ride height appears to be the same. No change in ride quality when unloaded. Very noticeable change in ride while towing. Much more stable, way less back end bounce.

 

[ChapPcemkr]

Jon 15el, what year is your exp? What size Coil Sumo Springs did you order? I have an 03 Exp XLT. I am thinking about getting a set of sumos but not sure what to get. Does anybody know?

 

[RustyOval]

I took it on a drive Sunday up i-70 from just north of Denver, over i-70 and down to Silverthorne. It handled pretty well considering the IRS. It definitely didn't handle the sway nearly as well as my old 3/4 ton Yukon, but I expected that. Overall, it handled the rest of the bumps a lot better. It performed better than I expected in most categories, so I can't complain too much .

I think the head of my WDH already has about 7 washers in it, which is on the higher end. That points it down quite a bit and adds that anti-sway friction to the head and to the end of the bars. I could maybe do one more washer, we'll have to see.

I put eight washers in my Equalizer, it made a big difference. The manual reads seven max, but eight really makes the tow much more stable.

 

[johnboneske]

Yeah compared to my old 2004 3/4 ton Yukon XL, the expedition wiggles a lot more in my testing on the interstate.....but it's so much more comfortable/powerful/better braking I think I can live with it (time will tell).

My old Yukon is a beast though, I've taken this trailer to Yellowstone through Wyoming winds, passing big rigs at 65mph with insane winds and it never budged....was so solid. I'll just have to get used to the wiggle again (I had a Sequoia at one point with the IRS wiggle).

Do what I did... sell your Expedition and get an Excursion diesel! I found a 2003 6.0 that's studded Excursion in Tennessee with no rust, amazing condition, for next to nothing. Pulls our new 38' 9500 pound travel trailer like it's not even there.